India and the Wars

Old Feb 9th 2019, 6:08 am
  #286  
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Default Re: India and the Wars

Originally Posted by EMR
Indians were Indians when they were not, your husband is not a migrant even though officially in the UK he is.
It's no wonder you are such hard work yo debate with.

After post after post after post accusing the Portuguese of one thing after another, when pointed out to you that they behaved no differently than did the inhabitants and jnvadets of the sub continent did , now it's just because they did not leave.
Do you realise just how silly you look sometimes.
EMR it is more silly not to get someone to read posts for you.

I said what the "Portuguese did not do in 1962"----yes the actual mistake was that I should have said 1961.

'To migrate' is a verb, I said correctly my husband did not "migrate" to the UK.

Indians were not Indians?????? Look up the words 'Sindhu', 'Indus' 'Bharat' all refer to 'India' ----I would have thought even you would agree that people living in India were Indians!!!!



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Old Feb 9th 2019, 8:28 am
  #287  
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Default Re: India and the Wars

Originally Posted by Bipat
EMR it is more silly not to get someone to read posts for you.

I said what the "Portuguese did not do in 1962"----yes the actual mistake was that I should have said 1961.

'To migrate' is a verb, I said correctly my husband did not "migrate" to the UK.

Indians were not Indians?????? Look up the words 'Sindhu', 'Indus' 'Bharat' all refer to 'India' ----I would have thought even you would agree that people living in India were Indians!!!!
Does not mean that he is not a migrant and that you owe everything good that has happened to you, your marriage, children , grandchildren to what the British dud in India.
Game set and match I hink..
Do you mean, Greek or Persian words for the people's who lived beyond the Indus.
A foreign word adopted by Foreigners to describe those living in the sub continent...
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Old Feb 17th 2019, 5:38 am
  #288  
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Default Re: India and the Wars

Originally Posted by Bipat
Does any nationality have an 'overall culture'. If he wasn't Indian what was he? He was/is the same since birth.
Of course there is an overall culture for different nationalities- Japanese have their culture as do Italians, You change your logic according to circumstances.
except your belief that because of race that means someone is Indian by definition, but suddenly that doesnt apply when they are elsewhere.Again by your definition Hitler was perfectly justified in using force to take over territory inhabited by ethnic Germans.
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Old Feb 17th 2019, 5:44 am
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Default Re: India and the Wars

[QUOTE=EMR;12633519]
Originally Posted by Bipat
It is not based on "race". It is about the colonisation of a small group of people for the purpose of trade by a far off nation to the detriment of the indigenous population.
Why did the British leave eventually, the French peacefully and maintain a good relationship?
Morpeth I have a great indepth reading of Goan history, as I said our particular community come from there, after fleeing Kashmir from the Mughals
Any research by the community members has been hindered as I have said by libraries and documents burned.
Do you approve of this? Do you approve of the torture and forced conversions?
Yes all of it OK, with you but not the release into self government and being part of the government of India.[/QUOTE

You have a simple minded one-sided view of History.
In your strange view of India , the events taking place in Goa n the 17th century were not repeated anywhere else or it was OK for others living in the sub continent to torture, forcibly convert, invade each other's territories, create rival empires, create levels of intolerance and prejudice unequalled anywhere else in the world.
Hypocrasy or simple ignorance , ?
Your defence of Indian acting like a colonial power in Kashmir suggest hypocrasy..
Explain the difference between the actions of Dyer in Amrritsar universally condemned and that of the Indian Army shooting those demonstrating for self determination.. .
Just imagine the arnarchy n the world f if nation after nation decided to act military against a neighbour to redress events against its people's 100s of years in the past.
Call it accelerating the last of the colonial enclaves, tidying up the map, simple acquisition of more land and people's, PR for Nehru one thing it was not was freeing the people's of Goa from colonial tyranny. ..
Good post- Bipat's point of view if applied universally would result in violence and wars worldwide as people could use her logic to justify military actions- the whole international relations since 1945, not always successful, has been built on the principle of avoiding armed force. Then o justify force by events happening centuries ago maks the situation even more dangerous. Bipat consistent defence of armed force used by India, and criticism only of British actions in India and not the Moghuls or others, reeks of extreme bias and prejudice. I imagine if Pakistan somehow could land troops in Hyderbad to 'liberate' it, Bipat would be the first to complain.
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Old Feb 17th 2019, 5:56 am
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Default Re: India and the Wars

