British Expats

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-   Immigration, Citizenship and Visas (NZ) (https://britishexpats.com/forum/immigration-citizenship-visas-nz-108/)
-   -   Help needed - advice about dumping agent (https://britishexpats.com/forum/immigration-citizenship-visas-nz-108/help-needed-advice-about-dumping-agent-605726/)

alchris Apr 27th 2009 7:41 pm

Re: Help needed - advice about dumping agent
 

Originally Posted by weejie (Post 7519113)
Good luck,my advice,for what it's worth, is do not use an agent. If I can fill out all the paperwork and get all the document evidence together then you definitely can if you have admin skills. As for Paul Goddard I would go to his seminars if you like but again you can do all the things he will for yourself. As you say,money wasted now may indeed save some in the long run.never be afraid to ask any questions on here,no matter how daft it may seem to you.......someone else is bound to have asked it before and will have the answers.:D

Phyl x

Hi I agree with Phylis, dont use an agent. We did initially when we were looking at OZ, as hubby was over 45! We used a company in Egham called ****************, who too late found out they had not quite given us all the info we should have had to make our decision.(long story) but it meant things were alot more difficult than they had led us too believe. We ended up asking for a refund, very long process and then advised us they were closing the business, and 2+ yrs later we are £5000 lighter and still in the UK. But whats more annoying they still seem to be trading and we can do nothing, even the firm of accountants we were refered too dont answer us.
It can be done by yourselfs, save your money!

alchris Apr 27th 2009 7:44 pm

Re: Help needed - advice about dumping agent
 

Originally Posted by alchris (Post 7519828)
Hi I agree with Phylis, dont use an agent. We did initially when we were looking at OZ, as hubby was over 45! We used a company in Egham called ****************, who too late found out they had not quite given us all the info we should have had to make our decision.(long story) but it meant things were alot more difficult than they had led us too believe. We ended up asking for a refund, very long process and then advised us they were closing the business, and 2+ yrs later we are £5000 lighter and still in the UK. But whats more annoying they still seem to be trading and we can do nothing, even the firm of accountants we were refered too dont answer us.
It can be done by yourselfs, save your money!

Why has the name been *** out???
Going to try again as they have been a nightmare
IMMI GRATI ON UN IT.
NOW TO SEE IF THAT WORKS

daveandsarah Apr 27th 2009 9:56 pm

Re: Help needed - advice about dumping agent
 
Hello

Newbies on here, and am trawling the site looking for info about agents etc.
Have thought for a while that the cost of using them vs doing the paperwork yourself would probably be excessive - and lets face it, it's not in NZIS's interests to make it overly difficult.
We are going for our consultation on Wed to look at the various options - no huge cost so far.
(In chester if anyone has an opinion on that)

Anyway, I know get about 105 points without a job offer due to experience and related degree, but my occupation (Retail Buyer) is not on the skills list.

Question is, has ayone used the specific jobsearch facilities these agencies offer ??
As it is a farily specific and narrow role, I'm feeling this maybe worth it - especially if they are (so they tell me) working for you, not like the employment agencies who work for themselves and get paid by the recruiter...though it is obviously in their interests to get the right person.

Thoughts would be appreciated. :)

Thanks

helenlhoppy Apr 27th 2009 10:05 pm

Re: Help needed - advice about dumping agent
 
We went to Chester, Lower Bridge ST for a quote, free consultation thingy.... DONT DO IT THEY ARE TOO EXPENSIVE! You have to be really illiterate if you can't fill in the forms yourself... that's all they do for you. You still have to get all the documents and stuff yourself, they WILL NOT DO THAT FOR YOU! So, why waste your money, you will need every penny for when you get over there.

