nonong

We intend to drive to Toronto (from the U.S.) in our van which will be included in the list of Goods To Follow because we would have to come back to the U.S. to wrap things up. So my questions are:

1)Will Canadian customs allow us to NOT register the van first until we return to Canada for our permanent move, or will we be required to register the van the moment we land, and if so, how long will that process take?

2) would we have to do anything at all with U.S. Customs when leaving the U.S.?

3) would it be better for us to land in a rented vehicle first rather than taking our own van that is in the list of goods to follow?

4) are those traveling to Canada from the U.S. inspected by U.S. Immigration and Customs upon exit, and if so, what exactly are they looking for - documents to prove ownership of the vehicle, etc. ?

Jonathan Makepeace

nonong <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > 1)Will Canadian customs allow us to NOT register the van first until we
    > return to Canada for our permanent move, or will we be required to
    > register the van the moment we land, and if so, how long will that
    > process take?

My understanding is that you would have to import the van immediately
if it is with you when you land, at least that is what I was told 2
1/2 years ago. The process takes about a month (when all goes well),
and you really have to be living in Canada to complete it. Plus,
you're in big trouble if you don't complete it within a month, since
your car would nolonger be legal in either country. If I were you I
would not bring the van with me until I was ready to actually take up
residence in Canada.

Technically, you need a special insurance card from your U.S. auto
insurance company to drive in Canada. Most people ignore this
requirement, but the Canadian police can require you to show this
card which proves that your U.S. auto insurance covers you for the
minimum Canadian liability requirements (which are higher than most
states). Get that card before you try to import your car.

    > 2) would we have to do anything at all with U.S. Customs when
    > leaving the U.S.?

Yes. There is paperwork for informing U.S. Customs that you are
exporting the car to Canada. You need to send it to the border post
days in advance. It's very important, otherwise your car could appear
as a "stolen" U.S. vehicle when you came back to visit the U.S. with
Canadian plates. It's a good idea to keep your export paperwork in
your car even after it is registered in a Canadian province, just in
case their is a burocratic foul up.

    > 3) would it be better for us to land in a rented vehicle first rather
    > than taking our own van that is in the list of goods to follow?

That's exactly what I did, but I have heard that Canadian Customs has
rules about Canadian residents driving non-Canadian plated vehicles
within Canada (you become a Canadian resident when you land). I was
allowed to drive my U.S.-plated rental car into Canada when I landed,
but I've heard that this is unusual.

    > 4) are those traveling to Canada from the U.S. inspected by U.S.
    > Immigration and Customs upon exit, and if so, what exactly are they
    > looking for - documents to prove ownership of the vehicle, etc. ?

No, you're not NORMALLY stopped by U.S. Customs when leaving the
country, though they do SOMETIMES stop Canada-bound traffic. When
they do it they generally don't explain why. It's not routine, but
it does happen.

But, believe me, Canada Customs will not fail to notice that you have
a van with you when you land.

nonong

Jonathan,

thank you for your detailed reply. If it were almost impossible, or even just impractical, to rent a vehicle (especially more so if they had to have Canadian plates) at this stage (no time to inform U.S. Customs that I will be exporting the vehicles), would the correct procedure be to simply NOT declare the vehicles in the list of Goods To Follow, and then maybe bring them in next time I return to Canada and pay import duties (assuming I cannot sell them here in the U.S. by the time I need to return to Canada to reside there permanently)? What would you (or anyone else in this forum please) suggest at this time? I strongly doubt that the rental car companies in my state would have vehicles with Canadian plates available for rental, and even if they did, I am told that the U.S. Immigration would scrutinize anyone entering by land in a vehicle with Canadian plates, much more than they would anyone in a vehicle with U.S. plates ( I don't know if this is accurate, though).

nonong

I'm still looking for replies from those with a more recent experience, please.

sysclp

I brought my car over as goods to follow a bit over 2 years ago now. I landed in a US rental car (rented at Buffalo airport) and had my own car on my list of goods to follow. I had no problem with the US rental since I was taking it back to Buffalo in 4 days (had to finish out work in the US before I moved). When I came back with my U-Haul truck and car, it wasn't a problem just a lot of paperwork and being careful to get it all correct. Go to this page for all the info on importing your car:
http://www.riv.ca/english/html/how_to_import.html
Yes you have to export it at US customs first and they give you paperwork you have to give to Canada Customs when you import it.

