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Visitor in Canada while waiting for BC PNP, LMO

Visitor in Canada while waiting for BC PNP, LMO

Old Aug 5th 2013, 6:32 am
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Question Visitor in Canada while waiting for BC PNP, LMO

Hi all

Okay, based a lot of searching in this excellent forum, can I ask for comments on this plan?
  • I have accepted a job offer from an employer in Vancouver.
  • They have applied for an LMO (they have previously been granted others and know the process).
  • They have also provided me with the necessary documents for a BC PNP application and I'm going to run that in parallel with the LMO.
  • I'm planning to arrive in Canada in about eight weeks as a visitor (assuming that the LMO or PNP nomination aren't through, otherwise it's easy).
  • I have plenty of funds to support myself, and also do online consulting work for a company in Australia (but not for Canadian clients) and am planning to continue that while I'm a visitor (i.e., I'm not working in Canada)
  • When my LMO is granted, I'm going to flagpole to get my TWP.
  • I'm a UK citizen (actually dual UK/Australian).
  • I'm renting in Perth, Australia and will be giving up the lease when I leave, so technically I won't have a residential Australian address.
  • I'll be staying with friends in Canada, so no immediate need to rent.

From other posts, I have seen advice that I should have a return ticket (to Australia, which is where I live at the moment); is that true?

At POE, I assume it's appropriate to be open about what I'm doing, so what documentary evidence should I have? At that time I will have a BC PNP application in progress, and I of course have a job offer letter. I imagine that proof of funds would be a good idea?

Cheers
ben

Last edited by benlast; Aug 5th 2013 at 6:34 am. Reason: Clarified last paragraph
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Old Aug 5th 2013, 10:06 am
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Default Re: Visitor in Canada while waiting for BC PNP, LMO

I am not expert and so hopefully someone with more knowledge will be along. But even if you are not working for a Canadian company, if your working in Canada albeit online then your still be working in Canada so you technically will not be a visitor.
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Old Aug 5th 2013, 10:22 am
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Default Re: Visitor in Canada while waiting for BC PNP, LMO

Originally Posted by Mikeypm View Post
I am not expert and so hopefully someone with more knowledge will be along. But even if you are not working for a Canadian company, if your working in Canada albeit online then your still be working in Canada so you technically will not be a visitor.
Hm - I'd read on at least one other thread that as long as I'm working for a company that's not in Canada, for clients that aren't in Canada, that's okay. Unless I stay long enough to become resident for tax purposes...

Cheers
b
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Old Aug 5th 2013, 10:27 am
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Default Re: Visitor in Canada while waiting for BC PNP, LMO

Originally Posted by benlast View Post
Hm - I'd read on at least one other thread that as long as I'm working for a company that's not in Canada, for clients that aren't in Canada, that's okay. Unless I stay long enough to become resident for tax purposes...

Cheers
b
Not sure, BUT if you are in Canada, and working for anyone, no matter who or where, you are technically working in Canada.
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Old Aug 5th 2013, 10:34 am
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Default Re: Visitor in Canada while waiting for BC PNP, LMO

Originally Posted by mikelincs View Post
Not sure, BUT if you are in Canada, and working for anyone, no matter who or where, you are technically working in Canada.
That was my understanding also Mike, unless anyone else on the forum has any input to shed a different light on this?
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Old Aug 5th 2013, 10:35 am
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Default Re: Visitor in Canada while waiting for BC PNP, LMO

Originally Posted by mikelincs View Post
Not sure, BUT if you are in Canada, and working for anyone, no matter who or where, you are technically working in Canada.
That seems to contradict the advice given on this thread:
1. Working online for a UK company and not serving Canadian customers is an activity you can legitimately do as a visitor.
2. If you start serving Canadian customers while in Canada you can be viewed as entering the Canadian labour market and in that situation you need a work permit.
I'd be doing the equivalent of 1, and definitely not doing 2.

Worst case, I just don't do the consultancy work: I have funds enough.
Cheers
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Old Aug 5th 2013, 10:49 am
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Default Re: Visitor in Canada while waiting for BC PNP, LMO

Originally Posted by benlast View Post
That seems to contradict the advice given on this thread:

I'd be doing the equivalent of 1, and definitely not doing 2.

Worst case, I just don't do the consultancy work: I have funds enough.
Cheers
b
Maybe worth waiting for FL or PMM to weigh in on this thread
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Old Aug 5th 2013, 10:52 am
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Default Re: Visitor in Canada while waiting for BC PNP, LMO

Originally Posted by benlast View Post
That seems to contradict the advice given on this thread:

I'd be doing the equivalent of 1, and definitely not doing 2.

Worst case, I just don't do the consultancy work: I have funds enough.
Cheers
b
The comment made on that thread does not give any link to any Canadian Immigration site, so should be taken with a pinch of salt.
I suspect that what you are talking about os one of those grey areas.
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Old Aug 5th 2013, 11:00 am
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Default Re: Visitor in Canada while waiting for BC PNP, LMO

Originally Posted by mikelincs View Post
The comment made on that thread does not give any link to any Canadian Immigration site, so should be taken with a pinch of salt.
I suspect that what you are talking about os one of those grey areas.
Ah, grey areas are what come to bite us Though the poster who gave the advice I quoted is an ICCRC member.

