farmgirl

I am not commenting here about the comparative levels of academic education between the two countries, except to say that kids appear to stay as "kids" for longer in the Canadian system, which personally I feel is a good thing, although I accept that is a matter of opinion.

And secondly, that the Canadian system in my (albeit limited) experience would appear to produce a more rounded, confident, community-minded individual than the UK, where too many kids leave school with low morale and expectations, and a feeling that the world owes them a living!

Morw.[/QUOTE]
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we have a 15 yr old been here 10 mths , was educated in private school in UK and we have found the education here to be better for science and maths but not so advanced for english literature, the difference is here the qualifications are modular , theres a min of credits you have to get your schol cert at 18 but if bright you can do them by age 17 ie year 11 and in year 11/12 move onto extra maths like calculus etc that is useful at uni, some schools do international baccaleureate which counts to your degree and saves you time at uni
its all based on credits and number of hours per course and if you dont get a good enough mark or fail its easy to resit as each module lasts a semester , theres 2 in a year rather than at gcse you have a 2 yrs build up to an exam
i think its less pressure for the kids as its broken down into manageable chunks , called math 10, math 20, math 30 all adds upto same as a gcse but theres 3 finals so one exam is not so make or break as gcse
the kids have more free time and are expected to do sport and do it seriously , football practise is 2 hrs every day . there seems to be more vocational training you can do weldingor accountancy in yr 12
i think its like the UK is heading with the majority of kids staying on in education

farmgirl

[kids being kids

i think this is so and am glad hes being allowed to have some fun

but he thinks he is treated more as a grownup by teachers than in uk , asked his opinion and given more responsibilty

Tiaribbon

Couldn't agree more. As I said in my initial post, this is why we are perfectly content for our daughter to 'take it easy for a year' (so to speak), to allow her to settle in without pressure and with children her own age.

She is a very well-rounded, bright and bubbly child who oozes confidence; just like our twin 20 year old sons.....and she can stand her ground with even them quite happily, lol!!

Rich_007

"Not sure where you were staying in the UK where you claim that half of the people could not write. I have never in my whole life met any adult who could not write, and I have been on this planet for 40 years. I'll take your word for it though......... "

Eek ! We live a few miles from an urban-peripheral community where 50% of the adults (in a study undertaken by the council last year) were illiterate! Yes, 50 %.

So, it is there if you look far enough into the grime and fuzz and scum and detritus of UK Inc.

ps -if you're wondering why 50% of the adults are illiterate, it's because they live in a run down ex mining community where their forefathers never needed to read-an-rite because it wasn't essential for the work, therefore their offspring were never overly educated or encouraged and this festering mindset has spun off down the years. Now the adults are on benefits/ heroin/crack and live miserable disability funded non-existencies. Guess they sit on their arses moaning about immigrants and yet have never lifted a finger to help themsleves. Oh, and there's a whole other alternative 'adult education' program going on about the black market, cheap fags, how scam your dole, where the latest nicked DVD's can be obtained, etc.

No worse than down on Hastings in Vancouver, but surely replicated all over the UK in towns, cities and villages, in this demotivated, blame focused, self pitying miserable bling obsessed C-list celeb worshipping decaying pityful UK culture.

Can't wait for the big silver plane and the one-way ticket.

"More to life".

Rich.

SANDRAPAUL

Wow!! I would get sent to my room (our room) by the wife if I did a rant like that.

Good one!

One way yes - just speed the bloody thing up!

Tiaribbon

Okay, I stand corrected that these people do in fact exist - my point was that I have never met them. Perhaps the poster who wrote about her dreadful experiences with the UK education system lived in an area like this.

The town we live near has a number of council estates and I have to say that the majority of these houses have BMW's and Range Rovers parked in their driveways and nicely spoken and well brought up, polite children playing in their gardens.......different world I guess.

the-smiths

Canada is not much different either, I don't know why peoplle have this image that everyone is polite and well educated. What you must remember is that most people here are immigrants from everywhere, and most have not been bothered learning english properly, and if they do speak english, it's the American way.

You can go all day without anyone saying please at a gas station, shops, in a lift, or excuse me when trying to get pass you. People even yawn without covering their mouths too. The ones that amaze us, are the ones that say to you, "have been here 30yrs", and when you listen to them, they still can't speak english properly, let alone french.

Don't bother using any solid english words, most don't know what it means. It's a big country alright, but we shouldn't think people are well mannered and polite, because that is not the case, it's only when you have lived here for a whole year, and not just on holiday, that you get to see these things. It's easy to just come on holiday, meet a few people, and assume everyone is ok, the same could be said for the UK.

Oh.....the wife just sent me out of the room. LOL.....just kidding

eila

NVQ = National Vocational Qualification. Level 4 - University level.

Working as a Residential Social Worker for adolescents with behaviour difficulties, it is now a requirement in UK to complete NVQ3- Caring for Children and Young People. For a Senior or Teamleader positions you have to posses NVQ4. I was employed by an educational institution. During my employment I met many collagues with very poor basic writing skills. Also I found poor language in many case histories and reports written by professionals. Hardly any of the teenagers (age 11-18) were able to write even simple words. During an anti-war rally some banners were incorrectly spelled. Here in Finland I have done some shifts in elementary school as a substitute Teacher so gaining valuable insight for our current education system.

You might want to look at : http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk... where UK is ranked 7th on education by UN, while Canada takes the 4th place.

There was also an interesting article at The Times on 31.02.2003 by Tony Halpin about new proposal for English Baccalaureate....