It's scandalous how much they charge and they CANNOT GUARUNTEE any more than if you do it yourselves. :sneaky:

Lizaberry Apr 28th 2009 12:02 am

Re: Help needed - advice about dumping agent
 
Ok, so had phone call from our case officer earlier who had no idea that I have advised MB we want out. Kept conversation to a quick 2 minute call. Said she would let the accounts team know. Later had an email from the credit controller advising that as work had already commenced on our account she would have to wait for the invoice to be submitted before she could determine who owed what to whom. Still not sure what we are doing. Was in touch with NewlifeinNewZealand earlier. They have a fixed fee of £3995 which is better though still a lot I know, paid in 2 instalments. One at the start and then the remainder once the visa comes through. The lady I spoke to sounded really genuine. Also had email response from Paul Goddard too - very helpful and had planned to ring and chat with him tonight but time ran away with me. OH is of the opinion we can do this ourselves, just like so many of you. Better start job hunting so we can get that expression of interest underway! Thanks again folks!!! L

getmethere Apr 28th 2009 9:51 am

Re: Help needed - advice about dumping agent
 
hi there

we have done the whole process so far all on our own with help from this forum and others like it. we have found the NZIS website very helpful (if a little confusing at times - hence the help needed from the forum).

from what I have heard, most of the agents charge an aweful lot of money but you are still required to do quite a bit of work yourself so I really don't know what they could be charging for. the immigration fees you have to pay out to NZIS are already high enough without adding extra on top of it.

my advice to you would be SAVE the money, don't go through an agent. If you are prepared to spend up to £4000 for an agent to do the immigration process for you, why don't you instead put that money towards a recce trip out to NZ to investigate things for yourself and see if you can't get a job offer at the same time which would give you enough points and you can then put your EOI in or a WTR visa etc.

good luck

Lizaberry Apr 28th 2009 10:11 am

Re: Help needed - advice about dumping agent
 

Originally Posted by getmethere (Post 7521703)
hi there

we have done the whole process so far all on our own with help from this forum and others like it. we have found the NZIS website very helpful (if a little confusing at times - hence the help needed from the forum).

from what I have heard, most of the agents charge an aweful lot of money but you are still required to do quite a bit of work yourself so I really don't know what they could be charging for. the immigration fees you have to pay out to NZIS are already high enough without adding extra on top of it.

my advice to you would be SAVE the money, don't go through an agent. If you are prepared to spend up to £4000 for an agent to do the immigration process for you, why don't you instead put that money towards a recce trip out to NZ to investigate things for yourself and see if you can't get a job offer at the same time which would give you enough points and you can then put your EOI in or a WTR visa etc.

good luck

Thanks. Saving the money and putting it towards a trip over there to secure work is exactly what I think the money would be better put towards. There is only so much an agent can do for us at this stage before they are faced with the same problem as us - not enough points to get even the EOI submitted.

I feel so deeply frustrated that I can't put it into words how much a shame it is that my OH spent 4 years on an in-house apprenticeship between 1979-1983 but came away without the piece of paper that NZ authorities need in order to give him qualification points for it. He has on headed paper a letter from the employer confirming completion of this apprenticeship dated July 1983 detailing the skills he attained, etc. Just a shame we can't do anything with it. Have now just come off the phone to the Falmouth Marine School near to us to see if they have any advice or solutions to help our problem.

It is all about timing. I can't imagine an employer considering offering my OH a job at the moment if we don't really want to plan to be there until next June/July time (2010). I guess an agent working alongside employers may be able to help with this. Certainly the New Life in New Zealand people offer job search help and once you have paid the first instalment on your fees (about £2k), they don't get the balance until you get your visa, so it is in their best interest to support you as much as they can. This is the only thing that tempts me to go with them - the support they could give us with the front end of our process - I have no problem with the forms, etc. and would be happy to do that myself, just a shame I can't buy in to only the services I need. Not so much pay as you go like with MB, more like pay for what you need. Is it too soon to be trying to secure work right now or should we leave it a while?

getmethere Apr 28th 2009 10:19 am

Re: Help needed - advice about dumping agent
 
from what i understand - the agents who offer to find your work alongside your visa application will only take you on if they think you have a pretty good chance at success so . . have a good chat to the agent and see what they feel about your application. like you said - you only pay the balance once your visa has been secured and it can't hurt to at least have an initial assessment of what they feel your chances would be like.

many people i have heard of had plenty of work experience but lacked the formal qualifications to apply for the skilled migrant route (this seems particularly true for trades or IT professionals where the qualfications need to be directly linked to the work experience). quite a few took a chance and went to NZ and were offered work based on their experience so . . there is always hope!!

chin up and good luck. we all have our ups and downs with this visa process and if you persevere you will hopefully get there in the end.

