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Old Jul 16th 2008, 3:58 am
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Default working

I am new to this forum so any advice appreciated.

I have been in canada for nearly a year and have two teenagers.

They have been here since the end of last year and found employment really quickly we applied for LMO's which we now have and have a trip planned for the border to get the permits

My question is will there be an issue because they have been working since the beginning of the year. The companies have known what has been going on and have been taking tax from them.

Last edited by patcon; Jul 16th 2008 at 4:20 am.
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Old Jul 16th 2008, 4:07 am
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Default Re: working

Originally Posted by patcon
I am new to this forum so any advice appreciated.

I have been in canada for nearly a year and have two teenages.

They have been here since the end of last year and found employment really quickly we applied for LMO's which we now have and have a trip planned for the border to get the permits

My question is will there be an issue because they have been working since the beginning of the year. The companies have known what has been going on and have been taking tax from them.
Have I understood you correctly? Have your teenaged children been working without work permits? Will there be an issue? Yes, there will be an issue. And that is an understatement.
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Old Jul 16th 2008, 4:19 am
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Default Re: working

What would the consequences be then, is there anything I can do to resolve it?
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Old Jul 16th 2008, 4:21 am
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Default Re: working

Not to mention for their employer as well. The employer may have been taking tax, however without a SIN they would not have been able to remit it to CRA.
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Old Jul 16th 2008, 4:26 am
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Default Re: working

I think there's a good chance that, if you went to the Canada-USA border for a trip around the flagpole, your application for a work permit would be denied. You might be allowed back into Canada for a period that is just long enough to arrange for removalists and leave the country.

I don't know what the remedy is.

I would say you need an immigration lawyer.
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Old Jul 16th 2008, 4:34 am
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Default Re: working

How will they know that they have been working early?


As far as they will know we have LMO's and contracts ready to start employment
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Old Jul 16th 2008, 1:05 pm
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Default Re: working

Originally Posted by patcon
How will they know that they have been working early?


As far as they will know we have LMO's and contracts ready to start employment
well if the work is under the table as dey say, then i doubt they will know. so basically your kids have been there more than 6 months..

I quiet dont understand your question but your can take on Judy's advise and seek an immigration lawyer.......

you didnt explain yourself well.

good luck
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Old Jul 16th 2008, 1:19 pm
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Default Re: working

They are not working under the table , they are both paying tax but they don't have SIN numbers yet. The companies they are working for know the work permits are imminent. I must admit it was only supposed to be short term but the paperwork has taken longer than expected

The part I was trying to understand was why they are likely to be refused work permits at the border.

We will produce LMO's and contracts and I presumed the permits will be issued. Are they likely to ask if they have already started to work at these places? We were slightly concerned how things would work out at the end of the tax year.
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Old Jul 16th 2008, 4:35 pm
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Default Re: working

Originally Posted by patcon
They are not working under the table , they are both paying tax but they don't have SIN numbers yet. The companies they are working for know the work permits are imminent. I must admit it was only supposed to be short term but the paperwork has taken longer than expected

The part I was trying to understand was why they are likely to be refused work permits at the border.

We will produce LMO's and contracts and I presumed the permits will be issued. Are they likely to ask if they have already started to work at these places? We were slightly concerned how things would work out at the end of the tax year.
It is unlikely they will be considered as paying tax if they don't have a SIN, even if the employer is deducting it, they don't exist as far as CRA are concerned as it seems they are working illegally. When an employee is hired they should fill in a TD1 personal tax credit form plus a provincial one, otherwise they are not getting any personal allowance, a SIN is required. There is nowhere for CRA to allocate the tax collected by the employer on behalf of a Canadian resident without a SIN as reference. You might want to ask the employer if they are remitting the tax, CPP and EI contributions.

If they are unsure of your residency status, you could call the International Tax Services Office at 1-800-267-5177.

Arriving at the border asking for a work permit for a company you are already working for is likely to raise some questions. One usually arrives at the border to get a permit to be able to start work.

You may also want to speak to an accountant (not tax preparer) about the tax situation at the end of the year.

Last edited by Surrey Expat; Jul 16th 2008 at 4:37 pm.
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Old Jul 17th 2008, 1:04 am
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Default Re: working

Originally Posted by patcon
Are they likely to ask if they have already started to work at these places?
Not likely they'd ask that. Why would it even enter their heads?
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Old Jul 17th 2008, 1:38 am
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Default Re: working

I agree with dbd - they arent likely to assume they have already been working for the companies and since as others say the employers cant remit the tax to CRA without the employee having a social insurance number then there is probably nothing on record anywhere to indicate they have been working illegally. Unless there was actually an investigation (CIC decided to make some enquiries before issuing work permits) then it could be that nobody would know.

BUT, it is extremely dangerous and really a bit stupid to work illegally, especially when you expect to be able to get a work permit. Why not just wait until the permit is issued?

Your kids, if caught, will become Inadmissable to Canada because they havent complied with the Immigration Act which means that as well as being deported for working illegally would be unable to apply for Permanent Residency etc in the future. Furthermore, you would also become inadmissible to Canada because you have an Inadmissible family member. So thats your chances of immigrating to Canada or working here scuppered too!
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Old Jul 17th 2008, 2:59 am
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Default Re: working

Originally Posted by NSpaul
I agree with dbd - they arent likely to assume they have already been working for the companies and since as others say the employers cant remit the tax to CRA without the employee having a social insurance number then there is probably nothing on record anywhere to indicate they have been working illegally. Unless there was actually an investigation (CIC decided to make some enquiries before issuing work permits) then it could be that nobody would know.
Another occasion it could come up is if there is a payroll audit of the company and they are on record as being employees with no SIN. However as others have said this is low probability, but not impossible. It is very unwise to work illegally or employee illegally.
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Old Jul 17th 2008, 3:38 am
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Default Re: working

Originally Posted by NSpaul
BUT, it is extremely dangerous and really a bit stupid to work illegally, especially when you expect to be able to get a work permit. Why not just wait until the permit is issued?
In the course of my brother working illegally in Canada for ten years I met umpteen illegals, very few of whom ever ran into any sort of problem (typically when they did they got busted for a traffic offence and it all developed from there). However I agree, if you can get a work permit for what you need to run this risk?
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