I would suggest you not bring your van yet if you are coming up and leaving in a few days, just rent a car in the US. You can park your van at the Buffalo airport and rent a car there for the rest of the trip. Just make sure your van is on your list of goods to follow and tell them you are bringing it next time. Once you get it here, you will have to get a couple of inspections (one for RIV to see if it meets all Canadian specs or has to be modified and one for mechanical soundness, both are require to get your registration).

nonong

Well, my problem is that I won't be in Toronto for just a "few" days after landing. I will most likely be there for about a month, maybe even longer, which means I will be paying a fortune for the rental van. So I'm thinking that it might come out cheaper for me to not include it in my list of goods to follow, and then to just pay import duties on the van when I return to live in Toronto permanently. What do you guys think of this scenario?

nonong

I meant to not include MY van (and not the rental van) in the list of goods to follow, and then to just pay import duties on MY van (and not the rental van).

Jonathan Makepeace

nonong <member9252@british_expats.com> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > Well, my problem is that I won't be in Toronto for just a "few" days
    > after landing. I will most likely be there for about a month, maybe
    > even longer, which means I will be paying a fortune for the rental van.
    > So I'm thinking that it might come out cheaper for me to not include it
    > in my list of goods to follow, and then to just pay import duties on the
    > van when I return to live in Toronto permanently. What do you guys
    > think of this scenario?

I don't see how leaving the van off your list of goods to follow could
possibly do you any good. Regardless of whether the van is on the
list, the very first thing any customs officer is going to notice is
that a resident of Canada (you) is driving a foreign-plated vehicle
into the country. The list of goods to follow just lets you avoid
paying duty on your personal effects. Leaving something off the list
doesn't absolve you of your obligation to declare it when entering the
country. There's no way they're going to fail to notice the vehicle
you are driving.

Why do you need to land now? Why not wait until you are really ready
to move to Canada? It would make things much simpler.

nonong

My visa expires first week of October, and I will need at least 3 months more here in the U.S. to wrap things up. If only you could imagine how I want so much to postpone my landing if possible, but we all know that it is impossible without losing the visa and having to re-apply and wait a few more years again.

But what I'm wondering about is this - why should they force me to register a vehicle that I am not including in the list of goods to follow? In other words, if I borrowed my neighbor's van to land in Canada, for example, then certainly they could not force me to register the van in Canada, since I would have to return it to its rightful owner here in the U.S., correct? By the same token, what if I plan to sell my van here in the U.S. and what if I really do not intend to bring my van back to Canada with me when I move there permanently? So there would of course be no need to register it in Canada and there would also be no need for me to include it in the list of Goods To Follow, correct? I'm confused.

sysclp

How about a one-way rental from Buffalo to Canada then? You can do that for a fee but that would be cheaper than the rental for a month. You don't really want to avoid importing your van forever, just for this trip so you can bring it later or sell it in the US, whichever you decide. Just remember, there is 15% sales tax on vehicles in Canada. Ouch!

Jonathan Makepeace

nonong <member9252@british_expats.com> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > But what I'm wondering about is this - why should they force me to
    > register a vehicle that I am not including in the list of goods to
    > follow?

Why would the van be on your list of goods to FOLLOW if it is with you
when you land? Remember, you become a resident of Canada when you
land. You're not a visitor.

    > In other words, if I borrowed my neighbor's van to land in
    > Canada, for example, then certainly they could not force me to register
    > the van in Canada, since I would have to return it to its rightful
    > owner here in the U.S., correct?

As I understand it, as a landed immigrant, you would not be allowed to
drive your neighbour's US-plated van into Canada unless your neighbour
was sitting right next to you in the van and the trip was largely for
her or his benefit, not yours.

    > By the same token, what if I plan to sell my van here in
    > the U.S. and what if I really do not intend to bring my
    > van back to Canada with me when I move there permanently?

But you will be bringing the van with you when you land. You're not a
visitor to Canada, you are a new resident.

    > So there would of course be no need to register it in
    > Canada and there would also be no need for me to include
    > it in the list of Goods To Follow, correct? I'm confused.

It IS very confusing. I think you need to call Canada Customs and
Revenue Agency to hear it straight from them:

http://www.ccra-adrc.gc.ca/contact/rco-e.html

nonong

Does anyone know if I, as the owner of the vehicle, would have to be in Canada to complete the registration of the vehicle, or can I drive it to Canada, start the registration process and leave it with a relative, like my son for example, and then get a rental car in Canada to come back into the U.S. ?