Police record- No live trace

Old Mar 4th 2014, 10:04 am
  #1  
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Default Police record- No live trace

I'm looking for some help. My current situation is is follows, I moved with my wife and family from the UK to canada in 2010 via the PNP business stream and having successfully started by business I was recommended for PR back in February 2013 our papers went in in May 2013 and we’ve since had the medicals.

When I applied for my police record the report came back with no live trace for the following reason.

34 years ago I was wrongly arrested along with two other people for shop lifting at court one of the other two friends admitted that it was him and we were not involved and two of us had the charges dropped I stated this when I applied for my work permits and on my PR application, this is the only blemish on my record.

Today I've be asked for the following from the central processing office

Ø 60653979 -
Ø The Police Certificate #00666981 provided from the ACPO states "No Live Trace", suggesting the possibility that a past offense history exists and has been either expunged or no longer shows in your records.
Ø Court record / Police report: Provide an original police report or court records for any and all charges/convictions that may have occurred when you resided in the United Kingdom. Your UK police certificate indicates a result of "NO LIVE TRACE" which may mean there are past charges/convictions that could affect your application for permanent residence. This must be received at this office by: 05/05/2014
Ø Court judgment: Court judgment relating to any criminal charge/conviction that may have occurred when you resided in the United Kingdom. Your UK police certificate indicates a result of "NO LIVE TRACE" which may mean there are past charges/convictions that could affect your application for permanent residence. This must be received at this office by: 05/05/2014




This was 34 years ago will the police still have the records and if so will they hold this against me this is a long time ago and whole incident is not very clear in my mind, we have been in Canada 3 1/2 years now started a business, brought a house any my family are settled, If it was going to be a problem why wasn't it brought up before now

Any help would be appreciated

Express01,
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Old Mar 7th 2014, 2:47 pm
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Default Re: Police record- No live trace

Hi On moving to Canada my UK police check came back "no live trace" this does mean that there was some incident at sometime recorded, but they do not have any specifics detailed anymore, Mine was 45 years old, a very minor offence. I have heard of people tracing back to the Court the case may have been tried in and to have the document ammended saying that you were cleared or that it was a very minor charge, The trouble is the time that has passed, I was asked if I could remember the case and what it involved, it wasn't easy to remember, but I did my best, All you can do is state your case to them the best you can, 30 odd years ago is a long time, everyone makes mistakes or gets accidentally involved in something, I am sure the authorities understand these things, try not to worry.
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Old Mar 7th 2014, 4:05 pm
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Default Re: Police record- No live trace

Originally Posted by express01
I'm looking for some help. My current situation is is follows, I moved with my wife and family from the UK to canada in 2010 via the PNP business stream and having successfully started by business I was recommended for PR back in February 2013 our papers went in in May 2013 and we’ve since had the medicals.

When I applied for my police record the report came back with no live trace for the following reason.

34 years ago I was wrongly arrested along with two other people for shop lifting at court one of the other two friends admitted that it was him and we were not involved and two of us had the charges dropped I stated this when I applied for my work permits and on my PR application, this is the only blemish on my record.

Today I've be asked for the following from the central processing office

Ø 60653979 -
Ø The Police Certificate #00666981 provided from the ACPO states "No Live Trace", suggesting the possibility that a past offense history exists and has been either expunged or no longer shows in your records.
Ø Court record / Police report: Provide an original police report or court records for any and all charges/convictions that may have occurred when you resided in the United Kingdom. Your UK police certificate indicates a result of "NO LIVE TRACE" which may mean there are past charges/convictions that could affect your application for permanent residence. This must be received at this office by: 05/05/2014
Ø Court judgment: Court judgment relating to any criminal charge/conviction that may have occurred when you resided in the United Kingdom. Your UK police certificate indicates a result of "NO LIVE TRACE" which may mean there are past charges/convictions that could affect your application for permanent residence. This must be received at this office by: 05/05/2014




This was 34 years ago will the police still have the records and if so will they hold this against me this is a long time ago and whole incident is not very clear in my mind, we have been in Canada 3 1/2 years now started a business, brought a house any my family are settled, If it was going to be a problem why wasn't it brought up before now

Any help would be appreciated

Express01,
This website tells you how to do a subject access request with the police to get full details of all incidences and records held.

http://www.nacro.org.uk/what-we-do/r...616,NAP.html#1
"You can request a copy of your Police National Computer record, which will provide details of all convictions, cautions, final warnings and reprimands held on your police records. If you would also like details of your local records, which may be disclosed on enhanced DBS checks at the discretion of the Chief Constable, you can apply for your ‘full nominal record’."
The form is available here: http://www.acro.police.uk/subject_access.aspx

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Old Mar 7th 2014, 9:37 pm
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Default Re: Police record- No live trace

If thats your only arrest and you have no convictions then I wouldn't worry about it. Even if you had been convicted of that one offence you would now be deemed rehabilitated.
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Old Mar 8th 2014, 3:38 am
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Default Re: Police record- No live trace

Hi Guys

I got my UK ACRO police cert back with 2x cautions one for disorderly behaviour and one for common assault on the same date in 2010(disorderly behaviour I'm ok with, the assault one still niggles as it was my friend who hit a bouncer not me, though at the time I accepted the caution to prevent the hassle of having it go to court appearance and now it shows on my police trace. Oh well) .