I guess it's along the same lines as someone who comes on vacation and continues to do work for their company back in the UK (i.e., takes phone calls, maybe fires up the laptop). They are "working while in Canada" but they're not in the Canadian workforce.

Cheers
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Old Aug 5th 2013, 11:19 am
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Default Re: Visitor in Canada while waiting for BC PNP, LMO

Ah, I've now found the relevant BE Wiki page:
Page 26 of Citizenship and Immigration Canada's Foreign Worker Manual provides a definition, description and examples of work that visitors are not allowed to do. In essence, the work that a visitor is not allowed to do is any economic activity that involves competing with Canadian workers in the labour market. Another way of looking at it is any activity that has the potential to take work away from Canadian workers. One of the few exceptions to the prohibition against a visitor's working in Canada is long distance (by telephone or internet) work done by a temporary resident whose employer is outside Canada and who is remunerated from outside Canada.
And that last sentence describes exactly the situation I'm looking at.

Cheers
b

Last edited by benlast; Aug 5th 2013 at 11:19 am. Reason: Added link to Wiki page
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Old Aug 5th 2013, 12:10 pm
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Default Re: Visitor in Canada while waiting for BC PNP, LMO

Originally Posted by benlast View Post
Ah, I've now found the relevant BE Wiki page:


And that last sentence describes exactly the situation I'm looking at.

Cheers
b
Best to send a PM to FL or PMM to get a deffintive answer
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Old Aug 5th 2013, 12:12 pm
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Default Re: Visitor in Canada while waiting for BC PNP, LMO

For CIC purposes working online for a company based outside Canada and being paid by that company is not considered working in Canada as you are not working or being paid by a Canadian company.
As long as you have sufficient evidence to show CBSA on arrival that an LMO has been applied for along with the PNP nomination then you should be ok.
A return ticket is not mandatory due to your circumstances.

Taken from the Foreign Workers manual
Work” is defined in the Regulations as an activity for which wages are paid or commission is earned, or that competes directly with activities of Canadian citizens or permanent residents in the Canadian labour market.
Examples of activities for which a person would not normally be remunerated or which would not compete directly with Canadian citizens or Permanent Residents in the Canadian labour market and which would normally be part-time or incidental to the reason that the person is in Canada include, but are not limited to:
long distance (by telephone or internet) work done by a temporary resident whose employer is outside Canada and who is remunerated from outside Canada;
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Old Aug 5th 2013, 11:24 pm
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Default Re: Visitor in Canada while waiting for BC PNP, LMO

Thanks, FL - an excellent and authoritative answer

I think I'm going to ask Air Canada for a statement also, on the return ticket thing (and of course I'd post it in here for future reference). EDIT: I called them, and they were remarkably unhelpful. At first they said they wouldn't comment, then they said I needed to speak to another department and finally they referred me to the CIC website.

Originally Posted by Former Lancastrian View Post
As long as you have sufficient evidence to show CBSA on arrival that an LMO has been applied for along with the PNP nomination then you should be ok.
A return ticket is not mandatory due to your circumstances.
A quick followup question: if I have applied for the PNP but not yet been nominated, does that change things?

Cheers
b

Last edited by benlast; Aug 5th 2013 at 11:48 pm.
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Old Aug 6th 2013, 12:27 am
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Default Re: Visitor in Canada while waiting for BC PNP, LMO

Originally Posted by benlast View Post
Thanks, FL - an excellent and authoritative answer

I think I'm going to ask Air Canada for a statement also, on the return ticket thing (and of course I'd post it in here for future reference). EDIT: I called them, and they were remarkably unhelpful. At first they said they wouldn't comment, then they said I needed to speak to another department and finally they referred me to the CIC website.



A quick followup question: if I have applied for the PNP but not yet been nominated, does that change things?

Cheers
b
Some airline carriers are sticky about no return tickets others are ok without one. As for the PNP it would be up to the examining officer on how they deal with allowing you in and for what timeframe. Extensions can also be applied for once in Canada or simply leaving then re-entering (no time frame).
All entry into Canada unless a citizen or PR is at the discretion of an officer even if authorized to work or study as a person can become inadmissible after being allowed entry or just before entering.
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Old Aug 6th 2013, 8:23 pm
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Default Re: Visitor in Canada while waiting for BC PNP, LMO

Well we will find out tomorrow when we check in at Manchester with Icelandic Air. I emailed them all our immigration documents and MPNP letter of nomination, they sent us an email allowing us to board on a one way ticket, they have also made a note on our booking, so that check in staff are aware. Taking the email though just in case

Hopefully CBSA will be happy with my E-cas screen shot, medical insurance, funds and the fact they we are a couple of months away from PPR I will post how I get on in the next couple of days

Regards

Andrew
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