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A-Levels (some) getting assessed by WES as a diploma.??

A-Levels (some) getting assessed by WES as a diploma.??

Old May 17th 2019, 10:40 pm
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Default A-Levels (some) getting assessed by WES as a diploma.??

I thought this may greatly benefit people who want to get ‘two or more degrees certificates’ from a WES assessment.
I read on here that people who hold an AVCE (advanced vocational certificate of education) and a BTEC level 3 diploma were getting a WES report of diploma. Combining this with their degrees they got a CRS boost from ‘two or more certificates’

Having done countless weeks of research i found everyone got a successful diploma report, and then i discovered that anyone who holds an Edexcel A - Level (despite being a level 3 qualification) will apparently get a diploma outcome too.
Edexcel (or Pearson as they’re known as) state this on the PDF file on their website seen here :

https://qualifications.pearson.com/c...-in-canada.pdf

see page 21 and 22 which states the following :

The minimum requirement for admission to university is to possess a qualification equivalent to a Canadian secondary diploma. Pearson Edexcel A level and BTEC qualifications are equivalent to a Canadian secondary diploma, but you might need your Edexcel A level or BTEC credentials validated by WES or CES


Students wishing to study at a college in Ontario will need, at a minimum, to have completed studies equal to a secondary diploma. Your Pearson Edexcel A Level or BTEC qualifications more than fulfil this requirement. Students who do not have an equivalent diploma should contact the college for further information.

So it appears if you have any type of A - level /VCE/BTEC level 3 with Edexcel/Pearson it should come out as a diploma.

I thought this may be useful to people out there and could make a difference to successfully getting to Canada. Why this carries more weight with Edexcel I don’t know..

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Old May 18th 2019, 12:58 am
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Default re: A-Levels (some) getting assessed by WES as a diploma.??

Why would that give you 'extra points'? A secondary diploma is exactly what A levels are - high school graduation. As the link you quote says, A levels (and BTECs) are equivalent to secondary (high school), and qualify you for entry to university.
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Old May 18th 2019, 1:54 am
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Default re: A-Levels (some) getting assessed by WES as a diploma.??

Originally Posted by Vulcanoid View Post
Why would that give you 'extra points'? A secondary diploma is exactly what A levels are - high school graduation. As the link you quote says, A levels (and BTECs) are equivalent to secondary (high school), and qualify you for entry to university.
Because there’s no requirement for it to be post secondary, as long as your ECA assessment reads degree and diploma you can claim both. Also of you use the cic CRS point calculator is awards 30 CRS for “high school diploma” it doesn’t need to be post secondary.

here’s an edexel ECA assessment :

CREDENTIAL ANALYSIS
1. Credential Authentication: Official transcripts were sent directly by the institution
Country: United Kingdom
Credential: Advanced Vocational Certificate of Education
Year: 2003
Awarded by: Edexcel
Institution Status: Recognized
Major/Specialization: Information and Communication Technology
Canadian Equivalency: Diploma (two years)

see thread here
<Snip>

Last edited by Siouxie; May 18th 2019 at 2:54 am. Reason: Link removed to other forum and incorrect information - only official or internal links please.
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Old May 18th 2019, 2:49 am
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Default re: A-Levels (some) getting assessed by WES as a diploma.??

Originally Posted by Addzz120 View Post
<BIG SNIP>
see page 21 and 22 which states the following :

The minimum requirement for admission to university is to possess a qualification equivalent to a Canadian secondary diploma. Pearson Edexcel A level and BTEC qualifications are equivalent to a Canadian secondary diploma, but you might need your Edexcel A level or BTEC credentials validated by WES or CES


Students wishing to study at a college in Ontario will need, at a minimum, to have completed studies equal to a secondary diploma. Your Pearson Edexcel A Level or BTEC qualifications more than fulfil this requirement. Students who do not have an equivalent diploma should contact the college for further information.

So it appears if you have any type of A - level /VCE/BTEC level 3 with Edexcel/Pearson it should come out as a diploma.

I thought this may be useful to people out there and could make a difference to successfully getting to Canada. Why this carries more weight with Edexcel I don’t know..


