Complicated (?) partner question

Old Mar 31st 2009, 4:45 am
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Default Complicated (?) partner question

Hallo, I'm new (see Introductions) and would very much value your comments on the following please...

I understand that you have to prove that you live with your partner (de facto partnership). He and I have lived together for two years but have no joint paperwork, owing to us having 2 houses when we met and never having got around to it!!

But I have been offered a totally dream job in Christchurch after 6 months of interviews and paperwork! Of course I am not going to say no

I do not think we can get Neil in as a Partner. I can prove we swap money between bank accounts and that I pay some of the bills at his house (where we live) plus friends etc would swear we were living together. I do understand that this is "soft" evidence. However, we are totally happy to get married, right now. He proposed to me last summer anyway, and I have had my diamond ring on since then.

Questions:
1) accepting the fact that we can't prove 12 months living together, would getting wed now help?
2) Is it worth Neil coming to NZ on a tourist visa only, and would he be able to seek work and process his application in NZ as my husband?
3) Is this complicated enough to warrant using an agent?

Many thanks people
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Old Mar 31st 2009, 5:58 am
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Default Re: Complicated (?) partner question

This is only my opinion but I don't see getting wed now as helping in any way to prove your past 12 months of relationship.

It would be far better for your OH to come in on the back of your application. I'm assuming here that you want to go for PR - Permanent Residency.

Even if you are intending to arrive on a temporary work visa , it would be better for your OH to come in on the back of that and gain an open work visa allowing him to take up any work here in NZ.

Not sure it's worth employing an agent at this stage to be honest. The agent would still have to prove the same thing .

There are a number of ways you can show that your relationship is enduring .

As you have two houses, do you rent out one of them? You could show that you don't live in separate houses if you can show there is a tenant in one .
Photos help. Have you dated photos of the engagement and a receipt for the huge rock on your finger.
Prove you pay bills at his house via your bank statement . Match the outgoing to the utility bill.
Letters to you at his address.
It won't be the usual paperwork like a marriage cert or joint utility bills but I am sure you must have enough proof if you dig around and think about it to show the relationship has been around the past 12 months at least.

Here is the list from NZIS

A Partner may be either legally married, or in a civil union, or in a de facto partnership (whether opposite or same sex).

C6 Genuine and stable relationship


You may apply for residence at any time under this policy, but to be granted residence you must meet all policy requirements and have been living
together in a genuine and stable relationship for at least 12 months.

Acceptable evidence you and your partner are in a genuine and stable
relationship includes:

• marriage certificate (if married)
• civil union certificate
• proof of shared residence (such as joint
mortgage or tenancy agreements or rent
book)
• financial dependence or interdependence
(proof of shared income or bank accounts, or
accounts that show money transfers between
your account and your partner’s account)
• birth certificates for your children
• any evidence of public or family recognition of
your relationship
• correspondence (including post-marked
envelopes) to you and your partner at the
same address
• photographs of you and your partner together
• evidence of the duration of your relationship
• the degree of commitment to a shared life
• the performance of household duties.
Please note: if you have been living apart
from your partner for any periods during your
relationship, you must also provide evidence of the
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Old Mar 31st 2009, 7:15 am
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Default Re: Complicated (?) partner question

Thanks for that.

We have photos galore, a twice weekly cleaner who remembers exactly when I moved in to his house, some evidence I have paid bills at the address we use (both houses are used, but we use his nearly all the time), we also belong to a website for bikers, and on looking we seem to have posted our whole history there, including - yes - a dated photo of the "rock"! I also can prove I paid for household items like a new fitted bedroom at his.

I have been in touch with PathfindersNZ who told me roughly the same thing. It's about "public recognition" and we reckon we have that in bucketloads: just no shared bills

Thanks again
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Old Mar 31st 2009, 7:28 am
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Default Re: Complicated (?) partner question

Hi there,
Bevs has pretty much said it all. I agree that getting married would probably not help much as you would still have to prove that you have lived together for 12m. This applies even if you've been married for years
What about bank statements/ personal mail/ tax notices from the Inland Revenue and so on that are addressed to you at your place of abode even though not addressed to both of you? If you both have the same then it puts you at the same address. What about your driving licences? I've just had a look at mine and that has my address and also the date of issue on it [that is when I changed to my last address and not the original date of issue all those years back]. That assumes you have changed it of course, it took me years to change mine
Joint invitations to weddings or parties? Receipts for holidays taken together-flight tickets or receipts often have both names on-would at least prove you were in a relationship even if not living together?

