frustrated

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Hello,

Yesterday I received my skills assessment letter from the ACS, and I
would like to share this information as I guess some people could find
it useful.

I have been assessed as suitable for migration under 2231-15 ASCO
code. My educational background is a BEng in Computer Engineering
(5-year degree) and a MSc in Computer Science. I have been given a
deeming date of 2/2000. Until that date I worked in total around 5
years and 2 months. So if I understand it correctly, it means that
they have used those 5y2m to amount to the 4 years they require. That
is not bad considering that 2 out of those years were pre-degree
experience. Am I understanding it correctly?

And now, I have a few questions that I would be very grateful if some
one has an answer.

From 2/2000 until now, I have just a little more than 3 years of
experience, so I would like to get the 10 points for "specific work
experience". The problem is that 6 months out of this period of time I
worked as an independent freelance developer, with my own small
company. What kind of evidence can I use for this?

Also, I see that the MODL includes several positions under the ASCO
code 2231. In order to qualify for the 5 points for "occupation in
demand", is it just enough with the letter from the ACS stating that
my ASCO code is 2231-15, or the reference letters from employers are
also taken into account? In my reference letters, I am considered a
software developer, software engineer, and programmer/analyst.

Thanks a lot!

Konstantin Tsolov

Hi frustrated,
(hopefully not too frustrated now ;-))

Congrats!

[email protected] wrote:
    > I have been assessed as suitable for migration under 2231-15 ASCO
    > code. My educational background is a BEng in Computer Engineering
    > (5-year degree) and a MSc in Computer Science. I have been given a

That puts you in "Australian BSc" - Group A - needing 4yrs work exp.
besides the degree.

    > deeming date of 2/2000. Until that date I worked in total around 5

That means that ACS have decided (based on proof that you sent) that
you have worked "if full-time paid .. etc.. empl" exactly 4 years
before 02/2000 ("full-time" meaning >= 20 hrs/week which I consider
"half-time", but anyway ;-)).

    > years and 2 months. So if I understand it correctly, it means that
    > they have used those 5y2m to amount to the 4 years they require. That

Work experience cannot be accumulated, AFAIK.
Most likely they didn't recognize some of your references or you have
a gap in your employment history.

    > is not bad considering that 2 out of those years were pre-degree
    > experience. Am I understanding it correctly?

Pre-degree work is considered by the ACS provided it meets all other
requirements.

    >
    > And now, I have a few questions that I would be very grateful if some
    > one has an answer.
    >
    > From 2/2000 until now, I have just a little more than 3 years of
    > experience, so I would like to get the 10 points for "specific work
    > experience". The problem is that 6 months out of this period of time I
    > worked as an independent freelance developer, with my own small
    > company. What kind of evidence can I use for this?

I have no idea. Probably company registration papers, contracts, letters
from clients are a good idea?

    >
    > Also, I see that the MODL includes several positions under the ASCO
    > code 2231. In order to qualify for the 5 points for "occupation in
    > demand", is it just enough with the letter from the ACS stating that
    > my ASCO code is 2231-15, or the reference letters from employers are
    > also taken into account? In my reference letters, I am considered a
    > software developer, software engineer, and programmer/analyst.

I believe that references are the main source which DIMIA looks at when
deciding MODL. Of course you *need* to have the ASCO code, but since
the 2231 MODL is broken down to specific occupations (like _java_
developer and no other developer for example) references seem the only
way to figure that out.

    >
    > Thanks a lot!
    >

HTH.

--kosio

Konstantin Tsolov

Hi frustrated,
(hopefully not too frustrated now ;-))

Congrats!

[email protected] wrote:
> I have been assessed as suitable for migration under 2231-15 ASCO
> code. My educational background is a BEng in Computer Engineering
> (5-year degree) and a MSc in Computer Science. I have been given a

That puts you in "Australian BSc" - Group A - needing 4yrs work exp.
besides the degree.

> deeming date of 2/2000. Until that date I worked in total around 5

That means that ACS have decided (based on proof that you sent) that
you have worked "in full-time paid .. etc.. empl" exactly 4 years
before 02/2000 ("full-time" meaning >= 20 hrs/week which I consider
"half-time", but anyway ;-)).

> years and 2 months. So if I understand it correctly, it means that
> they have used those 5y2m to amount to the 4 years they require. That

Work experience cannot be accumulated, AFAIK.
Most likely they didn't recognize some of your references or you have
a gap in your employment history.

> is not bad considering that 2 out of those years were pre-degree
> experience. Am I understanding it correctly?

Pre-degree work is considered by the ACS provided it meets all other
requirements.

>
> And now, I have a few questions that I would be very grateful if some
> one has an answer.
>
> From 2/2000 until now, I have just a little more than 3 years of
> experience, so I would like to get the 10 points for "specific work
> experience". The problem is that 6 months out of this period of time I
> worked as an independent freelance developer, with my own small
> company. What kind of evidence can I use for this?

I have no idea. Probably company registration papers, contracts, letters
from clients are a good idea?

>
> Also, I see that the MODL includes several positions under the ASCO
> code 2231. In order to qualify for the 5 points for "occupation in
> demand", is it just enough with the letter from the ACS stating that
> my ASCO code is 2231-15, or the reference letters from employers are
> also taken into account? In my reference letters, I am considered a
> software developer, software engineer, and programmer/analyst.

I believe that references are the main source which DIMIA looks at when
deciding MODL. Of course you *need* to have the ASCO code, but since
the 2231 MODL is broken down to specific occupations (like _java_
developer and no other developer for example) references seem the only
way to figure that out.

>
> Thanks a lot!
>

HTH.

