Kumar

http://www.imdiversity.com/villages/...Article_ID=126

Check this out. This is the truth......

What a stupid decision I made to come to Canada.....

Now I am looking for odd jobs... enough these are not easy to come by.....I have
filled many job apps...

Every odd job seems to need a damn car..... they make up some excuse....

I can't believe it.. over a year ago I was explaining to my co-workers my C++
alogorithms etc.... now I am looking for a security or $7 /per hour job to survive...

Thank god for free health at least... That is the only thing good about Canada.

Several of my friends are working in the factory for the past 6 months or so.

God help any new immigrants who come to Canada... GET READY TO GET THE CANADIAN
TREATMENT.

(If you have a high muscle tissue density, then do not worry there are plenty of
warehouse work available... u need to be able to lift upto 90 lbs)

Greg Del Pilar

Kumar:

I think the article is good and "unbiased". Thanks for posting it here.

Different people have different reasons for coming to Canada (even those who really
intend to live here for good). Unfortunately, most are "first-time immigrants" (i.e.,
they've never immigrated before) who's main understanding of the concept of
"immigration" is that it is always a move for the better TEST hence the expectation
for a better life is very high. Unfortunately, too, "better" is subject to different
interpretation and circumstances. Obviously, for many highly skilled immigrants, the
various challenges/difficulties mentioned in the article will be very difficult to
accept and survive from. I'm really hoping that ALL would-be Canadian immigrants
first be given the chance to read many articles like this before being allowed to
make the final decision to "uproot" themselves and move in. They will at least be
more prepared to brace themselves for the situation and open themselves to
alternatives. Also, they will at least take a second look (or as many as necessary!)
at all their OTHER options, making it "easier" to accept the consequences (and rise
from it), in case the results are not very good.

Good luck to all of us!

Greg

"kumar" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    >
http://www.imdiversity.com/villages/...Article_ID=126
    >
    > Check this out. This is the truth......
    >
    > What a stupid decision I made to come to Canada.....
    >
    > Now I am looking for odd jobs... enough these are not easy to come by.....I have
    > filled many job apps...
    >
    > Every odd job seems to need a damn car..... they make up some excuse....
    >
    > I can't believe it.. over a year ago I was explaining to my co-workers my C++
    > alogorithms etc.... now I am looking for a security or $7 /per hour job to
    > survive...
    >
    > Thank god for free health at least... That is the only thing good about Canada.
    >
    > Several of my friends are working in the factory for the past 6 months or so.
    >
    > God help any new immigrants who come to Canada... GET READY TO GET THE CANADIAN
    > TREATMENT.
    >
    > (If you have a high muscle tissue density, then do not worry there are plenty of
    > warehouse work available... u need to be able to lift upto 90 lbs)

Kumar

Mr. Greg,

I believe that you are a well settled lucky white immigrant. I apologize for
using the term 'white' but it is a fact that there is subtle racism when it comes
to jobs in Canada. My intention is not to start a debate on racism... If you are
offended by the term, I apologize.

What I am saying is that the government of Canada does not inform the would-be
immigrants in advance about these problems. They give a rosy picture of Canada .. you
know... best country in the world... low crime rate.... social services available....
free health.....

They should be highlighting real problems .. so immigrants can take a decision
whether to plunge...

Ok... I am an IT guy. Before I came to Canada, I accepted the fact that I will not
get an IT job. What I was counting on was to get an odd job for 1-2 years till things
settle down. $7-10/per hour is just abt enough for me to survive. BUT TO MY DISMAY,
EVEN ODD JOBS ARE HARD TO COME BY. I have tried security, dishwasher, cleaning,
cashier, car park attendant, kitchen helper, bakery helper, food basics helper, Tim
Hortons helper......... Every damn thing wants some experience.. or some sort of
certificate....

How is a skilled worker coming to Canada to know that he needs to do certification to
be a kitchen helper or a security guard??

The only jobs available seem to be manufacturing jobs... people who are average built
asians cannot qualify for these. They looked at me and said u can't carry 90lbs... OF
COURSE I CAN'T (This is not because I am lazy.. it is because I have a modest muscle
tissue density).

It is now much tougher for immigrants now that those who came in previous years. I
talked to several recruiters... he said Toronto only has more than 1000 jobless java
programmers looking for jobs.!! Some recruiters have stopped recruiting IT guys
because companies are not hiring.

The only way seems to be if you have alot of contacts within companies in Canada.....
networking....

GOD SAVE Would-be immigrants.

"Greg Del Pilar" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected] >...
    > Kumar:
    >
    > I think the article is good and "unbiased". Thanks for posting it here.
    >
    > Different people have different reasons for coming to Canada (even those who really
    > intend to live here for good). Unfortunately, most are "first-time immigrants"
    > (i.e., they've never immigrated before) who's main understanding of the concept of
    > "immigration" is that it is always a move for the better TEST hence the expectation
    > for a better life is very high. Unfortunately, too, "better" is subject to
    > different interpretation and circumstances. Obviously, for many highly skilled
    > immigrants, the various challenges/difficulties mentioned in the article will be
    > very difficult to accept and survive from. I'm really hoping that ALL would-be
    > Canadian immigrants first be given the chance to read many articles like this
    > before being allowed to make the final decision to "uproot" themselves and move in.
    > They will at least be more prepared to brace themselves for the situation and open
    > themselves to alternatives. Also, they will at least take a second look (or as many
    > as necessary!) at all their OTHER options, making it "easier" to accept the
    > consequences (and rise from it), in case the results are not very good.
    >
    > Good luck to all of us!
    >
    > Greg