Originally Posted by EMR
Does not mean that he is not a migrant and that you owe everything good that has happened to you, your marriage, children , grandchildren to what the British dud in India.
Game set and match I hink..
Do you mean, Greek or Persian words for the people's who lived beyond the Indus.
A foreign word adopted by Foreigners to describe those living in the sub continent...
When Bipat goes to hospital, travels by modern airplane or the train system, sends children to universities set up on British models, she is using wholly or partly technology and advances based on British or Western influence and developments.Yet to read her posts British rule was a litany of woes but the Indians were uniformly held down by armed force. The statistic I read was that by the end of WWII there were less than 5,000 British civil servants in India- I find it had to believe life was so bad that this was all that was required to rule the subcontinent. No one denies some of the negatives of British rules, but the picture Bipat paints just doesn't ring true.

I do tend to agree with Bipat ( though she usually denies there is an Indian culture) that there is an overall Indian culture which one would expect in a civilization as old as India's. That doesn't justify India using armed force against international law to enforce its will.

Many Indians became educated many businesses established, kind of hard to reconcile this with Bipat's portrayal. Bipat wrote that middle class Indian had no possessions in British India sounds very strange- I know from first hand observations being in houses of middle class Indians or Pakistani's that they had possessions often handed down from generations past Just an anecdotal observation, but to show the impression Bipat seeks to create strains belief.
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Old Feb 17th 2019, 6:00 am
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Default Re: India and the Wars

Originally Posted by morpeth
Of course there is an overall culture for different nationalities- Japanese have their culture as do Italians, You change your logic according to circumstances.
except your belief that because of race that means someone is Indian by definition, but suddenly that doesnt apply when they are elsewhere.Again by your definition Hitler was perfectly justified in using force to take over territory inhabited by ethnic Germans.
Morpeth your post doesn't make sense!
What is your definition of "culture"------All British people are identical in "culture"?----all do the same things under the same circumstances----all eat the same food, enjoy the same entertainment, have the same 'lifestyles'?
"Indian by definition"----"doesn't apply when they live elsewhere"?? The UK is a 'territory inhabited by ethnic' Indians I don't think India is planning to 'Take it over'!!

From your previous posts I assume you are mixing up the situation of a foreign power ruling over a remote territory by force and the remote territory being returned to rule by its own people, example the Channel Islands .


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Old Feb 17th 2019, 6:13 am
  #292  
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Default Re: India and the Wars

Originally Posted by morpeth
When Bipat goes to hospital, travels by modern airplane or the train system, sends children to universities set up on British models, she is using wholly or partly technology and advances based on British or Western influence and developments.Yet to read her posts British rule was a litany of woes but the Indians were uniformly held down by armed force. The statistic I read was that by the end of WWII there were less than 5,000 British civil servants in India- I find it had to believe life was so bad that this was all that was required to rule the subcontinent. No one denies some of the negatives of British rules, but the picture Bipat paints just doesn't ring true.

I do tend to agree with Bipat ( though she usually denies there is an Indian culture) that there is an overall Indian culture which one would expect in a civilization as old as India's. That doesn't justify India using armed force against international law to enforce its will.

Many Indians became educated many businesses established, kind of hard to reconcile this with Bipat's portrayal. Bipat wrote that middle class Indian had no possessions in British India sounds very strange- I know from first hand observations being in houses of middle class Indians or Pakistani's that they had possessions often handed down from generations past Just an anecdotal observation, but to show the impression Bipat seeks to create strains belief.
Morpeth you repeat the same points over and over again. Throughout the Raj Indian citizens didn't have any choice, they were born into a situation and made the best of it.
Got jobs and earned a living. They were easy to rule!!
Perhaps you could read the posts in the 'Republic thread ' by Indian citizens!

"Possessions handed down" yes, but nothing 'modern' like the British had in their own dwellings. I agree that there was a difference between those living in cities and rural areas.

"Civilisation as old as India's"-------You are totally disagreeing with EMR-----he is quite certain the Bharat (India) didn't exist until 1947!!!!

