Citizenship Help Please

Old Oct 12th 2018, 12:12 pm
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Default Citizenship Help Please

I hope you can kindly help my niece with a dilemma she currently has. She has lived in New Zealand since April 2011, she has acquired PR and worked as she is a trained chef. She was and currently is living in Wellington with her partner. She came home in early 2017 for an operation that she needed, her father paid for her to have it done in the UK as she needed looking after by her mum and dad as she had no proper care in NZ. Before she left New Zealand Immigration said that there was no problem with her coming out of the country as she had obtained PR. Now back in New Zealand she would like to obtain Citizenship but when speaking with immigration they have said she needs to wait until 2023 as she has had a break from the country. She is absolutely devastated as she lived some of the life in New Zealand under very hard times but stayed as she wanted to make she had both PR and in time Citizenship which should have been granted around now. Immigration won't help her and her agent has said that she needs to pay for advice, which I think is unfair as she paid a lot of money to obtain her PR. She is very hardworking girl, and loves New Zealand. She went back to New Zealand in September of this year. Sorry for the long post and thank you in advance for any help.
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Old Oct 12th 2018, 9:24 pm
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Default Re: Citizenship Help Please

Unfair? I think the lady just needs to suck it up and wait for her time, the rules is the rules and nobody here can help her. Paying for advice is also likely to be wasted money.

Why is she so desperate for Citizenship? Ulterior motive? She can live and work here and has right to come an go freely if she has PR . Having citizenship adds no value other than being able to get a Kiwi passport or being able to move to Australia.
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Old Oct 12th 2018, 9:47 pm
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Default Re: Citizenship Help Please

https://www.govt.nz/browse/passports-citizenship-and-identity/nz-citizenship/requirements-for-nz-citizenship/presence-requirements/

no need for legal advise just read the criteria. As she has been out of the country she needs to reestablish her connection first. Why would they offer Citizenship with her not meeting the criteria and not contributing to the country.

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Old Oct 13th 2018, 2:44 am
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Default Re: Citizenship Help Please

First of all, Citizenship is nothing to do with Immigration so if she's taken advice from INZ previously then that could be a fatal mistake unless she has the advice in writing.
Citizenship eligibility etc is handled by the Citizenship Office - a specific department of the NZ Government.

It is pretty simple to answer :-
A person applying for citizenship by grant must have been in NZ, with Resident status (RV or PR) for at least 8 months in each of the previous 5 years. This is calculated by counting backwards from the date of application. Going overseas for business or holidays each year is fine so long as you don't stay away for more than 4 months in total each year. If you did, your eligibility is effectively severed and you'd have to start again.
However, it isn't as clear cut as that and there may still a chance given the circumstances. It may also be possible that she met the criteria before she left in 2017 and if she pledges that she intends to remain here forever and a day from now then she could still be granted Citizenship, but to find out she'd have to apply, ensure she provided and adequate explanation of her time outside of the country and hope the Citizenship Office approved as its a lot money to spend to get a decline.
As has been stated it also gives little benefit so no real reason to be upset about not being eligible. It won't allow her any more than PR allows other than eligibility to apply for an NZ passport. All up, from making the application for Citizenship, waiting for and attending the ceremony, to applying and getting an NZ passport will take maybe 9 months ?
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Old Oct 13th 2018, 5:32 am
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Default Re: Citizenship Help Please

I don't see what the stress is, the only thing citizenship will give her over PR is the ability to move to and work in Australia

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Old Oct 14th 2018, 6:45 pm
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Default Re: Citizenship Help Please

Immigration were right, she has PR so there was no problem with her getting back into the country as she already had PR.

Citizenship eligibility will come back in time - sounds like she was hoping to get citizenship before going somewhere else? If she isn't planning on leaving again for an extended period then its hard to see what the "devastating" issue is.
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Old Oct 17th 2018, 11:23 am
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Default Re: Citizenship Help Please

[QUOTE=Bo-Jangles;12576853]Unfair? I think the lady just needs to suck it up and wait for her time, the rules is the rules and nobody here can help her. Paying for advice is also likely to be wasted money.

Why is she so desperate for Citizenship? Ulterior motive? She can live and work here and has right to come an go freely if she has PR . Having citizenship adds no value other than being able to get a Kiwi passport or being able to move to Australia.[/QUO

Apologies for the delay in replying. She has a sister in Australia who is married with a child, her sister has citizenship in Oz. She does not want to live in Australia at present and could easily get over there as she has a skill that is needed and could get out there on a sponsored skills visa - she wants the option that if anything happens she can be in Australia easily later in life. There is no ulterior motive at all. She loves New Zealand.
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Old Oct 17th 2018, 11:27 am
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Default Re: Citizenship Help Please

Originally Posted by MrsFychan View Post
https://www.govt.nz/browse/passports-citizenship-and-identity/nz-citizenship/requirements-for-nz-citizenship/presence-requirements/

no need for legal advise just read the criteria. As she has been out of the country she needs to reestablish her connection first. Why would they offer Citizenship with her not meeting the criteria and not contributing to the country.
Apologies for the delay in replying. I get that completely, she has contributed a great deal to the country, she has worked full time since arriving and will continue to do so. She had to come home for an operation as she did not have the care to look after her out there, she will accept that she needs to wait until 2023 if needed, she loves NZ and would like to stay.

As explained to Bo-Jangles above she would just like to have this for the safety that if anything happened and she is needed in Australia for her sister/nephew she could get there/stay there without worry, she is not hoping to gain access to Australia to live, that is not what she wants at all. She loves New Zealand.
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Old Oct 17th 2018, 11:35 am
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Default Re: Citizenship Help Please

Originally Posted by escapedtonz View Post
First of all, Citizenship is nothing to do with Immigration so if she's taken advice from INZ previously then that could be a fatal mistake unless she has the advice in writing.
Citizenship eligibility etc is handled by the Citizenship Office - a specific department of the NZ Government.

