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-   -   Any lockdown relaxation in your area ? (https://britishexpats.com/forum/italy-77/any-lockdown-relaxation-your-area-932273/)

Plan B Apr 18th 2020 10:48 am

Any lockdown relaxation in your area ?
 
Ah, the joys of going to the local tip that's re-opened - along with dozens of others! 2 hours that little bit of liberty took.
(Anyone else find they've got a flat battery :()
How about the relaxation of the lockdown, or not, in others' areas?

philat98 Apr 18th 2020 12:54 pm

Re: Any lockdown relaxation in your area ?
 
My neighbours are busy with DIY (plastering, painting, sanding, drilling, power washing, pruning, lawn mowing....) during the day and then at 6pm the karaoke machine comes out. A decent pair of headphones comes in very useful. Roll on Fase 2.
I hope their jobs are not furloughed.

brendan02 Apr 18th 2020 1:30 pm

Re: Any lockdown relaxation in your area ?
 
Here in Lucca the police are everywhere and handing out fines left, right and centre, for the slightest infraction. I got one for riding my bicycle to the supermarket - the capo of the polizia municipale said he didn't believe I was genuinely going to do my food shopping....

There is a problem in the drafting of the decreto. 'Proven necessity' isn't defined - proven to whom? and against what criteria? In practice it all depends on the police officer who stops you - if you get a bad one you will get a fine and there's not much you can do about it..

Margaret M Apr 18th 2020 2:07 pm

Re: Any lockdown relaxation in your area ?
 
No relaxation in our area.

philat98 Apr 18th 2020 2:27 pm

Re: Any lockdown relaxation in your area ?
 

Originally Posted by brendan02 (Post 12840500)

There is a problem in the drafting of the decreto. 'Proven necessity' isn't defined - proven to whom? and against what criteria? In practice it all depends on the police officer who stops you - if you get a bad one you will get a fine and there's not much you can do about it..

They have a viewers Q&A every night on TG3. The answer is always No.
Yesterday a student asked if she could drive from Montone to Feltrinelli in Perugia to buy a book and the answer was surprisingly Yes.
A less fortunate woman in Spoleto walked her dog 500m and was fined for exceeding the 200m limit after the police measured the distance back to her house.

Plan B Apr 18th 2020 7:21 pm

Re: Any lockdown relaxation in your area ?
 
:lol::lol:

Plan B Apr 18th 2020 7:27 pm

Re: Any lockdown relaxation in your area ?
 
Jeez, these examples of petty officialdom are so depressing. What does happen if you say

No, I'm not going to pay that unfair fine.?
You are allowed to go out to buy food; you don't have to prove food is a necessity.

Serrano Apr 18th 2020 10:25 pm

Re: Any lockdown relaxation in your area ?
 

Originally Posted by Plan B (Post 12840684)
Jeez, these examples of petty officialdom are so depressing. What does happen if you say "No, I'm not going to pay that unfair fine."?
You are allowed to go out to buy food; you don't have to prove food is a necessity.

Well the direct answer is that you will find Equitalia on your case - not to be recommended, and neither is it the correct course of action. If you are given a fine, there will be an appeals process. If you consider it unreasonable then that is what you should do. Simply not paying it will just add another wrong to the situation. The appeals process probably depends on which of the 'police' issues the fine (obviously the Polizia Municipale, Polizia Regionale, Police di Stato and Carabinieri - but round here I have seen the Guardia della Finanza doing checks and have heard that even the Guardia Forestale can be involved). I've probably forgotten a few others ;).

But whatever you do, if you feel that you have grounds for appeal, do it straight away to the competent authorities.

Oh, and while I'm ranting, I have little sympathy for the woman from Spoleto. You don't have to be Einstein to know the difference between 200 and 500 metres. And as for the Police checking, obviously they have to document the actual distance to defend against any possible appeal ...

philat98 Apr 19th 2020 7:27 am

Re: Any lockdown relaxation in your area ?
 
It would have been more useful if the Mayor of Bergamo had prevented his 50,0000 football supporters from travelling to Milan rather than penalizing dog walkers in Spoleto.
I bet in a few years we will all have those mobile apps that check what you are doing.

Lorna at Vicenza Apr 19th 2020 9:40 am

Re: Any lockdown relaxation in your area ?
 
My 16yr old got stopped the other Saturday. There he was walking along on his own wearing his mask when a police car flipped its sirens on and pulled up next to him. Scared him half to death. “Where are you going ragazzo?”