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Old Feb 17th 2019, 6:59 am
  #293  
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Default Re: India and the Wars

Originally Posted by Bipat
Morpeth you repeat the same points over and over again. Throughout the Raj Indian citizens didn't have any choice, they were born into a situation and made the best of it.
Got jobs and earned a living. They were easy to rule!!
Perhaps you could read the posts in the 'Republic thread ' by Indian citizens!

"Possessions handed down" yes, but nothing 'modern' like the British had in their own dwellings. I agree that there was a difference between those living in cities and rural areas.

"Civilisation as old as India's"-------You are totally disagreeing with EMR-----he is quite certain the Bharat (India) didn't exist until 1947!!!!
More bollocks from you Bipat.
You clearly are losing it.
ONCE AGAIN the modern state of India did not come into existence until 1947
Bharat like all ancient civilisations is nothing like that which followed them and that which exists now..
Time you stopped posting if you cannot stop posting outright lies...

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Old Feb 17th 2019, 7:04 am
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In polite discourse and debate we do not use expressions like BO***CKS. Bad form
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Old Feb 17th 2019, 7:13 am
  #295  
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Originally Posted by scot47
In polite discourse and debate we do not use expressions like BO***CKS. Bad form
So is the constant repetition of outright lies..
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Old Feb 17th 2019, 7:34 am
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Default Re: India and the Wars

Originally Posted by EMR
More bollocks from you Bipat.
You clearly are losing it.
ONCE AGAIN the modern state of India did not come into existence until 1947
Bharat like all ancient civilisations is nothing like that which followed them and that which exists now..
Time you stopped posting if you cannot stop posting outright lies...

The "Republic" of India came into existence in 1947.
Bharat/India has existed for thousands of years and still does.

EMR do you speak any Indian language? I presume you don't, so you might like to rethink your "lies".
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Old Feb 17th 2019, 7:46 am
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India became a Republic in 1950.
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Old Feb 17th 2019, 7:47 am
  #298  
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Default Re: India and the Wars

Originally Posted by Bipat
The "Republic" of India came into existence in 1947.
Bharat/India has existed for thousands of years and still does.

EMR do you speak any Indian language? I presume you don't, so you might like to rethink your "lies".
So does Summaria,thecAssyrians, the Hittite empire,, the Roman, Greeks . all the ancient civilisations of that time.
All have as much to do with the modern states that exist today as the Republic of India has today with what existed tens of centuries before..
Once again Bipat, fantasy rules in your world whereas facts exist in everyone else's..

Last edited by EMR; Feb 17th 2019 at 7:53 am.
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Old Feb 17th 2019, 8:04 am
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Originally Posted by Bipat
I do "get it " EMR ---your ridiculous posts trying to convince yourself that the British created 'India'. The Republic was created when the British left. The Republic of Pakistan was created in 1956, it was Pakistan before this happened!!!
Yes India was a Western term----what was Bharat?


You keep flipping back and forth in history.
History of Rajputs in India : Rajput Provinces of India

When the Portuguese first came to India, to the Goa area it was to convert to Christianity, Read about the Inquisition there. Read about the tortures. I am sure there would have been suicides by men and women, read about it. Many who could, fled not just Muslims and Hindus but also Christians including the ancestors of the Christian community in our town.

(Are you now going to know tell me I don't know who lives in my own town??)

Of course centuries later it was much different---temples rebuilt and freedom of religion, and travel through or to visit temples allowed by Indians from outside the borders.

I note that you call the inhabitants Goans not Portuguese -----They always were. Why do you and Morpeth think not it right that they should rule their own State and take part in the ruling of India.
Bipat, no one said whether it was right or wrong, just the fact that India invaded however justified you think it was, and as usual India would not conduct a referendum on whether the people wanted it be part of India. These are just simple facts.
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Old Feb 17th 2019, 8:09 am
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Default Re: India and the Wars

Originally Posted by EMR
So does Summaria,thecAssyrians, the Hittite empire,, the Roman, Greeks . all the ancient civilisations of that time.
All have as much
to do with the modern states that exist today as the Republic of India has today with what existed tens of centuries before..
Once again Bipat, fantasy rules in your world whereas facts exist in everyone else's..
EMR-----why can you not understand? Britain existed as Ancient' Britain
We are still 'British', this is British Expats Forum!!
Bharat/India existed for thousands if years, it is still Bharat/India!! The people always were and still are 'Indian'!
You are obsessed with India, learn at least some Hindi (if not Malayalam!!!)
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