I'm applying for IEC through the Irish programme my Irish passport but lived NI all my life hence the UK police check.

I've read few of your other post Former Lancastrian and you seem to know what you're talking about(being you seem to be an immigration officer) and wondering if you'd clarify how my cautions should affect my application please?

I've looked at this section: "3.9. When not to use the “committing an act” provisions
The “committing an act” inadmissibility provisions would generally not be applied in the
following scenarios:
 in most cases, when authorities in the foreign jurisdiction indicate they would not lay
a charge or make known to an officer their decision or intent to drop the charges;
 the trial is concluded and no conviction results (for example, acquittal, discharge,
deferral);
 the person admits to committing the act but has received a record suspension or the
record is expunged;
 the act was committed in Canada."

from the CIC GA site and was pretty confident I'd be ok.

But then I seen a post from you FL on another thread saying a caution is considered a "conviction" Canadian law?

So should I be requesting a rehab form or will I wait until a CAN IMM officer calls me about it?
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Old Mar 8th 2014, 3:39 am
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Default Re: Police record- No live trace

Hoping they wont consider this too big an offence as it not a UK conviction and not for more serious offences i.e Drugs or DUI????

Any advice greatly appreciated......
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Old Mar 8th 2014, 5:05 am
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Default Re: Police record- No live trace

Originally Posted by Siouxie
This website tells you how to do a subject access request with the police to get full details of all incidences and records held.

http://www.nacro.org.uk/what-we-do/r...616,NAP.html#1
"You can request a copy of your Police National Computer record, which will provide details of all convictions, cautions, final warnings and reprimands held on your police records. If you would also like details of your local records, which may be disclosed on enhanced DBS checks at the discretion of the Chief Constable, you can apply for your ‘full nominal record’."
The form is available here: http://www.acro.police.uk/subject_access.aspx

Thanks for all the Advice and help, I feel a lot better now
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Old Mar 8th 2014, 6:31 am
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Default Re: Police record- No live trace

Originally Posted by boholad
Hi Guys

I got my UK ACRO police cert back with 2x cautions one for disorderly behaviour and one for common assault on the same date in 2010(disorderly behaviour I'm ok with, the assault one still niggles as it was my friend who hit a bouncer not me, though at the time I accepted the caution to prevent the hassle of having it go to court appearance and now it shows on my police trace. Oh well) .

I'm applying for IEC through the Irish programme my Irish passport but lived NI all my life hence the UK police check.

I've read few of your other post Former Lancastrian and you seem to know what you're talking about(being you seem to be an immigration officer) and wondering if you'd clarify how my cautions should affect my application please?

I've looked at this section: "3.9. When not to use the “committing an act” provisions
The “committing an act” inadmissibility provisions would generally not be applied in the
following scenarios:
 in most cases, when authorities in the foreign jurisdiction indicate they would not lay
a charge or make known to an officer their decision or intent to drop the charges;
 the trial is concluded and no conviction results (for example, acquittal, discharge,
deferral);
 the person admits to committing the act but has received a record suspension or the
record is expunged;
 the act was committed in Canada."

from the CIC GA site and was pretty confident I'd be ok.

But then I seen a post from you FL on another thread saying a caution is considered a "conviction" Canadian law?

So should I be requesting a rehab form or will I wait until a CAN IMM officer calls me about it?
As you are applying for the IEC CIC will make the decision if you are inadmissible or not based on submission of your police certificate.
The debate is if a UK Police caution is considered a conviction some say Yes and some say No. The caution is offered rather than the police laying the charge and taking it to court. No such thing exists in Canada so this is where the debate begins. Accepting the caution is an admission of guilt for UK purposes but is then considered spent for UK purposes.
IMHO a caution should be considered as a conviction.
See how CIC treat your application.

This is taken from CIC Enforcement Manual 2

Officers should also recognize that a decision by a local policing authority not to prosecute is often a result of considerations that are specific to the criminal justice context and not necessarily consistent with the objectives of managing access to Canada. In other words, a decision by a local policing authority not to lay or proceed with charges should not automatically be considered as prima facie evidence that an offence was not committed; nor should officers be overly capricious in the use of the Act’s inadmissibility provisions.
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Old Mar 9th 2014, 10:18 pm
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Default Re: Police record- No live trace

Ok Cheers for your help FL.
By the sounds of things I'll just have to wait and see on the officers who handles my application's interpretation of the rules and if i'm lucky hopefully I'll recieve a phone call from them.

Thanks again
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