Don't confuse equivalency for entering an educational establishment or similar with obtaining an ECA assessment for points - they are 2 different things. The quote you have from the document is about entering University and the requirements - nothing to do with ECA for Immigration.


I would be very leary of believing too much you might read on that forum.. it's not always the most accurate information.


We encourage anyone giving Immigration information to only post links to the Official Website(s) or information found within BE and the Wiki please. Incorrect information given could result in someone losing their opportunity to emigrate.

Last edited by Siouxie; May 18th 2019 at 2:59 am.
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Old May 18th 2019, 2:57 am
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Default re: A-Levels (some) getting assessed by WES as a diploma.??

Originally Posted by Siouxie View Post
Don't confuse equivalency for entering an educational establishment or similar with obtaining an ECA assessment for points - they are 2 different things.

I would be very leary of believing too much you might read on that forum.. it's not always the most accurate information.


We encourage anyone giving Immigration information to only post links to the Official Website(s) or information found within BE and the Wiki please. Incorrect information given could result in someone losing their opportunity to emigrate.
Sorry!

His ECA said diploma anyway, doesn’t say high school diploma as Edexcel say it is? It’s all just too confusing..
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Old May 18th 2019, 5:46 am
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Default re: A-Levels (some) getting assessed by WES as a diploma.??

Originally Posted by Addzz120 View Post


Sorry!

His ECA said diploma anyway, doesn’t say high school diploma as Edexcel say it is? It’s all just too confusing..
It's normally pretty straightforward - you get points as laid out in https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration...stem/grid.html for the highest level you can check off. If a single person with a high school diploma/graduation (ie, A levels) you get 30 points. If you have a Bachelor's degree, you get 120. You don't get to claim them both (for 150), or the '128 for two or more', because you're getting the points for doing high school built into the points for a degree. If you want extra points you need to have done something else as well.
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Old May 18th 2019, 11:57 am
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Default re: A-Levels (some) getting assessed by WES as a diploma.??

Originally Posted by Vulcanoid View Post
It's normally pretty straightforward - you get points as laid out in https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration...stem/grid.html for the highest level you can check off. If a single person with a high school diploma/graduation (ie, A levels) you get 30 points. If you have a Bachelor's degree, you get 120. You don't get to claim them both (for 150), or the '128 for two or more', because you're getting the points for doing high school built into the points for a degree. If you want extra points you need to have done something else as well.
Thanks, but just to my AVCE being discontinued in 2005 it’s not as straight forward.
I’ve seen five people all successfully get it looked at by WES and CES as post secondary 2 year diploma but that was back in 2016, so i don’t know if anything has changed. Neither WES or CES will comment at all, it’s like talking to a stone. The WES guy simply said “he’s not aware of any policy changes” but i had to push him to get that from him so i hope that’s a good sign the outcome will be the same.

I thought this worth mentioning as if people are getting it passed as post secondary it could get them an ITA. This isn’t speculation either as the people posted their ECA report online. I read one person suggesting it could be considered higher than an ordinary A level as one A level won’t grant access to University but two will, which the AVCE is worth 2.

The whole blackout from WES is stressing me out, i’d expect them to atleast tell me if it’s post secondary still
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Old May 18th 2019, 2:32 pm
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Default re: A-Levels (some) getting assessed by WES as a diploma.??

Originally Posted by Addzz120 View Post


Thanks, but just to my AVCE being discontinued in 2005 it’s not as straight forward.
I’ve seen five people all successfully get it looked at by WES and CES as post secondary 2 year diploma but that was back in 2016, so i don’t know if anything has changed. Neither WES or CES will comment at all, it’s like talking to a stone. The WES guy simply said “he’s not aware of any policy changes” but i had to push him to get that from him so i hope that’s a good sign the outcome will be the same.

I thought this worth mentioning as if people are getting it passed as post secondary it could get them an ITA. This isn’t speculation either as the people posted their ECA report online. I read one person suggesting it could be considered higher than an ordinary A level as one A level won’t grant access to University but two will, which the AVCE is worth 2.

The whole blackout from WES is stressing me out, i’d expect them to atleast tell me if it’s post secondary still
They will only tell you if you PAY to have it assessed for ECA Immigration purposes.

Do note that if it isn't POST secondary - then you won't get additional points for 2 qualifications/diplomas. Immigration Canada is quite clear. Use the chart.