----- Mum sent me to the shop for fresh milk and stuff.

“Tell the truth. It’s a lovely day. You’re on the road to the park aren’t you?”

-----To the shop for my mum.

“Where do you live?”

----- In the Quartiere.

“What Quartiere?”

----- Just behind this street. It’s just there behind me.

“Oh really? Anybody at home right now?”

-----Yeah, my mum is obviously at home.

“Take us there. Walk us there if you are so close. We’ll follow you.”

They followed him. Him walking. Them by car. Alex got home and rang the citofono/doorbell : Mum come down please, the police are here. They want to speak to you. ------ Are you ****ing kidding me? It’s not April’s Fool now you know. ---- Mum – properly, come down. I’m serious. And so I left my house, braless, in my big, floppy old fleece, baggy pants and big old socks and slippers. I got close to my gate and was told to “alto là - stay right there Signora” from the parked up carabiniere car. They stayed in the car with the window only halfway down.

Keep your distance Signora.

----- Yes I am, sure. I know the rules.

“Do you know your son is out on the streets?”

------ Yes. I sent him to the shop.

“Which one?”

------That one over there, the shop across the square. “Your son doesn’t have any shopping. Where is his shopping? Do you know the rules Signora? Do you?”

------- He only bloody well left the house 5 minutes ago when the shop opened at 4pm. It’s not like he has been gone for 2 hours and yes I know the rules. Look at me. Do I look like a Signora that leaves the house? I have a daughter trapped in Australia and a whole family in England. I spend my days telling them the rules and to stay at home.

“Australia! Sorry about your daughter Mrs, but your son was out on Main St. Let him walk the square and that's it. Capisce? Understood. Your own front doorstep and nothing else. No sanctions or fines this time but beware.” Yes – thank you – good day – buona giornata, grazie mille …… ALEX – WE STILL DON’T HAVE ANY MILK DO WE? Please Mr Policeman – milk?

Of course hardly anybody has been out in the square for a bloody month, but that Saturday afternoon all the ******* neighbours had a reason to be at their front gate or the rubbish bins or their little veggie plots to see who the police had come for!

The stay on your own front doorstep or not more than 200m has just been lifted here but you still can't go further than just around your own block so to speak and always with a mask and gloves.


philat98 Apr 19th 2020 9:47 am

Re: Any lockdown relaxation in your area ?
 
It makes you wonder what all these police were doing before the pandemic.:unsure:

Lorna at Vicenza Apr 19th 2020 9:55 am

Re: Any lockdown relaxation in your area ?
 

Originally Posted by philat98 (Post 12840879)
It makes you wonder what all these police were doing before the pandemic.:unsure:

Adjusting their tackle and posing in expensive sunglasses?

Serrano Apr 19th 2020 10:18 am

Re: Any lockdown relaxation in your area ?
 

Originally Posted by philat98 (Post 12840856)
It would have been more useful if the Mayor of Bergamo had prevented his 50,0000 football supporters from travelling to Milan rather than penalizing dog walkers in Spoleto.

Undoubtedly true as far as it goes. But absolutely a false comparison. I think your hindsight is being unrealistic, are you seriously suggesting that the mayor of Bergamo should have had been able to predict that the first confirmed cases in the area would break out 3 days later (when at that point there were only 3 confirmed cases in the entire country)? And under what authority would he therefore have banned these people from travelling (even were it practicable to do so)? And who would he ask to reimburse the fans (50,000 at say €20 gives you €1 million)?


Originally Posted by philat98 (Post 12840856)
I bet in a few years we will all have those mobile apps that check what you are doing.

Almost certainly yes, for better or for worse. It would be nice to think that such surveillance powers would be used for good purposes; regrettably history indicates otherwise.

philat98 Apr 19th 2020 5:40 pm

Re: Any lockdown relaxation in your area ?
 

Originally Posted by Lorna at Vicenza (Post 12840881)
Adjusting their tackle and posing in expensive sunglasses?

A few years ago a gang of robbers arrived in our village in the middle of the night. The broke into a row of houses with the occupants asleep in bed and stole the cars standing outside and anything else they could get their hands on. The police arrived about 12 hours later and said the robbers were gypsies and there was nothing to be done.
Personally I have found the police in Umbria to be very polite.


carcajou Apr 25th 2020 7:53 am

Re: Any lockdown relaxation in your area ?
 
My relatives say, not where they are, at least not right now. But maybe in a few weeks.


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