This may help. Looks like there may be a way round it if you're not convinced you can find enough proof

pg 18
Section H: Partner’s Identity
What are the minimum requirements for including my partner in my application
for residence?
A partner you are living with can be included in your application, and approved for residence, if:
• you have been living together in a genuine and stable partnership; and
• you have been living in the relationship for a minimum period of 12 months; and
• you and your partner meet the minimum requirements for ‘recognition of a partnership’ which is that:
• you are both aged 18 years or older at the time your application for residence is made, or if aged 16 or
17 years old, you have the support of your parent(s) or guardian(s); and
• you met prior to your application being made; and
• you are not close relatives (to see which close relationships do not meet partnership policy
requirements please refer to section F2.15(d) of (Immigration New Zealand Operational Manual).


What evidence of partnership do I need to supply?
You need to supply evidence of a genuine and stable partnership of at least 12 months with your partner. You
could show evidence of this by supplying the following:
• Marriage certificate (if married)
• Proof of shared residence (a joint mortgage, or tenancy agreements, or rent book)
• Financial dependence or interdependence (proof of shared income, or bank accounts, or accounts that
show money transfers to or from your account to your partner’s account)
• Birth certificates of your children
• Any evidence of public or family recognition of your relationship
• Correspondence (including post-marked envelopes) to you and your partner at the same address
• Photographs of you and your partner together
• Evidence of the duration of your relationship
• Evidence of the support of your parent(s) or guardian(s) if either of you are aged 16 or 17 years old.


What happens if I cannot meet the requirements for demonstrating a ‘genuine and stable partnership’?
If we are not satisfied you and your partner are living together in a partnership that is genuine and stable, your
partner will not be issued a residence visa or granted a residence permit.
Also, if you are claiming points for your partner’s current skilled employment in New Zealand, or offer of skilled employment
in New Zealand, their recognised qualification or close family, we will not be able to take these points into account when
determining whether you are eligible to apply for residence in New Zealand under Government residence policy.


What happens if I have been with my partner less than 12 months?
If INZ is satisfied you and your partner are living together in a partnership that is genuine and stable, but you have
been with your partner less than 12 months then:
• if approval of your application relies on points for your partner’s skilled employment in New Zealand, or offer
of skilled employment in New Zealand, their recognised qualification(s), or their close family, we will have to decline your application under Government Residence policy;
or
if approval of your application does not rely on gaining points for your partner’s skilled employment in New Zealand, or offer of skilled employment in New Zealand, their recognised qualification(s), or their close family, INZ may proceed with processing your application for residence, but defer the final decision on your partner’s application to allow you both to meet the 12-month qualifying period.

It is important to note that:
If your partner’s application for residence has been deferred, as described above, they could be issued with
a work visa or granted a work permit (once an application has been made). This visa or permit would be for a period that is long enough to allow you both to meet the qualifying 12-month partnership period, and to allow us
enough time to complete any further assessment of their residence application.
It would certainly be better for your partner to apply on the back of your application. What if you got PR and he came over on a visitor's visa but could not get work [depends on his occupation but may not be that easy if his job is not in demand] what would you do then? Easier to apply and try and dig out as much proof as possible even if it doesn't look like much.
All the best,
Let us all know how you get on
Sue
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Old Mar 31st 2009, 9:11 am
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Default Re: Complicated (?) partner question

Thanks again: we really truly have no shared correspondence at all at his house, except a Dogs Trust! We have two houses (one each when we met) and as I had no idea this was going to happen to us, we never bothered changing addresses for me.