Better to have factual information rather than speculation.. so unless they posted a screenshot of the physical document from one of the approved ECA providers for Immigration then you are only going on what they are saying or believe themselves - which may not be correct... they could be confusing it with an ECA for entering Uni or for employment and thinking it's an ECA for Immigration - we have seen many who are confused on that.


A levels are more or less the equivalent of Grade 12 in Canada.


Last edited by Siouxie; May 18th 2019 at 2:39 pm.
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Old May 18th 2019, 3:02 pm
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Default re: A-Levels (some) getting assessed by WES as a diploma.??

Originally Posted by Siouxie View Post
They will only tell you if you PAY to have it assessed for ECA Immigration purposes.

Do note that if it isn't POST secondary - then you won't get additional points for 2 qualifications/diplomas. Immigration Canada is quite clear. Use the chart.

Better to have factual information rather than speculation.. so unless they posted a screenshot of the physical document from one of the approved ECA providers for Immigration then you are only going on what they are saying or believe themselves - which may not be correct... they could be confusing it with an ECA for entering Uni or for employment and thinking it's an ECA for Immigration - we have seen many who are confused on that.


A levels are more or less the equivalent of Grade 12 in Canada.

Atleast I know that now thanks.
I only saw one document he did the same course as me in the same year and got it passed as post secondary, he was using it for immigration purposes for ‘two or more degrees’ i found four others who also got it assessed as post secondary through both WES and CES, the document i saw was WES.

This is merely a bonus for me as it is worth two A levels i never bothered to get it assessed. When it was launched in 2002 it was only available at colleges originally, then a year later they let sixth forms do it. I don’t know if thats why it got assessed as post secondary, but the BTEC level 3 diploma is on par with with AVCE(also level3) and was only available in colleges. Perhaps thats the reason it just scrapes by? Both these would allow one to get into uni too where as one A level does not. That could also be a factor. Who knows.

Whatever the reason is its a huge bonus if it passes like the others did...if not i guess theres always an open university course i could do from canada. Then wait for ITA in 2020.
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Old May 18th 2019, 3:33 pm
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Default re: A-Levels (some) getting assessed by WES as a diploma.??

Originally Posted by Addzz120 View Post

Atleast I know that now thanks.
I only saw one document he did the same course as me in the same year and got it passed as post secondary, he was using it for immigration purposes for ‘two or more degrees’ i found four others who also got it assessed as post secondary through both WES and CES, the document i saw was WES.

This is merely a bonus for me as it is worth two A levels i never bothered to get it assessed. When it was launched in 2002 it was only available at colleges originally, then a year later they let sixth forms do it. I don’t know if thats why it got assessed as post secondary, but the BTEC level 3 diploma is on par with with AVCE(also level3) and was only available in colleges. Perhaps thats the reason it just scrapes by? Both these would allow one to get into uni too where as one A level does not. That could also be a factor. Who knows.

Whatever the reason is its a huge bonus if it passes like the others did...if not i guess theres always an open university course i could do from canada. Then wait for ITA in 2020.
Perhaps ignore the 'get you into Uni' part - it's not relevant. A full time College course of more than 1 year may help with points because it's deemed post-secondary.. so fingers crossed that you can get an assessment upgrade.

Have you had a look at this tool? Choose 'comprehensive ranking system' from the drop down. https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration...ad-report.html then sort it from low to high in left column

A 1 year certificate or diploma is worth 84 points
A 2 year certificate or diploma, whether judged as post secondary or not, is worth 91 points
A Secondary School diploma plus a 2 year certificate or diploma is worth 91 points

I believe in order to get the '2 or more degrees or certificates' points one of the courses would need to be of 3 year duration

Last edited by Siouxie; May 18th 2019 at 3:51 pm.
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Old May 18th 2019, 6:17 pm
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Default re: A-Levels (some) getting assessed by WES as a diploma.??

Originally Posted by Siouxie View Post
Perhaps ignore the 'get you into Uni' part - it's not relevant. A full time College course of more than 1 year may help with points because it's deemed post-secondary.. so fingers crossed that you can get an assessment upgrade.

