US -> AUS Permanently
Aug 19th 2014, 5:56 pm
#1
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US -> AUS Permanently
Hello, I am a web developer and US citizen working full-time as a sub-contractor for an AUS company outside of Sydney for the last 2 years. We have been in talks since the beginning to come work in AUS for them. They will sponsor, nominate, or do whatever in order to get me there. I have a few concerns before exploring it further.
It looks like I could qualify for "Regional Sponsored Migration Scheme visa (subclass 187) or Employer Nomination Scheme (subclass 186)" according to the immigration site. That seems to be the only option for a permanent solution. I have not checked any temporary ones that can maybe turn into permanently?
My girlfriend and I are going to visit in 5 months for a few weeks to explore and see what life is like. We would likely visit one or two more times before making the final decision to immigrate.
Here are my concerns:
1. My girlfriend and I have been together 5 years that we would want to come over at the same time (she is also us citizen). Its my understanding that partner visa would only work if I was already a permanent resident. I can't tell if the visa I qualify for would automatically give her one as well? Her job could qualify on the skilled job list but I don't see an option for her to migrate at the same time to gain enough time for her to also find a job and / or potential sponsor?
2. I have several online business' based in the united states that I can run from anywhere. It's my understanding that a work visa in AUS would allow me to receive income in AUS while working for an AUS company. What I don't know is if I can also make income from my US clients while in AUS? Some ideas are to not draw a salary until I would be a permanent resident. My corporation in the US would receive income from US clients but not pay me as an employee thus avoiding any income. If I did pay myself it could be to the US bank account... which could be foreign income (but I earned it on AUS soil) and it seems you don't have to declare foreign income in AUS? Transferring money from US to AUS shouldn't be considered income right? It seems a fairly unique situation and I can't find out much about it.
The main goal here is to not have to shut down these business' just to immigrate. I wouldn't need to draw a salary, but it would be even better if I can still take a salary but leave it in the US, invest it there, and not bring it into AUS until I could legally do so.
---
The opportunity is available and will be available for the near future. We are both 28 and it seems we lose 5 points past 30. They are keen to get me there, I just need to make sure that I can take my partner with me and keep my US business' running as I am the sole employee. Then most importantly we need to visit AUS and make sure it is the right fit!
It looks like I could qualify for "Regional Sponsored Migration Scheme visa (subclass 187) or Employer Nomination Scheme (subclass 186)" according to the immigration site. That seems to be the only option for a permanent solution. I have not checked any temporary ones that can maybe turn into permanently?
My girlfriend and I are going to visit in 5 months for a few weeks to explore and see what life is like. We would likely visit one or two more times before making the final decision to immigrate.
Here are my concerns:
1. My girlfriend and I have been together 5 years that we would want to come over at the same time (she is also us citizen). Its my understanding that partner visa would only work if I was already a permanent resident. I can't tell if the visa I qualify for would automatically give her one as well? Her job could qualify on the skilled job list but I don't see an option for her to migrate at the same time to gain enough time for her to also find a job and / or potential sponsor?
2. I have several online business' based in the united states that I can run from anywhere. It's my understanding that a work visa in AUS would allow me to receive income in AUS while working for an AUS company. What I don't know is if I can also make income from my US clients while in AUS? Some ideas are to not draw a salary until I would be a permanent resident. My corporation in the US would receive income from US clients but not pay me as an employee thus avoiding any income. If I did pay myself it could be to the US bank account... which could be foreign income (but I earned it on AUS soil) and it seems you don't have to declare foreign income in AUS? Transferring money from US to AUS shouldn't be considered income right? It seems a fairly unique situation and I can't find out much about it.
The main goal here is to not have to shut down these business' just to immigrate. I wouldn't need to draw a salary, but it would be even better if I can still take a salary but leave it in the US, invest it there, and not bring it into AUS until I could legally do so.
---
The opportunity is available and will be available for the near future. We are both 28 and it seems we lose 5 points past 30. They are keen to get me there, I just need to make sure that I can take my partner with me and keep my US business' running as I am the sole employee. Then most importantly we need to visit AUS and make sure it is the right fit!