But I can prove I bought large items for the house we share, we have joint motor insurance, loads and loads of photos, loads of provable joint travel, .... the agent I spoke to thought it would be OK, given what I told him.
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Old Mar 31st 2009, 9:30 am
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Default Re: Complicated (?) partner question

I would look on everything as evidence and give it them in bucket loads! Even the Dogs Trust stuff, its all proof. We were told relationship evidence was needed even though we had marriage cert and birth certificate of our daughter. Good luck.
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Old Mar 31st 2009, 9:34 pm
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Default Re: Complicated (?) partner question

Oh... Am interested...
Am waiting on my work visa & will lodge my partner's visa application on the back of mine...
While we do not currently live together due to work commitments (me in B'ham, him in London), but we have previously... Were housemates, then rent a flat together. Which we can proove by letters from former housemates & copy of flat rental agreement (1bed room!!) with both names.
Also, in the past 5 years, we took loads of holidays together. Have flights confirmation to add.
To this, we will add pictures, copy of bank statements showing transfers from me to him & vice versa... You guys have further ideas??

Then, it all comes down to your Case Officer...
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Old Mar 31st 2009, 11:42 pm
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Default Re: Complicated (?) partner question

More:

We adopted a dog together and the owners of the dogs home will write a letter to that effect.

We share car insurance (both named on two policies).

er, still thinking, but it seems to be a bit less daunting as I think about it. As my fiance said: we have history/evidence that you just can't make up!!
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Old Apr 1st 2009, 2:39 am
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Default Re: Complicated (?) partner question

Having been through this mill myself, I'm pretty sure you'll be ok with the stuff you've got.

When I was applying for PR (My Partner is a NZ Citizen) my case officer told me that they weren't in the business of breaking up genuine relationships, but were mainly concerned about stopping relationships of "convenience" if you know what I mean.

In all the time I've been reading this site, I dont think I've ever heard of anyone being refused PR on the grounds that NZIS didn't think their relationship was genuine. Has anyone else?
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Old Apr 1st 2009, 4:39 am
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Default Re: Complicated (?) partner question

Originally Posted by NakiMan View Post
Having been through this mill myself, I'm pretty sure you'll be ok with the stuff you've got.

When I was applying for PR (My Partner is a NZ Citizen) my case officer told me that they weren't in the business of breaking up genuine relationships, but were mainly concerned about stopping relationships of "convenience" if you know what I mean.

In all the time I've been reading this site, I dont think I've ever heard of anyone being refused PR on the grounds that NZIS didn't think their relationship was genuine. Has anyone else?
Phew I feel much better now

I am realising that they are just totally and utterly thorough, which, to be honest, seems a big hassle when coming to it for the first time, but we are pleased really, perhaps more checks like this could be made elsewhere in the world....
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Old Apr 1st 2009, 6:29 am
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Default Re: Complicated (?) partner question

If you both now feel you can do this yourselves to start with, then I am pleased.

It means that we are helping in our own small way.
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Old Apr 1st 2009, 10:21 am
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Default Re: Complicated (?) partner question

Sort of on a similar track. Myself and Jo are talking of getting married just before we emigrate ( we have to apply first etc...) Now would this screw things up if we're applyig with 2 differing names and want it changing just before we go? Or would it be best to get married and then sort out the name changing business when we arrive? I'm a nurse so i'll be the main visa applicant with Jo coming with me. organising the evidence shouldn't be a problem as we are getting everthing sorted at present in advance regarding evidence etc...
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Old Apr 1st 2009, 10:36 pm
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Default Re: Complicated (?) partner question

Originally Posted by Fungus and Jo View Post
Sort of on a similar track. Myself and Jo are talking of getting married just before we emigrate ( we have to apply first etc...) Now would this screw things up if we're applyig with 2 differing names and want it changing just before we go? Or would it be best to get married and then sort out the name changing business when we arrive? I'm a nurse so i'll be the main visa applicant with Jo coming with me. organising the evidence shouldn't be a problem as we are getting everthing sorted at present in advance regarding evidence etc...
Easey peasey. Just send in a certified copy of the marriage licence and proof of your ball and chain.
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Old Apr 2nd 2009, 3:11 pm
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Default Re: Complicated (?) partner question

Originally Posted by BEVS here View Post
Easey peasey. Just send in a certified copy of the marriage licence and proof of your ball and chain.
I have the ball and chain already. I'm a man who knows his place
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Old Apr 5th 2009, 6:59 pm
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Default Re: Complicated (?) partner question

Originally Posted by BEVS here View Post
the performance of household duties.
Does this include photos of OH ironing my big pants???
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