JaffaMafia

Biiiiink. I'm not a police officer but I do work in the Information Management Team at Staffs police.

The new change in the Subject Access process is that a few weeks ago a pilot scheme was launched by ACRO - the ACPO Criminal Records Office in conjunction with the embassies of Australia, New Zealand, Canada and The USA. This pilot scheme "centralised" the obtaining of police checks for people traveling or emigrating to those four countries. I say centralised because the subject access checks were already carried out at a central location - they were done by NIS (The National Identification Service) at New Scotland Yard. But now the whole process (application AND the checks) is all done in one location - with ACPO.

I would point out that the Subject Access service is still available but it can't be used for travelers or immigrants to those four countries. In fact as of 31st March US embassies will no longer accept subject access checks as part of the visa process - I had a change made to our website at Staffs to point out that as of today we would no longer accept subject access applications for travelers to the USA because there was no guarantee that you could get your subject access check back and have an appointment at the US embassy before that date!!

There is also the possibility that sometime in the next few weeks the other three embassies will also stop accepting subject access checks but none of them have made any announcements to that fact so far!!

I hope I have answered all your questions but if you have anymore you know where to find me!!

Zoe Bell

I have a question , is the information given by this service any different to the information returned by a subject access check?

I guess what I am asking is why does it now cost 35ukp to get a police check for one country but only 10ukp for another?

I appreciate that you are just passing on the information that has been decided , as you point out by the respective embassies, but the logic behind this baffles me.

JaffaMafia

From what I have been told they check PNC and they also "will carry out extensive authentication exercises including searching various databases." (from the application form).

Now what that means, nobody has seen fit to inform those of us who will have to answer such questions as are posed by members of the public such as yourselves!!!!

One other thing I can tell you is that I have been checking the travel and immigration site of all four countries since the scheme was announced to us last month and not one of them has said anything about any changes!!

Biiiiink

Thanks for your answer JaffaMafia. The mystery deepens!!!

We need someone at CIC to comment, or update their info. And I'd still like to know what the legal situation is with it all, and what happens to people who have lived in Scotland.

But I appreciate you posting and telling us what you know

Zoe Bell

Something about this whole thing does not sit right with me. Extreme paranoia or not I just wish I could put my finger on it.

I wonder if Andrew Miller or other consultants have any knowledge of this , presumably if they have to advise clients about putting their application together they should know what type of police checks are required.

wbexpat

If bloody well doesnt sit right with me either.

1. You are a powerful crown-mandated oragnisation
2. You create your own trade organisation (ACPO)
3. You have ACPO create a Pilot Scheme for Visa-related Data Protection queries
4. You point all Visa-related Data Protection queries to ACPO
5. Profit!

And what checks can ACPO possibly do that are more stringent than a listing from your own file in the police national computer? CCJ's? Bzzzzt. Civil. Parking tickets? Bzzzt. Civil. etc etc. Could it be because access to Police computers is easier because senior police officers are also ACPO.... Uh do you THINK?

And ACPO's Data Protection status.... um EXEMPT because of a technicality
http://www.acpo.police.uk/about_pages/free.html

So lets see:

Something that cannot possibly be more informative.
That costs more to the consumer.
That is run by a private company with no DP requirements.

Uh?

wbexpat

Bogus. Very bogus.
Why would you need to authenticate John Smith's request? In case it isn't John Smith? But why on earth would someone who isn't John Smith apply for the records of someone who isn't him in order to get a visa? What purpose would it serve for John Smith to apply to CIC with Jimmy Jones' Police report?

Pffft.
So what are these "other databases"? What are they? Credit? CCJ? Freeman's Catalog? Friends Reunited? I think we should know! And who initiated this "Pilot Program?" It says ACPO on their website. Um, doesn't the UK Immigration service not have a say? Is this not reciprocal?

Utter codswallop. Jobs-for-the-boys Unnecessary Police-state BS.

Time to write to the MP methinks....
http://www.upmystreet.com/commons/l/

wbexpat

Not only causing confusion for us guys...

http://www.*****.com/forum/migration...ce-checks.html
edit: Guh. Rotten profanity filter. You will get the domain if you concatenate "poms in oz"


The last post is a good one, though they do not link to evidence so DYOR:

"An agreement has been signed for a new trial police clearance for the UK however it has not been sealed and stamped by the Department of Immigration as yet. Although you can apply for a police clearance under this new ACPO £35 system, there is a real issue in that the new police clearance may only have a validity of 6 months. As opposed to the perfectly valid £10 police celarance which has a validity date of 12 months.

Some applicants have had a problem with local police authorities insisting that the new ACPO clearance is the only way to go, this is incorrect, and if you are having that problem feel free to send me a personal message, I can help sort out the confusion.

http://sortoutmyvisa.com."

bazzz

No doubt they'll be offering kickbacks to the local stations for everyone they can convince that they need to use this route.

Zoe Bell

Well I'm going to hold off judgement untill i actually see some EVIDENCE that these checks are all that CHC will accept. There is nothing on their website to that effect.

I just feel it is my duty to inform people that they are being ripped off in this manner and that the process can be done at less expense than advertised. If people choose to pay more then so be it.,


This is not without precedent , the introduction of the CRB which I also believe is farmed out to another company (Capita?). The result of which was I waited SEVEN MONTHS for my last CRB check to come back.

wbexpat

Well that's the problem isn't it.
This has got "conflict of interest" written all over it.

wbexpat

As the DDR discovered, having a Police State can be a good thing. Everyone gets a job in the Police. 100% Employment and no crime. Get in!

JaffaMafia

You need to check your facts. Nobody (whether they are an individual or an organisation) who holds personal data is exempt from the Data Protection Act. What ACPO are is exempt from the Freedom of Information Act 2000 - which although in some places overlaps with the DPA they are both totally different and separate pieces of legislation!!!

Zoe Bell

looks like the aussies may not be accepting these new forms yet ,

http://britishexpats.com/forum/showthread.php?t=514564
(see last post)

Interesting as they are allegedly part of the "pilot scheme".

also like the fact that they are only valid for six months !!!!!!!!

JAJ

No websites updated as of yet.

Out of interest, what precisely was wrong with the existing process and is a private company set to make money out of this new idea?

And why will these other countries not accept Subject Access forms, if the information on the certificates is going to be the same? Or is the plan to add in information other than convictions from a court of law, some of which is little more than unfounded tittle-tattle.