Last edited by xiosen; Aug 19th 2014 at 6:06 pm.
Aug 19th 2014, 8:05 pm
#2
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Joined: Sep 2009
Location: Adelaide
Posts: 29,850
Re: US -> AUS Permanently
Hello, I am a web developer and US citizen working full-time as a sub-contractor for an AUS company outside of Sydney for the last 2 years. We have been in talks since the beginning to come work in AUS for them. They will sponsor, nominate, or do whatever in order to get me there. I have a few concerns before exploring it further.
It looks like I could qualify for "Regional Sponsored Migration Scheme visa (subclass 187) or Employer Nomination Scheme (subclass 186)" according to the immigration site. That seems to be the only option for a permanent solution. I have not checked any temporary ones that can maybe turn into permanently?
My girlfriend and I are going to visit in 5 months for a few weeks to explore and see what life is like. We would likely visit one or two more times before making the final decision to immigrate.
Here are my concerns:
1. My girlfriend and I have been together 5 years that we would want to come over at the same time (she is also us citizen). Its my understanding that partner visa would only work if I was already a permanent resident. I can't tell if the visa I qualify for would automatically give her one as well? Her job could qualify on the skilled job list but I don't see an option for her to migrate at the same time to gain enough time for her to also find a job and / or potential sponsor?
2. I have several online business' based in the united states that I can run from anywhere. It's my understanding that a work visa in AUS would allow me to receive income in AUS while working for an AUS company. What I don't know is if I can also make income from my US clients while in AUS? Some ideas are to not draw a salary until I would be a permanent resident. My corporation in the US would receive income from US clients but not pay me as an employee thus avoiding any income. If I did pay myself it could be to the US bank account... which could be foreign income (but I earned it on AUS soil) and it seems you don't have to declare foreign income in AUS? Transferring money from US to AUS shouldn't be considered income right? It seems a fairly unique situation and I can't find out much about it.
The main goal here is to not have to shut down these business' just to immigrate. I wouldn't need to draw a salary, but it would be even better if I can still take a salary but leave it in the US, invest it there, and not bring it into AUS until I could legally do so.
---
The opportunity is available and will be available for the near future. We are both 28 and it seems we lose 5 points past 30. They are keen to get me there, I just need to make sure that I can take my partner with me and keep my US business' running as I am the sole employee. Then most importantly we need to visit AUS and make sure it is the right fit!
It looks like I could qualify for "Regional Sponsored Migration Scheme visa (subclass 187) or Employer Nomination Scheme (subclass 186)" according to the immigration site. That seems to be the only option for a permanent solution. I have not checked any temporary ones that can maybe turn into permanently?
My girlfriend and I are going to visit in 5 months for a few weeks to explore and see what life is like. We would likely visit one or two more times before making the final decision to immigrate.
Here are my concerns:
1. My girlfriend and I have been together 5 years that we would want to come over at the same time (she is also us citizen). Its my understanding that partner visa would only work if I was already a permanent resident. I can't tell if the visa I qualify for would automatically give her one as well? Her job could qualify on the skilled job list but I don't see an option for her to migrate at the same time to gain enough time for her to also find a job and / or potential sponsor?
2. I have several online business' based in the united states that I can run from anywhere. It's my understanding that a work visa in AUS would allow me to receive income in AUS while working for an AUS company. What I don't know is if I can also make income from my US clients while in AUS? Some ideas are to not draw a salary until I would be a permanent resident. My corporation in the US would receive income from US clients but not pay me as an employee thus avoiding any income. If I did pay myself it could be to the US bank account... which could be foreign income (but I earned it on AUS soil) and it seems you don't have to declare foreign income in AUS? Transferring money from US to AUS shouldn't be considered income right? It seems a fairly unique situation and I can't find out much about it.
The main goal here is to not have to shut down these business' just to immigrate. I wouldn't need to draw a salary, but it would be even better if I can still take a salary but leave it in the US, invest it there, and not bring it into AUS until I could legally do so.