..." is considering the inclusion of a compulsorary paper in critical thinking that would be equal in content to additional A level. The paper would be similar to the requirements in the International Baccalaureate..."
..." To qualify for consideration they would have to study more broadly and in greater depth than under the present system..."
..." Ministers would be certain to welcome a Baccalaureate that was tougher than A levels.They could use the more demanding requirements of the new curriculum to reject allegations that Universities are under pressure to "dumb down" in order to broaden access to poorer students from underachieving schools."

I think when a person does a statement such as Canada having a lower level of education not based on hard facts, but only an opinion, it is a fairly good example of that typical supremacy some individual Brits feel towards other nations.

FYI: I have lived in East Knoyle, Sherborne, Yeovil, Weymouth, Bournemouth, and Bristol. I have conducted my work around Taunton, Yeovil, and Shaftesbury. My contacts have been accross UK.

And yes, Central London is tolerable, but South London is a bit different story.

In Canada I did my practicum at Mental Health Drop-in, next to needle Park in Vancouver, so I have seen some Canadian misery too.

I have travelled in 20+ countries, and UK is by far the most scariest. Even spending a night alone in Harlem streets, and an adventure on my own in Cambodia did not make me so worried.

Tiaribbon

Goodness! So what do I do to prove my hard facts? I have been into 3 schools in Canada and in every single case, the curriculum has been that Grade 4 and Grade 5 level of schooling has been exactly the same as the syllabus my daughter is covering as an 8 year old child in the UK. The Education Board in Canada assessed her and agreed that her academic qualities were of Grade 5 (Canadian) standard and although could not put her into Grade 5 as the age difference would be too great, they offered her to enter into Grade 4. As far as my intelligence and pure and simple common-sense spells out, I am not alone in believing that her education here in the UK is at a far higher level than her same-age peers in Canada. That is hard facts! What you believe of me is irrelevant, but are you claiming that the Ontario and British Columbia Education Boards are talking rubbish and that you are in fact more knowledgeable and aware than them?

By the way, I do not believe that my child is any sort of super intelligent child - she is just a normal 8 year old child following the same curriculum as all the other 8 year old children in the UK.

the-smiths

This link was helpful to us, when we were getting our now 8yr old into school here in Canada. Oh....and for those in the UK, that complain about things being translated in various languages, look to the right of the link to see how many languages the article in translated into. LOL

http://www.settlement.org/site/ED/GU...m/contents.asp

Tiaribbon

Just had a quick peek and that looks like a wonderful link, thank you. Will have a good read of it later this evening.

eila

I trust more for UN report than your personal statement based on subjective experience. Remember also that in Canada they start school later so your kid should enter higher grade. You do know what scientific research based on large enough group does mean, right? Remember also that some kids might be assesed to be ready for higher grade in UK as well. Also curriculums can be different. Some schools also consider children's maturity in regards to subjects to study in certain grades. It is the end result that matters.

Tiaribbon

Ahhh! So we both agree with what I stated earlier...... that I was happy to continue down this route even though my daughter would be receiving a lower level of education. Why you chose to get so excited about this fact in the first place only to rescind now, is beyond me.

The 'hard fact' is that my daughter will be taking a step back in her education when she starts in January. I clearly stated from the beginning of my discussion with you that I had an 8 year old daughter who would be studying at well below her academic capabilities. I am well aware of the fact that in the US and Canada children rarely leave school at 16 as is often the case in the UK, therefore any child who remains in school for 3 or 4 years longer than this is obviously going to achieve more academically but perhaps will be less equipped with the life-skills that the earlier leavers have gained.

The manipulation of statistics are of no consequence to me I'm afraid. Reality and the locality of where I live, are far more important. As another poster mentioned, you can have statistics thrown at you from all angles but it is never a substitute for real-life experiences.

eila

No, you said "even taking into account the lower level of education in Canada"
not lower level of education for your kid.

With the end result I mean graduation at a course of same level regardless of age.

I can see you base everything on your personal opinion. Well, I am sure that if your daughter decides to pursue education in University whether in Canada or UK, she will still need to learn how to conduct a real scientific research.

If I was born and raised at a small community where there was only women and no news and information from outside, I might even think all people are women everywhere in the world. Of course I could also draw conclusions from my experiences in UK, and say ALL British teenagers are violent.

I get only heated up because of your somewhat superior attitude. Now tell me please how many British people can actually speak a foreign language fluently?

By the way, did you know that Einstein did not do very well at school as a kid.

Tiaribbon

My quote is "from the beginning of my discussion with you" ie. meaning the first discussion I had with you and no other members of the forum. When you read my first post which was not directed to you, you assumed that I mean't the whole of the system and jumped in feet first without actually having all the facts in front of you.

I base things on my 40 years of life experiences and research and what I see around about me. I do not base things purely on statistics.

How condescending you are: My child is very much her own person, (as are my 20 year olds) and will make her own mind up about what she wishes to do and what makes sense to her. Social worker is that what you are? Can't bear anyone to get on in life and make their own decisions and form their own opinions without your "help"?

Why? Because many people would be able to read my words with a lot more clarity than you? Or that I remain calm throughout discussions whilst you are jumping about and getting all flustered and almost on the verge of throwing back some insults............I wait with baited breath.

I have no idea but I have a funny feeling that you, being so intelligent, will be able to tell me the exact figure of how many British people can speak a foreign language.......and which languages these are. Hope you included my languages when you performed your study?

Wonderful news.............that must help your 'illiterates' feel so much better about themselves. Or could it just be that old dog creeping in again?