Lizaberry Apr 28th 2009 10:25 am

Re: Help needed - advice about dumping agent
 
where abouts are you in the process now? Do you have a job offer? If so, how soon into the process did you get it or start applying for it? Hope you don't mind me asking, but as I said in my previous post, I just don't know if we are asking too much of an employer to consider holding a job open for my husband now? Thanks again, L

getmethere Apr 28th 2009 10:33 am

Re: Help needed - advice about dumping agent
 
Hi lizaberry

no, we don't have a job offer. we have tried to apply for a few jobs from the UK however, mostly no-one has been interested because we a) do not have visas yet and b) are not based in NZ already.

It has been quite disheartening HOWEVER we applied for skilled migant visas last year in July (submitted EOI) and got an ITA in September which we then took a while to get all the information together and we submitted our ITA in December. Now we are just waiting and waiting and waiting to be assigned a case officer and see what their decision will be. we only had 105 points but my OH has a qualification in an area of absolute skills shortage (environmental science) so we got bonus points and were selected based on that.

the waiting is killing me, just want to hear word - any word. i feel like my life is in limbo at the moment.

once we've got PR or WTR then we plan a trip to see if we can find jobs.

Lizaberry Apr 28th 2009 10:39 am

Re: Help needed - advice about dumping agent
 
Well best of luck. I hope you hear something soon :fingerscrossed:. Oh well, if your example is anything to go by, we may never even get to submit our EOI :lol: Wouldn't that be sweet, not! Guess the best thing we can do is get him over there for a trip and see what comes from it. Do you know much about what constitutes a job offer - what conditions does NZ immigration set in order to accept it as part of your application/evidence?

Persephone Apr 28th 2009 11:44 am

Re: Help needed - advice about dumping agent
 
Hi,
What about going to NZ for a visit nearer the time that you want to emigrate, getting the names of potential employers and sending out CVs to them just beforehand. You can state that you'll be in NZ for the relevant dates and see what comes up. I presume boat building is quite a specialised area and so there may well be employers who will go on his experience more than quals
Should you be successful and get an offer then you can either apply for work visas or send in an EOI then[ dependent on your starting date].
You can always send in an EOI and apply for a work visa at the same time. I don't know where you stand on the work visa front as without quals the employer may have to prove no Kiwi can do the job. If you are on either of the essential skills in demand lists then this is not necessary.
It is a shame that you cannot just use an agent for their job hunting experience:thumbdown:. Paying the amount you've mentioned is ridiculous for what is involved in sending in an application to NZIS. I work in a relatively small profession which is on the LTSSL. I came over to NZ last year and sent out CVs and covering letters explaining my situation to all the potential employers in the area. Six in total: got one job offer[:thumbsup:], 4 "chats" should a job come up nearer the time and one who sent an email saying I would be considered if a job should become available. It may work for your husband, it does depend on the profession I think. Though as boat builders are on the LTSSL then his experience may just speak for itself:thumbup:

A job offer has to be fulltime [>30 hours per week], salaried and be for > 12months duration. If on contract work then this has to be sustainable.

Found this on the ANZSCO page- may be worth asking about the part I've underlined. If you don't go with an agent then contact NZIS directly. May be worth checking even at £1/min as if that will count then you may get the bonus points. I don't know enough about it to know whether it will count so worth getting NZIS to give an opinion, or maybe someone else on here can help:thumbsup: The worst they can do is say no:unsure:

Contents >> Major Group 3 Technicians and Trades Workers >> SUB-MAJOR GROUP 39 Other Technicians and Trades Workers >> MINOR GROUP 399 Miscellaneous Technicians and Trades Workers >> UNIT GROUP 3991 Boat Builders and Shipwrights
UNIT GROUP 3991 BOAT BUILDERS AND SHIPWRIGHTS


BOAT BUILDERS AND SHIPWRIGHTS construct, fit out and repair boats and ships.
Indicative Skill Level:
Most occupations in this unit group have a level of skill commensurate with the qualifications and experience outlined below.

In Australia:

AQF Certificate III including at least two years of on-the-job training, or AQF Certificate IV (ANZSCO Skill Level 3)

In New Zealand:
NZ Register Level 4 qualification (ANZSCO Skill Level 3)

At least three years of relevant experience may substitute for the formal qualifications listed above. In some instances relevant experience and/or on-the-job training may be required in addition to the formal qualification.
Registration or licensing may be required.