---
The opportunity is available and will be available for the near future. We are both 28 and it seems we lose 5 points past 30. They are keen to get me there, I just need to make sure that I can take my partner with me and keep my US business' running as I am the sole employee. Then most importantly we need to visit AUS and make sure it is the right fit!
If your employer will sponsor you for the 186, they need to be approved by immigration if they are not already, and your occupation needs to be on the skills list. You would also need to pass a skills assessment in your occupation. I don't believe there is a points test for this visa.
For the 457 you wouldn't need the skills assessment, but that may cause issues with your own business. I'm not sure where you stand with that - hopefully someone else will be along later - or you could seek advice closer to the time once you discover what visa they will sponsor you for, and if you do both like the Sydney area
Aug 19th 2014, 8:19 pm
#3
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Joined: Aug 2014
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Re: US -> AUS Permanently
If your employer sponsored you for a PR visa, I would think it would most likely be either a temporary visa (457) or the 186 you mentioned. If you and your girlfriend are in a committed relationship as if married, she could be included in your visa as a defacto partner.
If your employer will sponsor you for the 186, they need to be approved by immigration if they are not already, and your occupation needs to be on the skills list. You would also need to pass a skills assessment in your occupation. I don't believe there is a points test for this visa.
For the 457 you wouldn't need the skills assessment, but that may cause issues with your own business. I'm not sure where you stand with that - hopefully someone else will be along later - or you could seek advice closer to the time once you discover what visa they will sponsor you for, and if you do both like the Sydney area
If your employer will sponsor you for the 186, they need to be approved by immigration if they are not already, and your occupation needs to be on the skills list. You would also need to pass a skills assessment in your occupation. I don't believe there is a points test for this visa.
For the 457 you wouldn't need the skills assessment, but that may cause issues with your own business. I'm not sure where you stand with that - hopefully someone else will be along later - or you could seek advice closer to the time once you discover what visa they will sponsor you for, and if you do both like the Sydney area
My girlfriend and I are not married, but have lived together for 5 years. I am confused because my application would be bound to my specific employer. If it was the 186, by including her, does that mean she can work anywhere since she already has a work permit through mine? Or would this just be a visa and she would need to still apply for work permit of some sort after getting a job offer?
I think they are already approved as an employer because they have immigrated someone from the US and France before. If they are not, they would be willing to get approved in order to hire me.
My occupation is on the skills list, it looks like and could be considered https://www.acacia-au.com/anzsco/261312.php or https://www.acacia-au.com/anzsco/261313.php since the descriptions are identical. It is on the labour testing not required list, so I would I be exempt from that regardless of the visa?
Another idea for the US business deal, is perhaps I could hire a US virtual assistant to keep the business running in my absence so I would not be working or collecting a salary while in AUS. I also thought about using my current property as a rental but I don't know how that would work with the "business" aspect again. Another aspect is I have investments that yield dividends as income which could also confuse matters. It is a unique situation so I may just seek counsel when we get closer like you suggested.
Aug 19th 2014, 8:49 pm
#4
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Joined: Feb 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 14,284
Re: US -> AUS Permanently
Quite a lot in there ... here are my thoughts.
The 187 is probably not the visa to pursue it is regional and has extra steps in the process. So it is either the 457 (temporary) or 186 (permanent). These are not points based visas, so your comment on 5 points later is not relevant. Assuming you are living with your partner and not just dating, she can come on your application so that is very easy.
You certainly are taking a long time deciding whether to do this. Loads of people move without visiting at all. That was just an observation, nothing more.
If you are on a 457 visa, your problems is not so much the income (which I will come to) but is actually that you are not allowed to work for anyone else or on your own business whilst you are in Australia on that visa. So you would need to hand over the reins to somebody or be in breach of your visa restrictions.
If you are on a permanent visa, then there are no such visa restrictions and you could continue with these businesses as well as your sponsored employment. The income would be Australian income, not foreign income, as it is from employment and you are in Australia whilst you earn it. In this scenario with all else being equal but you were British, then this would definitely be taxable in Australia not the UK.
