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For those applying for criminal rehabilitation

For those applying for criminal rehabilitation

Old May 11th 2010, 3:29 pm
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Default For those applying for criminal rehabilitation

I hope this helps someone.

My husband applied for criminal rehabilitation in March of this year, as he had a drink driving ban, 12 Dec 2004. According to the web sit he can not enter Canada with out it, not even for a holiday.

And this is what they said.

We write in reply to your enquiry. It has been determined that you are not criminally inadmissible to Canada as the conviction from 2004 is deemed "spent" under the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act.

You therefore do not need to apply for criminal rehabilitation for any application for travel to Canada. Your work permit(s) has been issued to you by email on 07/5/10.

What a wast of time and money.
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Old May 11th 2010, 3:35 pm
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Default Re: For those applying for criminal rehabilitation

Which website said that? Presumably they were talking about the UK rehabilitation of offenders act, which would indicate 5 years is long enough for a non custodial sentence?

Last edited by iaink; May 11th 2010 at 3:37 pm.
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Old May 11th 2010, 3:50 pm
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Default Re: For those applying for criminal rehabilitation

This webpage
http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/informa...des/5312E3.asp

seems to indicate that five years good behaviour after "Conviction for two or more offences outside Canada that, if committed in Canada, would constitute summary conviction offences" would be enough to be considered rehabilitated automatically.

It appears that this DUI (like most that dont cause phyiscal harm) was seen as a "summary" rather than "indictable" offence, but it is in a grey area legally...DUI here is seen as an indictable offence UNTIL the crown decide to proceed as a summary offence...its called a "hybrid offence"

Some background for those in a similar position...
http://www.nationalpardon.org/blog/n...-vs-indictable
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Old May 11th 2010, 3:57 pm
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Default Re: For those applying for criminal rehabilitation

5 years after completion of sentence will be 12 Dec 2010, 7 months away.
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Old May 11th 2010, 3:57 pm
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Default Re: For those applying for criminal rehabilitation

Hi

Originally Posted by iaink
This webpage
http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/informa...des/5312E3.asp

seems to indicate that five years good behaviour after "Conviction for two or more offences outside Canada that, if committed in Canada, would constitute summary conviction offences" would be enough to be considered rehabilitated automatically.

It appears that this DUI (like most that dont cause phyiscal harm) was seen as a "summary" rather than "indictable" offence, but it is in a grey area legally...DUI here is seen as an indictable offence UNTIL the crown decide to proceed as a summary offence...its called a "hybrid offence"

Some background for those in a similar position...
http://www.nationalpardon.org/blog/n...-vs-indictable
Dual offences in Canada for Immigration purposes are handled as if they would have been proceeded by way of Indictment.

From the Enforcement manual

An offence that may be prosecuted either summarily or by way of indictment is deemed an indictable offence, even if it has been prosecuted summarily [A36(3)(a)].
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Old May 11th 2010, 4:18 pm
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Default Re: For those applying for criminal rehabilitation

Originally Posted by PMM
Hi



Dual offences in Canada for Immigration purposes are handled as if they would have been proceeded by way of Indictment.

From the Enforcement manual

An offence that may be prosecuted either summarily or by way of indictment is deemed an indictable offence, even if it has been prosecuted summarily [A36(3)(a)].
Thanks for that PMM,

So by that there should be a ten year automatic rehabilitation for a DUI as far as Canada is concerned... so did someone screw up in the response to the OPs application...thats what it looks like to me?

Seems to me that under the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act, a non custodial DUI disqualification sentance would be spent after a period the same as the disqualification had passed?, although the canadian authorities would not consider it as such as its considered indictable here, so they should still need to get the canadain paperwork having now established that its considered spent under UK law..

Im confused...its not unusual! Its seems to me that even though its spent under UK law, the canadian act still requires formal rehabilitation as the OP applied for but thats not what their reply from Canada said...

Last edited by iaink; May 11th 2010 at 4:20 pm.
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Old May 11th 2010, 4:51 pm
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Default Re: For those applying for criminal rehabilitation

I have checked 3 times with them in the last week and have been given the same answer everytime.

I think the web sit is very misleading.
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Old May 11th 2010, 4:56 pm
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Default Re: For those applying for criminal rehabilitation

They have said a UK offence has a UK rehabilitation period.

Wish they would say this on there web sit.


Motoring Procedure

updated 06 February 2010

Rehabilitation of Offenders Act 1974

Disqualifications


The rehabilitation period for a disqualification is the length of the disqualification. If a person is disqualified at the same time as receiving another penalty, the longer rehabilitation period applies. (For example, if a motorist is banned from driving for seven years and fined - which takes five years to become spent - the rehabilitation period would be seven years, not five years.)
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Old May 11th 2010, 5:05 pm
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Default Re: For those applying for criminal rehabilitation

Hi

Originally Posted by oliverjude
I have checked 3 times with them in the last week and have been given the same answer everytime.

I think the web sit is very misleading.
1. Here is the section of the criminal code for impaired driving.

Operation while impaired
253. (1) Every one commits an offence who operates a motor vehicle or vessel or operates or assists in the operation of an aircraft or of railway equipment or has the care or control of a motor vehicle, vessel, aircraft or railway equipment, whether it is in motion or not,
(a) while the person’s ability to operate the vehicle, vessel, aircraft or railway equipment is impaired by alcohol or a drug; or
(b) having consumed alcohol in such a quantity that the concentration in the person’s blood exceeds eighty milligrams of alcohol in one hundred millilitres of blood.