Have you had a look at this tool? Choose 'comprehensive ranking system' from the drop down. https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration...ad-report.html then sort it from low to high in left column

A 1 year certificate or diploma is worth 84 points
A 2 year certificate or diploma, whether judged as post secondary or not, is worth 91 points
A Secondary School diploma plus a 2 year certificate or diploma is worth 91 points

I believe in order to get the '2 or more degrees or certificates' points one of the courses would need to be of 3 year duration
Thanks for assisting, I was up at 4am last night stressing about this.

So the gain access to higher education isn't relevant? What is relevant then in the WES assessment...study hours?

Yes I have reviewed the link and it would come under ' Three-year or more certificate, diploma, or degree plus a College Diploma (two years)' if successful as I have a degree assessed by wes as a Four year bachelors.
I read that Canadians would do a 2 -3 year diploma in a community college to then go to university. The AVCE was also two years study time to get into University just like a BTEC national level 3 diploma which is considered by WES as a 2 year college diploma. When I wikipedia the BTEC is also directly compares it to my AVCE.

If it's as simple as 'did you do this at college or school' that then becomes more complex. The AVCE was originally a college course like it's equivalent BTEC national diploma, after 3 years the examiners then let some schools do it after previously only allowing them to do the single award from the off (1 A level) not the double that I did. If that's what it comes do WES may just say "no you still did it at a school" or "yeah its fine as it was originally college thus further education" I would hope that's not the case though as the overall credential would still be the same as someone who did it in college and i would be the same age as someone about to go to uni like a Canadian college graduate.
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Old May 19th 2019, 5:47 am
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Default re: A-Levels (some) getting assessed by WES as a diploma.??

Originally Posted by Addzz120 View Post
Thanks for assisting, I was up at 4am last night stressing about this.

So the gain access to higher education isn't relevant? What is relevant then in the WES assessment...study hours?

Yes I have reviewed the link and it would come under ' Three-year or more certificate, diploma, or degree plus a College Diploma (two years)' if successful as I have a degree assessed by wes as a Four year bachelors.
I read that Canadians would do a 2 -3 year diploma in a community college to then go to university. The AVCE was also two years study time to get into University just like a BTEC national level 3 diploma which is considered by WES as a 2 year college diploma. When I wikipedia the BTEC is also directly compares it to my AVCE.

If it's as simple as 'did you do this at college or school' that then becomes more complex. The AVCE was originally a college course like it's equivalent BTEC national diploma, after 3 years the examiners then let some schools do it after previously only allowing them to do the single award from the off (1 A level) not the double that I did. If that's what it comes do WES may just say "no you still did it at a school" or "yeah its fine as it was originally college thus further education" I would hope that's not the case though as the overall credential would still be the same as someone who did it in college and i would be the same age as someone about to go to uni like a Canadian college graduate.
AH!!! I'm not sure that I had read that from you anywhere before, apologies! So it's going to be 7 points difference overall.. A 4 year degree is worth 112 points and Degree plus a 2 year / 3 year post secondary diploma or certificate is 119. The only way you are going to know officially is to apply to WES or one of the other companies for an ECA for Immigration purposes unfortunately. What a shame you didn't submit it when you submitted your degree.

You are comparing apples with oranges.. no point in comparing what a Canadian would do to go to Uni etc., it's not relevant.

WES would normally expect it to be a full time course at a Vocational College or other College or University - not school - (as it's post secondary) for a period of 1 / 2 / 3 years which would need to be confirmed by the college that you attended / examining body at the time that you attended, not how it was taught later.

You can see what WES need from you/the college in order to assess here - it's more or less the same as you would have sent for your degree.:
1. Certificate/Diploma

For example: BTEC Certificates/Diplomas, SQA Higher National Certificates/Diplomas, ACCA Membership

2. Transcript of Academic Records

This is an official document issued by the appropriate examining body that lists all subjects or modules taken and grades earned for each level.

https://www.wes.org/ca/required-documents/

Try not to stress

Last edited by Siouxie; May 19th 2019 at 6:00 am.
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Old May 19th 2019, 10:03 am
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Default re: A-Levels (some) getting assessed by WES as a diploma.??