Tasks Include:

studying plans and specifications, and preparing templates and scale plans for fabrication and cutting of hull sections
marking reference points and lines on dry docks and slipways
checking position and functioning of slipway apparatus
assembling shells of boats and erecting hull sections of ship
erecting and preparing launching platforms, conducting pre-launch tests and supervising launching procedures
installing masts, frames, decking, fittings, machines, shafts and safety equipment
building and installing structures such as cabins, machine mountings, propeller supports and rudders
determining repair requirements and procedures
may make hull moulds and fabricate and repair vessels using materials such as aluminium, wood, glass, reinforced plastics, carbon fibre, Kevlar, fibreglass and concrete

Occupations:
399111 Boat Builder and Repairer
Don't worry about proving your English speaking ability. You tick the box on your EOI which says you "meet the minimum standard" , a box will pop up asking you to justify that. I wrote something about having lived in the UK my whole life, I was born to English speaking parents and all my education was in English. NZIS look at factors such as where you were born and which countries you've lived in so unless either of you were born in a non English speaking country then you shouldn't have to sit a test:rofl:
As everyone else has said, look at doing it yourself and save the money:thumbup: I know I keep saying it :lol: but if you start an EOI and look at the form then you can see what it involves. Do it bit by bit and save it.
All the best
Sue:D

Lizaberry Apr 28th 2009 11:56 am

Re: Help needed - advice about dumping agent
 
Thank you Sue, that's really sweet of you to find this out for me. I had seen something about the bit you had underlined but because the EOI asks specifically for the basic qualification we have had to say no. If you go by work experience, I think nearly 30 years in the trade should do it. I may drop NZIS a line - email them for some advice. I did speak with the local marine school in Cornwall who are going to get a lecturer to call me. Also sent a query to the Boat Industry Training Organisation as they have a hand in this National Certificate thing. Also posted a query to the qualifications reassessment people too just to see if there is anything we could do. I will get on to the NZIS for sure. If we could tick the box and then send supporting evidence that would suffice that would be fantastic - suddenly things could be up and running again. I also think a trip to NZ has to be given priority if nothing more than to show my husband's face and get him known. As you rightly said, the profession is very specialised and he could do it standing on his head (though I wouldn't advise it). He was born to be a boat builder. He has been surrounded by boats all of his life and you can see the dedication and commitment in the work he produces. I am a very proud wifey! Anyway thank you again. Have a few emails/calls I am waiting on so I'll keep you posted. Will also get an email to NZIS and see what they have to say. Regards, L:thumbup:

Lizaberry Apr 28th 2009 1:27 pm

Re: Help needed - advice about dumping agent
 
Just to let you know that I have now sent an email to the NZ Immigration Team about my OH's apprenticeship, etc. As I explained to them, I am not trying to beat the system but just get some recognition. I figure we have nothing to lose. As far as we're concerned, we can't see a way of being able to claim anything - it's not as though he is a cowboy and has been self-taught! If anything should come from it, it will be a bonus but we aren't pinning any hopes on it. Will keep you posted ...:thumbsup:

Lizaberry May 5th 2009 9:05 am

OMG, how much! Final settlement bill just in.
 
For those following my thread from earlier last week, you may recall that we had taken a U-turn to cease contact with our agent after hearing/reading some unsettling things about them - mainly to do with costs and things that people had been charged for (digital storage of documents, letters about things they didn't even ask for, etc.) and a general feeling of uncertainty about their fee policy. We paid them £950 about 2 weeks ago - 65% to be offset against the first invoice and the balance to be held as security/applied to final invoice. We weren't sure what to expect as a settlement figure as we kept being told that work had already begun on our case, but this morning I have opened up an email from their accounts department looking for a final settlement figure of £572.16. So a total of £1522.16. I feel like we have been seen off. I know that they have done some stuff for that money but never enough to justify such fees. Has anyone else faced this situation? A few days ago my OH said if they want anymore money they ain't getting it but I get really worried about things like this and wonder whether we can challenge them on their fee. Funny thing was, a few days ago I got a call from their UK based office offering us 20% off all future invoices if we decided to continue with them! Are they desparate for the business or what! Any how, I guess even if you add to this figure the cost of all the other bits we have to get done, it still works out cheaper than if we had gone with them. I am just left at home today feeling really empty and worried about the whole thing. Just hope we haven't made a really expensive mistake!! Thanks for listening, L :(


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