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Reasons for LMO refusal? Your experiences please

Reasons for LMO refusal? Your experiences please

Old Nov 3rd 2008, 6:51 am
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Default Reasons for LMO refusal? Your experiences please

Hi everyone

As a newbie I have read many threads and whilst I certainly don't want to be negative in any way, I would like to benefit from your experiences with LMO applications, and avoid any of the pitfalls which others may have fallen into!

My husband has had a 1yr LMO in Sales & Marketing (management) which won't be renewed.

He now has 2 job offers, 1 about to apply for an LMO, the other almost ready to apply, we have had to do some hand-holding to ensure that they do everything in the right order & get evidence for not being able to fill the position with a Canadian etc.

Does anyone have any tips & hints for a successful LMO - sales & marketing is quite a competitive environment, although we live in a rural area where candidates with the international experience which my husband has, is difficult to find.

If anyone was refused an LMO did they tell you why? Can you appeal?

Any help to ensure this happens would be gratefully received - we have been here for a year now, 2 kids in school etc....!!

Only just found this forum - thanks Cindy! Wow what a find - so much information and so much help offered!

Thanks
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Old Nov 3rd 2008, 6:53 am
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Default Re: Reasons for LMO refusal? Your experiences please

It is of paramount importance that the company applying for the LMO includes as much information on what they have done to hire a Canadian........copies of adverts etc
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Old Nov 3rd 2008, 3:23 pm
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Default Re: Reasons for LMO refusal? Your experiences please

"The significance of an OUP list is that, if your occupation appears on it, the employer's required advertising time, before he/she can apply for a labour market opinion (LMO), is reduced from three months to seven business days."

Just read the above on the Wiki under 'The List'

Does this mean that all companies should have been advertising for 3 months before even beginning to apply for the LMO?

Will LMO be refused if this is not the case?
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Old Nov 3rd 2008, 3:33 pm
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Default Re: Reasons for LMO refusal? Your experiences please

Originally Posted by Gales2Canada
Does this mean that all companies should have been advertising for 3 months before even beginning to apply for the LMO?
When an occupation does not appear on the relevant province's list of Occupations under Pressure, the employer has to demonstrate that he/she has conducted a Canada-wide recruitment drive for three months and that no qualified Canadian resident has applied for the job. If the employer has interviewed Canadian residents who have responded to his/her advertisements, he/she has to document why they were not suitable for the position.

When an occupation does appear on the relevant province's OUP list, the employer's required advertising time is reduced from three months to seven business days. So the burden of proof on the employer, if that's the right expression, is considerably reduced in the case of an occupation that appears on the OUP list.

If the occupation is one that is eligible for an Expedited Labour Market Opinion (E-LMO), the employer has to register with the government. But, once the employer has registered with the government, no advertising at all is required. They claim that, if all the paperwork is in order, they process E-LMO applications within five business days. I've seen E-LMOs taking up to seven weeks, but that's still quick by the standards of Citizenship and Immigration Canada. I've also seen on this forum that E-LMOs have been granted in as few as four days. If I remember correctly, there are about thirty occupations on the E-LMO list. Another thing to remember is that that E-LMO list is applicable to Alberta and British Columbia only.

There are Wiki articles on the OUP lists and E-LMOs, with links to government websites, but I've already given you the pertinent information.

Edited to add that, after all that, I haven't really answered your questions. The answers are yes, in both cases. Yes, employers have to have advertised for three months before they apply for an LMO. And, yes, I have seen on this forum that LMOs have been refused. As a reader of the forum, I haven't always known why the LMO application was rejected. But logic suggests that, in at least some of the cases, CIC staff were not convinced that the employer had undertaken a sufficiently vigorous recruitment drive.

This provides additional context for Brownstar's response in post #2.
x

Last edited by Judy in Calgary; Nov 3rd 2008 at 3:39 pm.
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Old Nov 3rd 2008, 3:52 pm
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Default Re: Reasons for LMO refusal? Your experiences please

Originally Posted by Gales2Canada
Does anyone have any tips & hints for a successful LMO
In addition to the advice that Brownstar already has given you, there are a couple of factors that spring immediately to mind:

The foreign worker whom the employer would like to hire has to have the appropriate qualifications and experience. I mean that, if there is an occupation, such as electrician, that requires certification, the foreign job candidate has to have the necessary certification.

The employer has to be offering at least the going rate for that occupation in the region. The reason for this rule is to prevent foreign workers undercutting Canadian residents.

If anyone was refused an LMO did they tell you why?
Sorry, I don't know if they proactively tell the LMO applicant (who actually is the prospective employer) why they've rejected the application. But I have seen reports on this forum about employers who have phoned the government and who have received answers.