Originally Posted by Siouxie View Post
AH!!! I'm not sure that I had read that from you anywhere before, apologies! So it's going to be 7 points difference overall.. A 4 year degree is worth 112 points and Degree plus a 2 year / 3 year post secondary diploma or certificate is 119. The only way you are going to know officially is to apply to WES or one of the other companies for an ECA for Immigration purposes unfortunately. What a shame you didn't submit it when you submitted your degree.

You are comparing apples with oranges.. no point in comparing what a Canadian would do to go to Uni etc., it's not relevant.

WES would normally expect it to be a full time course at a Vocational College or other College or University - not school - (as it's post secondary) for a period of 1 / 2 / 3 years which would need to be confirmed by the college that you attended / examining body at the time that you attended, not how it was taught later.

You can see what WES need from you/the college in order to assess here - it's more or less the same as you would have sent for your degree.:
1. Certificate/Diploma

For example: BTEC Certificates/Diplomas, SQA Higher National Certificates/Diplomas, ACCA Membership

2. Transcript of Academic Records

This is an official document issued by the appropriate examining body that lists all subjects or modules taken and grades earned for each level.

https://www.wes.org/ca/required-documents/

Try not to stress
Apologies i should have said and added more context. As it was a level 3 qualification i didn’t bother sending it off with my degree. It’s only when i saw multiple people getting it passed as a diploma that i thought i was in luck.

Oh no that doesn’t sound encouraging! If anything that may make it harder to assess. It was definitely only available to colleges originally, only some schools got the option two years later to offer it. I would gutted if WES said it was high school when everyone else got it as further education if they only go off where it was done. It says on the BTEC wiki page it’s comparable to the AVCE and they assess those as diplomas. Hopefully they will consider it’s the same academic weight despite it being done at a school but now I’m not confident. I think i may email (as i’ve now sent it) and ask them to note that on file for me.
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Old May 19th 2019, 10:24 am
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Default re: A-Levels (some) getting assessed by WES as a diploma.??

Originally Posted by Addzz120 View Post


Apologies i should have said and added more context. As it was a level 3 qualification i didn’t bother sending it off with my degree. It’s only when i saw multiple people getting it passed as a diploma that i thought i was in luck.

Oh no that doesn’t sound encouraging! If anything that may make it harder to assess. It was definitely only available to colleges originally, only some schools got the option two years later to offer it. I would gutted if WES said it was high school when everyone else got it as further education if they only go off where it was done. It says on the BTEC wiki page it’s comparable to the AVCE and they assess those as diplomas. Hopefully they will consider it’s the same academic weight despite it being done at a school but now I’m not confident. I think i may email (as i’ve now sent it) and ask them to note that on file for me.
I may not be understanding this, but are you saying that you would get two WES assessments done one for each qualification? i.e. one would be a degree one a diploma therefore you could state you had degree plus diploma? If so. This is not my understanding of the system. I believe you have to get WES to state in their assessment that you have equivalent to degree plus diploma I.e. in a single ECA. This is because they need to assess the highest education level held. If the diploma was a stepping stone to the degree and not post degree then the highest qualification is degree and you receive the points for that and only that.
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Old May 19th 2019, 10:33 am
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Default re: A-Levels (some) getting assessed by WES as a diploma.??

Originally Posted by Engineer_abroad View Post


I may not be understanding this, but are you saying that you would get two WES assessments done one for each qualification? i.e. one would be a degree one a diploma therefore you could state you had degree plus diploma? If so. This is not my understanding of the system. I believe you have to get WES to state in their assessment that you have equivalent to degree plus diploma I.e. in a single ECA. This is because they need to assess the highest education level held. If the diploma was a stepping stone to the degree and not post degree then the highest qualification is degree and you receive the points for that and only that.
Nope, i upgraded the report so it’s not two independent assessments. So if successful it would then read “bachelors (four years) and diploma (two years).
The requirement states clearly two or more diplomas or degrees with one being atleast 3 years. The point you raised here has been discussed many times and never affected anyone. As long as it meets that definition on CIC its two. I could have two bachelors degrees too and this would be fine, despite one not being a stepping stone. There’s numerous threads on it but here’s one.
<SNIP AGAIN>

Last edited by Siouxie; May 19th 2019 at 1:45 pm. Reason: Link removed to other forum and incorrect information - only official or internal links please.
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