--kosio

saturn

By getting positvely assessed by ACS under 2231 (or any code) does not give you 5 points for MODL. As a matter of fact you apply for MODL points while sending your skill-assessment application and if ACS feels satified with your claim of MODL points then generaly they add in their letter something like

"In Our openion the applicant has 12 months of experience in..."
e.g., Java

frustrated

x-no-archive: yes

Thanks for your answer, Kosio.

    > > years and 2 months. So if I understand it correctly, it means that
    > > they have used those 5y2m to amount to the 4 years they require. That
    >
    > Work experience cannot be accumulated, AFAIK.
    > Most likely they didn't recognize some of your references or you have
    > a gap in your employment history.

How is that about experience not being accumulated? Let me explain it
in more detail. I have work experience from 1993 to now. From 1993 to
2/2000 (the deeming date), my experience amounts to 5 years and 2
months, as I had periods where I did not work (i.e. when I took the
MSc or time between jobs). These 5 years and 2 months were in
different companies (and even countries), so it is the sum of 3 years
+ 6 months + 10 months + 10 months. So I understand that the ACS used
these 5 years and 2 months as the equivalent of 4 years. Maybe they
only counted half of my pre-degree experience, for instance. Am I
wrong understanding how the ACS works?

    > I believe that references are the main source which DIMIA looks at when
    > deciding MODL. Of course you *need* to have the ASCO code, but since
    > the 2231 MODL is broken down to specific occupations (like _java_
    > developer and no other developer for example) references seem the only
    > way to figure that out.

I guess it is time to start again asking for more detailed references
to past and present employers. :-(

baloo

Recognition for MODL points needs to be applied for from ACS, with your skills assessment, which you then submit to DIMIA.
On the skills assessment there is an option to request MODL assessment, and you have to nominate what MODL you are seeking.

If granted, it would have been included in your assessment letter, with a line similar to
"The applicant has 12 months experience in <MODL nominated occupation>"

If you don't have that line on your ACS assessment result, you cannot claim MODL points from DIMIA.
If you did not nominate MODL in your ACS application, then you will most likely need to resubmit another application nominating MODL.

frustrated

x-no-archive: yes

What you say is true... I just realized about it. Stupid me! So 5 less
points to count on, and then I am at 120 now. I hope my points for
"Specific work experience" don't fall or I will be in trouble. I guess
this PR application is even more difficult than I thought.

Konstantin Tsolov

Don't worry too much about not having MODL points. MODL points are
the shadiest part of the whole process :-) and IT will probably be
taken out completely by the time your app gets points tested.

--kosio

[email protected] wrote:
    > x-no-archive: yes
    >
    > What you say is true... I just realized about it. Stupid me! So 5 less
    > points to count on, and then I am at 120 now. I hope my points for
    > "Specific work experience" don't fall or I will be in trouble. I guess
    > this PR application is even more difficult than I thought.
    >

Konstantin Tsolov

[email protected] wrote:
    > x-no-archive: yes
    >
    > Thanks for your answer, Kosio.
    >
    >
    >> > years and 2 months. So if I understand it correctly, it means that
    >> > they have used those 5y2m to amount to the 4 years they require. That
    >>Work experience cannot be accumulated, AFAIK.
    >>Most likely they didn't recognize some of your references or you have
    >>a gap in your employment history.
    >
    >
    > How is that about experience not being accumulated? Let me explain it

I was talking of for example 3 days 10hour shifts + 6 days 5hour shifts
do not make 3 days work exp (20hour shifts); they make 0 days work exp.
But then again, I should have said what I was talking about... ;-)

    > in more detail. I have work experience from 1993 to now. From 1993 to
    > 2/2000 (the deeming date), my experience amounts to 5 years and 2
    > months, as I had periods where I did not work (i.e. when I took the
    > MSc or time between jobs). These 5 years and 2 months were in
    > different companies (and even countries), so it is the sum of 3 years
    > + 6 months + 10 months + 10 months. So I understand that the ACS used
    > these 5 years and 2 months as the equivalent of 4 years. Maybe they
    > only counted half of my pre-degree experience, for instance. Am I
    > wrong understanding how the ACS works?

It's pretty hard to say without looking at any actual proof of work...
Besides I'm not an expert in ACS's procedings :-)

Anyway, you have the 60pt occupation, the fine deeming date, and the
10pt work exp; so what does it matter how ACS goes about assessing? ;-)

    >
    >
    >>I believe that references are the main source which DIMIA looks at when
    >>deciding MODL. Of course you *need* to have the ASCO code, but since
    >>the 2231 MODL is broken down to specific occupations (like _java_
    >>developer and no other developer for example) references seem the only
    >>way to figure that out.
    >
    >
    > I guess it is time to start again asking for more detailed references
    > to past and present employers. :-(
    >
    >

May be a good idea. You might find it useful to read carefully what the
migration booklet 6 has to say about employment references (if you
haven't done so already).


Good luck with your lodgement.

--kosio

frustrated

x-no-archive: yes

On Wed, 26 Mar 2003 11:17:30 +0200, Konstantin Tsolov wrote:
    > Don't worry too much about not having MODL points. MODL points are
    > the shadiest part of the whole process :-) and IT will probably be
    > taken out completely by the time your app gets points tested.

After reading old posts from this forum, and checking
www.austimeline.com I just realized that, as you say, those 5/10
points are really difficult to catch. I read posts from people that
got a MODL denomination for some particular skill, but by the time
their application was assessed by ACS or later by DIMIA, that skill
had gotten out of the MODL. So basically, they seem to me like points
you cannot really depend on to have 115 points.