Can you appeal?
I have seen appeals being mentioned on the forum. However, keep in mind that it's actually the employer who applies for the LMO and who also would need to feel keen enough about the issue to appeal the decision if the LMO was refused. This unfortunately puts the employee in the position of having to rely on an employer who was willing to go above and beyond.
Hope that helps.
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Old Nov 4th 2008, 3:44 am
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Default Re: Reasons for LMO refusal? Your experiences please

We've had an LMO refused by HRSDC/Service Canada on the grounds that the job offer's hourly wage was under the prevailing wage rate for the occupation and region. I've also seen applications for LMO's refused because the occupation is not in a shortage.

So before you get your employer to send off the application, make sure that you're going to be paid at least the prevailing wage rate for the occupation and region. If your occupation is listed on the E-LMO list, you will find this information very easily using the application kit. If your occupation is not listed, you can communicate with HRSDC/Service Canada to find the prevailing wage rate for your occupation, or use www.labourmarketinformation.ca to get a rough idea.
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Old Nov 4th 2008, 8:48 am
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Default Re: Reasons for LMO refusal? Your experiences please

Originally Posted by Janaab
We've had an LMO refused by HRSDC/Service Canada on the grounds that the job offer's hourly wage was under the prevailing wage rate for the occupation and region. I've also seen applications for LMO's refused because the occupation is not in a shortage.
This usualy only applies when you are using the straight forward explanation offered under a particular NOC code. There might be specialisations that you possess which will grant the LMO.

Example:
A straight LMO for NOC code 0213 would most likely be rejected but if your employer proves a specialisation need and that the tried hard to recruite a Canadian first, it would go straight through.
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Old Nov 6th 2008, 6:42 am
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Default Re: Reasons for LMO refusal? Your experiences please

Thanks for all your replies.

OH's NOC is 0611 but we are trying to prove special skills in an essentially rural environment due to OH's international experience etc. He has had 1 LMO approved but the company are not in a position to renew it when it expires at the end of January. This gives us hope that we will succeed with the next application but just trying to cover all the bases.

The new company have advertised on Job Bank and in the local newspapers - does anyone think that more extensive/specialised advertising needs to be done, if so do you have any suggestions please??!!
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Old Nov 6th 2008, 2:00 pm
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Default Re: Reasons for LMO refusal? Your experiences please

Originally Posted by Gales2Canada
Thanks for all your replies.

OH's NOC is 0611 but we are trying to prove special skills in an essentially rural environment due to OH's international experience etc. He has had 1 LMO approved but the company are not in a position to renew it when it expires at the end of January. This gives us hope that we will succeed with the next application but just trying to cover all the bases.

The new company have advertised on Job Bank and in the local newspapers - does anyone think that more extensive/specialised advertising needs to be done, if so do you have any suggestions please??!!
Yes, get your employer to post an advertisement in a National newspaper.

This will help your employer in acquiring a positive labour market opinion due to the fact that the employer has attempted to recruit Canadian workers from all over the country, instead of just locally.
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Old Nov 7th 2008, 1:14 am
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Default Re: Reasons for LMO refusal? Your experiences please

Thanks Janaab

Does advertising on the internet via Job Bank not cover the 'National' requirement?

How is advertising on Job bank viewed by LMO officials as an advertising tool?
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Old Nov 7th 2008, 7:24 am
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Default Re: Reasons for LMO refusal? Your experiences please

Originally Posted by Gales2Canada
Thanks Janaab

Does advertising on the internet via Job Bank not cover the 'National' requirement?

How is advertising on Job bank viewed by LMO officials as an advertising tool?
When I was at Telus Mobily they used Monster. CIC seemed to like it because they were able to show how many online applicants that they actually had who were not up to the job, using very quick and easy stats.

However my LMO was rejected due to the wage having a negative affect on the Canadian Labour Market because it was below the national average, even though 180 canadian's at Telus earned the same wage.

CIC were happy to disclose to my employer why they rejected it aswell. And because Telus Mobility were heartless they were happy to tell me
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Old Nov 7th 2008, 2:56 pm
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Default Re: Reasons for LMO refusal? Your experiences please

Originally Posted by Gales2Canada
Thanks Janaab

Does advertising on the internet via Job Bank not cover the 'National' requirement?

How is advertising on Job bank viewed by LMO officials as an advertising tool?
Well technically it does, but during my experiences I have noticed the foreign worker officers usually prefer a combination of national newspaper in addition to online efforts.

Job Bank is seen as an additional attempt to hire nationals. And although a requirement, it does not have as much credibility as physical advertisements. If I was applying for an LMO, I would focus my recruitment efforts mainly on newspapers rather than online.

Also another thing, when the employer or whoever is dealing with the application is filling it out, they must ensure that the 'Requirements of the job' are the same as the NOC's requirements for that specific occupation and the provinces certification or licencing requirements, if any.

I've seen a couple of LMO applications get refused and the rationale was that the employer-specific requirements for the job were not in compliance with the national and provincial requirements.

Hope this helps!
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Old Nov 8th 2008, 4:32 am
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Default Re: Reasons for LMO refusal? Your experiences please

I have just received news from the company that was going to employ me that there LMO has been refused in Ontario, but accepted if I would go to their depot in BC. Obviously depends where you are situated as well.
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