It is pretty simple to answer :-
A person applying for citizenship by grant must have been in NZ, with Resident status (RV or PR) for at least 8 months in each of the previous 5 years. This is calculated by counting backwards from the date of application. Going overseas for business or holidays each year is fine so long as you don't stay away for more than 4 months in total each year. If you did, your eligibility is effectively severed and you'd have to start again.
However, it isn't as clear cut as that and there may still a chance given the circumstances. It may also be possible that she met the criteria before she left in 2017 and if she pledges that she intends to remain here forever and a day from now then she could still be granted Citizenship, but to find out she'd have to apply, ensure she provided and adequate explanation of her time outside of the country and hope the Citizenship Office approved as its a lot money to spend to get a decline.
As has been stated it also gives little benefit so no real reason to be upset about not being eligible. It won't allow her any more than PR allows other than eligibility to apply for an NZ passport. All up, from making the application for Citizenship, waiting for and attending the ceremony, to applying and getting an NZ passport will take maybe 9 months ?
Apologies for the delay in replying. I will show this to her, she is meeting with her immigration agent who is going to go down these lines, that she had to come home for a reason (no care to look her when out of hospital), she was in New Zealand without any break from 2011 to 2017 - back to NZ in September 2018 (she has spent more than 5 years in New Zealand without a break) so she has been there more than 5 years. She doesn't want any gratitude or special treatment, she just wants the capability of going to Australia if she was needed by her sister and nephew. She could easily get a sponsorship visa in Australia but she does not want that. She is a very hard working girl, and would not expect to be treated any differently. Thank you for your reply.
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Old Oct 17th 2018, 11:38 am
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Default Re: Citizenship Help Please

Originally Posted by Justcol View Post
I don't see what the stress is, the only thing citizenship will give her over PR is the ability to move to and work in Australia
Apologies for the delay in replying. She does not want to live in Australia, she could easily get a sponsorship visa as she has the necessary skills, but she wants the ability that if she ever needed to stay in Oz longer than the three months, she could as she has her sister and nephew there.

There is no ulterior motive she is very thankful she has PR in New Zealand she adores the place, and has made some amazing friends. Thank you.
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Old Oct 17th 2018, 11:47 am
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Default Re: Citizenship Help Please

Originally Posted by simonsi View Post
Immigration were right, she has PR so there was no problem with her getting back into the country as she already had PR.

Citizenship eligibility will come back in time - sounds like she was hoping to get citizenship before going somewhere else? If she isn't planning on leaving again for an extended period then its hard to see what the "devastating" issue is.
Apologies for the delay in replying. Sorry, I should have stated that she spoke with them about Citizenship and they said it would be fine as she had been in New Zealand without any break for 6 years. It seems now that it may be that she has to go to 2023 - her immigration agent is going to help her to see if as EscapedtoNZ said she could be reinstated if she pledges to stay in New Zealand. She loves the place, and raves about it, there is no ulterior motive at all and will have no problem waiting to 2023 if needed. She was devastated because she wants to get the Citizenship. We are a small family, so this is very important to her if she is ever needed in Oz to help her sister/nephew. Her mum and dad are moving to Australia in four years and having to pay a whacking amount of money for a parent visa, no one expects any special treatment at all, just the access to enter if ever the need arises for longer than three months.
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Old Oct 17th 2018, 7:54 pm
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Originally Posted by Cindyf67 View Post
Apologies for the delay in replying. Sorry, I should have stated that she spoke with them about Citizenship and they said it would be fine as she had been in New Zealand without any break for 6 years. It seems now that it may be that she has to go to 2023 - her immigration agent is going to help her to see if as EscapedtoNZ said she could be reinstated if she pledges to stay in New Zealand. She loves the place, and raves about it, there is no ulterior motive at all and will have no problem waiting to 2023 if needed. She was devastated because she wants to get the Citizenship. We are a small family, so this is very important to her if she is ever needed in Oz to help her sister/nephew. Her mum and dad are moving to Australia in four years and having to pay a whacking amount of money for a parent visa, no one expects any special treatment at all, just the access to enter if ever the need arises for longer than three months.
Personally I'd advise to stop paying immigration agents to do anything and save the money for an additional return flight to Oz if she ever is needed for >3mths before citizenship can be obtained. NZ is pretty clear on its rules and open in making them visible and accessible.
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Old Oct 18th 2018, 12:47 pm
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Default Re: Citizenship Help Please

Originally Posted by simonsi View Post
Personally I'd advise to stop paying immigration agents to do anything and save the money for an additional return flight to Oz if she ever is needed for >3mths before citizenship can be obtained. NZ is pretty clear on its rules and open in making them visible and accessible.
Thank you for your reply. She is going to see if they can do it sooner than the 2023 - but if not she is quite prepared to wait that time - she does not want any special treatment. She travels to Oz a couple of times a year to see her family - it was only if she was needed to stay longer than three months. Thank you for all our replies.
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Old Oct 18th 2018, 6:38 pm
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Originally Posted by Cindyf67 View Post
Thank you for your reply. She is going to see if they can do it sooner than the 2023 - but if not she is quite prepared to wait that time - she does not want any special treatment. She travels to Oz a couple of times a year to see her family - it was only if she was needed to stay longer than three months. Thank you for all our replies.
OK, I hope she doesn't get anywhere for the reasons that the rules are clear and one person's "waiver for good reasons" is another's loophole. Pretty sure it will be a waste of money paying an immigration agent to write a letter.
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