But you would need to find out what the Australian - US tax treaty states on employment income - remembering that this would be considered Australian income because source of employment income is determined by where you are, not where your customers are.
The 187 is probably not the visa to pursue it is regional and has extra steps in the process. So it is either the 457 (temporary) or 186 (permanent). These are not points based visas, so your comment on 5 points later is not relevant. Assuming you are living with your partner and not just dating, she can come on your application so that is very easy.
You certainly are taking a long time deciding whether to do this. Loads of people move without visiting at all. That was just an observation, nothing more.
If you are on a 457 visa, your problems is not so much the income (which I will come to) but is actually that you are not allowed to work for anyone else or on your own business whilst you are in Australia on that visa. So you would need to hand over the reins to somebody or be in breach of your visa restrictions.
If you are on a permanent visa, then there are no such visa restrictions and you could continue with these businesses as well as your sponsored employment. The income would be Australian income, not foreign income, as it is from employment and you are in Australia whilst you earn it. In this scenario with all else being equal but you were British, then this would definitely be taxable in Australia not the UK.
But you would need to find out what the Australian - US tax treaty states on employment income - remembering that this would be considered Australian income because source of employment income is determined by where you are, not where your customers are.
Last edited by Bermudashorts; Aug 19th 2014 at 8:51 pm.
Aug 19th 2014, 9:06 pm
#5
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Re: US -> AUS Permanently
Quite a lot in there ... here are my thoughts.
The 187 is probably not the visa to pursue it is regional and has extra steps in the process. So it is either the 457 (temporary) or 186 (permanent). These are not points based visas, so your comment on 5 points later is not relevant. Assuming you are living with your partner and not just dating, she can come on your application so that is very easy.
You certainly are taking a long time deciding whether to do this. Loads of people move without visiting at all. That was just an observation, nothing more.
If you are on a 457 visa, your problems is not so much the income (which I will come to) but is actually that you are not allowed to work for anyone else or on your own business whilst you are in Australia on that visa. So you would need to hand over the reins to somebody or be in breach of your visa restrictions.
If you are on a permanent visa, then there are no such visa restrictions and you could continue with these businesses as well as your sponsored employment. The income would be Australian income, not foreign income, as it is from employment and you are in Australia whilst you earn it. In this scenario with all else being equal but you were British, then this would definitely be taxable in Australia not the UK.
But you would need to find out what the Australian - US tax treaty states on employment income - remembering that this would be considered Australian income because source of employment income is determined by where you are, not where your customers are.
The 187 is probably not the visa to pursue it is regional and has extra steps in the process. So it is either the 457 (temporary) or 186 (permanent). These are not points based visas, so your comment on 5 points later is not relevant. Assuming you are living with your partner and not just dating, she can come on your application so that is very easy.
You certainly are taking a long time deciding whether to do this. Loads of people move without visiting at all. That was just an observation, nothing more.
If you are on a 457 visa, your problems is not so much the income (which I will come to) but is actually that you are not allowed to work for anyone else or on your own business whilst you are in Australia on that visa. So you would need to hand over the reins to somebody or be in breach of your visa restrictions.
If you are on a permanent visa, then there are no such visa restrictions and you could continue with these businesses as well as your sponsored employment. The income would be Australian income, not foreign income, as it is from employment and you are in Australia whilst you earn it. In this scenario with all else being equal but you were British, then this would definitely be taxable in Australia not the UK.
But you would need to find out what the Australian - US tax treaty states on employment income - remembering that this would be considered Australian income because source of employment income is determined by where you are, not where your customers are.
My girlfriend and I are living together for 5 years so that seems perfect. Would she be able to work anywhere with my visa? Or does she need to apply for her own permit to work once she has a job offer?
