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Sanity Check on Points - all experience no qualifications

Sanity Check on Points - all experience no qualifications

Old Mar 19th 2013, 5:01 pm
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Default Sanity Check on Points - all experience no qualifications

Im in the awkward though perhaps not uncommon position that I cannot get PAR to accept my Education/Qualification (for various reasons, mostly I have Industry Certifications over traditional educational qualifications) but have tons of actual real work experience in ICT Management.

Anyhow, Im trying to make the points for a SM without qualifications. I figure I have a shot at 140pts if I have a Job Offer or even short term work experience in Nz (eg go over on a Work Exchange type visa get ICT job etc), my career revolves around IT Project Management (/ management in general) for over 13years in a comparable and English speaking labour market.

Does this "check out"?

Age: 25pts

Skilled Employment:
50pts for less than 12mths in Nz Skilled Employment / Job Offer
10 in Identified Future Growth (does this need qualification to back up or will 13years IT work experience suffice?)
0 in Absolute Skill Shorts (0 as the LTSSL seems to imply I would need Qualification of some sort to claim bonus points, correct?)
10pts for Work Outside Auckland (lets assume there are ICT roles outside Auckland..)


Work Experience in skilled employment:
30pts for 10years Experience (Anywhere)
15pts for Identified Future Growth Area (Over 6yrs in ICT, assuming no qualification required to claim)
0pts for Absolute Skills Shortage work experience (again, needs qualifications according to LTSSL)


Total 140, auto selection with no 3rd level Qualifications to justify, a definite comparable labour market and a CV and references to back it all up. WDYT?
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Old Mar 20th 2013, 7:32 pm
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Default Re: Sanity Check on Points - all experience no qualifications

Hello and welcome
Let's see. To gain enough points then you will need a job offer as you realise.

Age: 25pts

Skilled Employment:
50pts for less than 12mths in Nz Skilled Employment / Job Offer
10 in Identified Future Growth (does this need qualification to back up or will 13years IT work experience suffice?)
As long as the experience is relevant to the job then you should be ok, I can't see any mention of needing a qualification

0 in Absolute Skill Shorts (0 as the LTSSL seems to imply I would need Qualification of some sort to claim bonus points, correct?)
Yes you would need one of the qualifications listed in the LTSSL to gain these points

10pts for Work Outside Auckland (lets assume there are ICT roles outside Auckland..)
I would imagine so but a job offer is a job offer!


Work Experience in skilled employment:
30pts for 10years Experience (Anywhere) You mentioned it was in a comparable labour market so yes

15pts for Identified Future Growth Area (Over 6yrs in ICT, assuming no qualification required to claim)As far as I can see there is no need for a qualification, just a job offer

0pts for Absolute Skills Shortage work experience (again, needs qualifications according to LTSSL)correct



Looking at the ANZSCO list then a number of years of work experience can substitute for a recognised qualification.
Even if you get a job offer within Auckland, it looks like you would only lose 10 points and there has only been one draw this year where those with >100pts and a job offer have not been selected. This was the one after the long Xmas break so it's not a 'normal' draw. What I mean is, don't assume it all hinges on you needing 140pts and an automatic selection.

Not sure what you mean by a work exchange type of visa. If you score 25 pts for age then you are 30-39 years old. If you meant Working Holiday Visa then you must be not more than 30yo.

Hope this helps
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Old Mar 20th 2013, 7:57 pm
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Default Re: Sanity Check on Points - all experience no qualifications

Thanks, good to get a another pair of eyes on a plan!
On the "work exchange type Visa", Im referring to this:

http://bunac.org/uk/work-abroad/work-new-zealand/visas

Which is referenced as an approved Scheme organiser here:
http://www.dol.govt.nz/immigration/k...base/item/1318


The primary difference from the WHV is the fact you can be upto 35.
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Old Mar 21st 2013, 3:07 pm
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Default Re: Sanity Check on Points - all experience no qualifications

Ah yes, I always forget that exists
Have you tried looking for work from outside NZ? Some of the IT people on here have done it. Certain professions seem more likely to get jobs without being here.
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Old Mar 21st 2013, 5:08 pm
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Default Re: Sanity Check on Points - all experience no qualifications

Originally Posted by Persephone View Post
Ah yes, I always forget that exists
Have you tried looking for work from outside NZ? Some of the IT people on here have done it. Certain professions seem more likely to get jobs without being here.
I have indeed for 6mths (direct and with recruiters), but havent had much luck. The IT Recruiters say my experience and skillset is in high demand in Nz, however without Visa's sorted (this was before I knew of the IEP option too) they wouldnt progress it further. These were for fairly high paying jobs, so I guess thats understandable.

I was repeatedly told to "just fly over" and get a job!
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Old Mar 21st 2013, 5:57 pm
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Default Re: Sanity Check on Points - all experience no qualifications

Sounds like the recruiters don't know a lot about how the visa system works They need to realise that generally it is job offer first and then visa.

You can get residency without a job offer in place but many people need that offer to up their points to a level where they will be selected. As you do.
So far this year it has only been those with >140pts and those with job offers who have been selected. The draw hasn't got down further.

Work and WTR visas require a job offer first though these two could be difficult with the LTSSL qualification issue.

Try explaining the dilemma to them, how about sending off CVs explaining the need for a job offer and how exactly this will enable you to obtain a visa. You may already have tried that of course
I don't know much about Bunac but at least you would have a visa in your passport! Good luck!
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Old Mar 21st 2013, 6:56 pm
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Default Re: Sanity Check on Points - all experience no qualifications

Originally Posted by kodachrome View Post
I was repeatedly told to "just fly over" and get a job!
that was the only way we managed to get over here. It's all very "lets go for coffee" type interviews so boots on ground does seem to be the best option. If
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Old Mar 22nd 2013, 11:18 am
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Default Re: Sanity Check on Points - all experience no qualifications

Originally Posted by Persephone View Post
Try explaining the dilemma to them, how about sending off CVs explaining the need for a job offer and how exactly this will enable you to obtain a visa. You may already have tried that of course
I don't know much about Bunac but at least you would have a visa in your passport! Good luck!
I did, but I suspect they dont do a great job explaining this onto Employers, ie they kept calling its "Sponsorship" which it really isnt. "Sponsorship" is more a Work to Residence (or Australian Visa centric which they might be familiar with from part experiences) thing IMO, all the SM Visa Job Offer seems to require is a commitment for 2mths of employment or something similarly low.

Either way, I get told should be no problem getting job... once you fly over here on a work visa! I can do this thanks to the IEP program, but I dont like the way it kinda forces to be a little misleading on my longer intentions with Immigration, despite being technically above board.

Last edited by kodachrome; Mar 22nd 2013 at 11:20 am.
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Old Mar 22nd 2013, 6:12 pm
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Default Re: Sanity Check on Points - all experience no qualifications

It sounds like they haven't a clue - sponsorship, fly over with a work visa etc. If they understood how it works then they'd understand that that is nonsense. Very frustrating for you

Nearly right! If you get residency under the SMC and it includes points for a job offer then you have to work in that job for 3m before the conditions can be removed. Still not a very long time though...
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