The punishment

Punishment
255. (1) Every one who commits an offence under section 253 or 254 is guilty of an indictable offence or an offence punishable on summary conviction and is liable,
(a) whether the offence is prosecuted by indictment or punishable on summary conviction, to the following minimum punishment, namely,

(i) for a first offence, to a fine of not less than $1,000,

(ii) for a second offence, to imprisonment for not less than 30 days, and

(iii) for each subsequent offence, to imprisonment for not less than 120 days;
(b) where the offence is prosecuted by indictment, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding five years; and
(c) if the offence is punishable on summary conviction, to imprisonment for a term of not more than 18 months.

Rehabilitation from the Regulations

18. (1) For the purposes of paragraph 36(3)(c) of the Act, the class of persons deemed to have been rehabilitated is a prescribed class.

Members of the class
(2) The following persons are members of the class of persons deemed to have been rehabilitated:
(a) persons who have been convicted outside Canada of no more than one offence that, if committed in Canada, would constitute an indictable offence under an Act of Parliament, if all of the following conditions apply, namely,
(i) the offence is punishable in Canada by a maximum term of imprisonment of less than 10 years,
(ii) at least 10 years have elapsed since the day after the completion of the imposed sentence,


So the OP can't be deemed rehabilitated as 10 years have not passed.
As 5 years have not passed since the conviction, s/he is not eligible for rehabilitation, and CIC/CHC London's only consideration was if they would issue a TRP.
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Old May 11th 2010, 5:18 pm
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Default Re: For those applying for criminal rehabilitation

So what do I conclude from this e-mail we got today. Has someone got it wrong. This is the 3rd time I have checked with them.

This is the e-mail.

We write in reply to your enquiry. It has been determined that you are not criminally inadmissible to Canada as the conviction from 2004 is deemed "spent" under the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act.

You therefore do not need to apply for criminal rehabilitation for any application for travel to Canada. Your work permit(s) has been issued to you by email on 07/5/10.

We hope this is of assistance to you.

Yours sincerely,

CLW

Worker and Student Unit

Immigration and Medical Services Division

High Commission of Canada

38 Grosvenor Street

London W1K 4AA, United Kingdom
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Old May 11th 2010, 5:26 pm
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Default Re: For those applying for criminal rehabilitation

Originally Posted by oliverjude
So what do I conclude from this e-mail we got today. Has someone got it wrong. This is the 3rd time I have checked with them.

This is the e-mail.

We write in reply to your enquiry. It has been determined that you are not criminally inadmissible to Canada as the conviction from 2004 is deemed "spent" under the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act.

You therefore do not need to apply for criminal rehabilitation for any application for travel to Canada. Your work permit(s) has been issued to you by email on 07/5/10.

We hope this is of assistance to you.

Yours sincerely,

CLW

Worker and Student Unit

Immigration and Medical Services Division

High Commission of Canada

38 Grosvenor Street

London W1K 4AA, United Kingdom
I would write back to say that you understand that under UK law you are deemed rehabilitated, but seek clarification about the situation under canadian law (copy and paste chapter and verse from PMMs post) as it appears that you are not yet out of the woods regarding the way a DUI conviction is viewed in Canadian terms according to the immigration manual.

It does look to me like someone there is making a mistake, but I am not a lawyer, nor do I play one on TV. You might be making a rod for your own back though....
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Old May 12th 2010, 3:38 am
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Default Re: For those applying for criminal rehabilitation

This happened to me.

It turns out that for those convicted under British Law, it's five years from the date of conviction and then POOF! All is well.

This they told me after i'd spent close to a grand preparing the application.

Still, never look a gift horse in the mouth eh?
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Old May 12th 2010, 7:01 am
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Default Re: For those applying for criminal rehabilitation

So you didn't need criminal rehabilitation as well?

So, when we apply for PR we will not need criminal rehabilitation, maybe just a covering letter explaining what happened, as it will still show on the Police report.

Just don't want any problems when we land, as we are bring are young family, pets and shipping all our goods out.

Thanks guys
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Old May 12th 2010, 8:39 pm
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Default Re: For those applying for criminal rehabilitation

this all stems from the burgon federal court of appeal ruling which means that

"previous jerisprudence - {the above ruling} instructed immigration officials to generally assess the UK convictions under the Criminal Rehabilitation Act (1974) instead of the provisions of the Immigration & refugee act"

as officially stated to myself by a canadian immigration officer. Any "consultant" can say what they want but this is in place no one has made a wrong decision.

It basically in laymans terms means they accept the laws of britain to be comparable to those of Canada, and as such recognise the ROA 1974 act and therefore will base their descisions upon it. Because the conviction is spent in the UK you are NO LONGER considered inadmissible to canada. (as long as the conviction is spent under the ROA 1974 act you do not need rehab if you're unsure tick for information only on the box as i think you seemed to do)

I was suprised when i recived this myself initally but after talking to legal counsel and immigrations officials, it is absolutley part of way things are done regarding the UK
BTW its not 5 years for a sentance 6 months - 18 months custodial its 10 years)
its only 5 years for community service fine, imprisonment of less than 6 months

I suggest some people giving advice on the forum should do what i did and actually talk to an immigration officer who will explain it in detail for you

i have a stamped signed official document explaining why i'm not inadmissible the reasons behind the decision and the legal basis upon which the officer made the decision.

Last edited by admissiblebrit; May 12th 2010 at 9:00 pm.
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Old May 12th 2010, 9:09 pm
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Default Re: For those applying for criminal rehabilitation

i have been fined for negligence in 2009 & that was not written in my recrd
do i need rehab
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