I would gladly come to aus sooner if everything worked out that way. The holdup is my girlfriend's student loan debt and job experience. The former should be paid off by the time we could potentially leave and the latter would improve chances at being hired in the future (2 years experience and promotion in job title, no longer an assistant). I also need to look at selling or renting out my house. We can certainly drop everything and go but that is the far riskier scenario
. It sounds like the 186 would be the perfect option. That way the business' can continue to operate and any profits I collect would have to be paid to aus then since I would be working within the country. It sounds like I still need to file US taxes but they will give me a credit for foreign income to prevent double taxation. Definitely something to discuss with my CPA once things progress.
If the 457 is the only option, I will just have to try and see what scenario will work to satisfy the visa requirements of not working but yet not closing it down. I am not sure how I could swing that since even a virtual assistant or outsourcing the work would likely be considered work as well. Even if I did not pay myself and did it for free, would that still be considered "income" or "working"?
Aug 19th 2014, 11:56 pm
#6
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Re: US -> AUS Permanently
If your partner put on your visa as your de facto then she would have full work rights.
Aug 20th 2014, 3:28 am
#7
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Re: US -> AUS Permanently
If the 457 is the only option, I will just have to try and see what scenario will work to satisfy the visa requirements of not working but yet not closing it down. I am not sure how I could swing that since even a virtual assistant or outsourcing the work would likely be considered work as well. Even if I did not pay myself and did it for free, would that still be considered "income" or "working"?
Regarding the 457, unless you don't intend to bill your clients, I don't see how you could say this is not working or earning an income. That is why the 186 is better.
Aug 20th 2014, 4:21 am
#8
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Re: US -> AUS Permanently
Another thought I had, what if I had my girlfriend could handle the work since she seems to have more of an open work permit. The company could bill the client to take in corporate income but it would be left in the business and not paid to anyone. In this way she would be the one actually working, and no income would need declared.
I also found on numerous sites saying that for temporary visas like 457 that foreign income is exempt from taxes anyway. On one hand it does not need to be declared for taxes at any point. But on the VISA front I am simply not allowed to work what so ever on anything else. I have to many websites and irons in the fire that I work on in my spare time that don't make any money. I don't wish to jeopardize things before I even begin so it seems like it is the 186 or nothing at all.
Aug 20th 2014, 4:41 am
#9
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Feb 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 14,284
Re: US -> AUS Permanently
I also found on numerous sites saying that for temporary visas like 457 that foreign income is exempt from taxes anyway. On one hand it does not need to be declared for taxes at any point. But on the VISA front I am simply not allowed to work what so ever on anything else. I have to many websites and irons in the fire that I work on in my spare time that don't make any money. I don't wish to jeopardize things before I even begin so it seems like it is the 186 or nothing at all.
Yes that is correct, but this is NOT foreign income. As I mentioned in my earlier posts, if you (or your partner) and conducting the work whilst you reside in Australia, this is Australian employment income - as it depends upon your location not your clients location.
The type of income that would not be taxable in Australia for the 457 holder would be say overseas rental income which is being generated by the overseas asset, not through you conducting work and so is not employment income..
Aug 20th 2014, 4:43 am
#10
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Re: US -> AUS Permanently
Yes that is correct, but this is NOT foreign income. As I mentioned in my earlier posts, if you (or your partner) and conducting the work whilst you reside in Australia, this is Australian employment income - as it depends upon your location not your clients location.
The type of income that would not be taxable in Australia for the 457 holder would be say overseas rental income which is being generated by the overseas asset, not through you conducting work and so is not employment income..
The type of income that would not be taxable in Australia for the 457 holder would be say overseas rental income which is being generated by the overseas asset, not through you conducting work and so is not employment income..
Aug 20th 2014, 6:38 am
#11
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Re: US -> AUS Permanently
If you want to move permanently then you will have to pay for a PR visa at some point, even if an employer sponsors you most people pay their own visa fee.
Aug 20th 2014, 10:53 pm
#12
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Location: Scotland
Posts: 3,337
Re: US -> AUS Permanently
There is nothing stopping you though starting on a 457 and then immediately launching a 186 application if the company would consider this route. Or you independently preparing for skilled migration, accepting the 457, then submitting an independent visa application.