scarlet

hi, kumar !
you may have read my postings on the usa immigration section, etc. this is what i have been asking canadian/usa citizens about, ie what is life really like there?
and when i read your posting, i thought what good is it emigrating to canada or for that matter the usa? yes, i have paid for iimgration to canada and my interview is due soon, but to tell you truth, if i cant get a proper job there, there is no way i will move from england. even if it means that i lose the $4000 or so i paid for the application. i mean, i have quite decent technical job in electronics where i am earning around £28 000 a year (thats about $56 000 canadian) and ok, there doesn't seem to be any promotion hopes but at least i have a good life with plenty of leisure time. ok, we have refugees coming over here from all over the place and that is changing england in a negative way, but at least we are relatively safe here! there is no way i would even contemplate flipping burgers, cleaning, dishwashing etc. after all the hard work i have done to get qualified, you think i would dump all that down the drain, just cos i wanted to live in the usa or canada ?? no way, mate! i advise you to go back to your home country, wherever that is and make your life there. in my view, you are just killing yourself for nothing doing those menial jobs, when you are obviously of intellectual intelligence.

Leisure

I've seen so many posts about how tough is to settle in Canada, and how people think they deserve better. My biggest question to all of you who think Canada has not been fair to you is: Why did you left your country to begin with?

I don't think Canada, or any other country, needs 250,000 CIOs or CEOs a year. It is stupid to think that whenever you land you will be getting this dream job and that you will be making ten times of what you used to make. Well, I guess it is time for a reality check... Things just don't work that way! not where you don't know a soul. I think that the only difference between Canada and your home country is the networking and people you know. Don't blame Canada, try to immigrate to any other country without knowing shit. The result ===> Same thing! Canda is more evident becasue it is onde of the FEW places with open immigration policies. Needless to say, the environment is much more competitive.

I am trying to immigrate to Canada because things in my home country suck big time. I am perfectly aware that I might need to start from scratch, who cares, it is not the first year that I am looking forward for, it is the rest of my life. To be honest, I'd rather clean toilettes in Canada than in my home country (Nobody says you will never need to that that). And do you know why? Because of the other 10,000 things that Canada offer that are not highlited in this depressing articles/posts. Besides, why would you think the age is such an important factor for qualifying? Immigration is not for everybody who was born in shitty place!

I've always believed that Countries open to immigration are the best places to live in, just becasue the fact that most people that immigrate work hard towards making their new home a much better place. If the only thing you can do is bitch and whine, stay where you are. No country in the world needs you. Remember immigration is a two way street.

I think a lot of people will apprecieate if you stop destroying hopes of a new life. Hope is the only thing that keeps us alive!

Sergey M. Drach

this is sergey again. after having lived here for 5 years, my advice to everybody who
contemplates immigration is simple:

if you're doing more or less okay in your home country, don't even think of coming
here. because, no matter what you did in your home country - maybe you were a big
important manager of a factory, or you were a scientist, or else), DOES NOT COUNT
HERE, unless you're a genius, or a star hockey player.

on the other hand, if you're real desperate, or there's a war going on, or maybe you
like using yourself as a sort of a human experiment, then pack your bags, and get
ready for a long rough streak.

"scarlet" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > hi, kumar ! you may have read my postings on the usa immigration section, etc. this
    > is what i have been asking canadian/usa citizens about, ie what is life really like
    > there? and when i read your posting, i thought what good is it emigrating to canada
    > or for that matter the usa? yes, i have paid for iimgration to canada and my
    > interview is due soon, but to tell you truth, if i cant get a proper job there,
    > there is no way i will move from england. even if it means that i lose the $4000 or
    > so i paid for the application. i mean, i have quite decent technical job in
    > electronics where i am earning around £28 000 a year (thats about $56 000 canadian)
    > and ok, there doesn't seem to be any promotion hopes but at least i have a good
    > life with plenty of leisure time. ok, we have refugees coming over here from all
    > over the place and that is changing england in a negative way, but at least we are
    > relatively safe here! there is no way i would even contemplate flipping burgers,
    > cleaning, dishwashing etc. after all the hard work i have done to get qualified,
    > you think i would dump all that down the drain, just cos i wanted to live in the
    > usa or canada ?? no way, mate! i advise you to go back to your home country,
    > wherever that is and make your life there. in my view, you are just killing
    > yourself for nothing doing those menial jobs, when you are obviously of
    > intellectual intelligence.
    >
    >
    >
    > --
    > Posted via http://britishexpats.com

Greg Del Pilar

Kumar:

    > I believe that you are a well settled lucky white immigrant. I apologize for
    > using the term 'white' but it is a fact that there is subtle racism when it
    > comes to jobs in Canada. My intention is not to start a debate on racism... If
    > you are offended by the term, I apologize.
    >

I am not offended. But, just for your info, I am an Asian immigrant too, and am also
presently experiencing the same difficulties you're having. And, like you, I am also
sometimes wondering if I made the right decision to move here. However, I feel that I
have not explored all my options yet, and thus I am still optimistic about my own
personal situation.

    > What I was counting on was to get an odd job for 1-2 years till things settle down.
    > $7-10/per hour is just abt enough for me to survive. BUT TO MY DISMAY, EVEN ODD
    > JOBS ARE HARD TO COME BY. I have tried security, dishwasher, cleaning, cashier, car
    > park attendant, kitchen helper, bakery helper, food basics helper, Tim Hortons
    > helper......... Every damn thing wants some experience.. or some sort of
    > certificate....
    >

I understand your frustrations, and you've pointed out very valid arguments. However,
instead of blaming you or the Canadian goverment for all that's happenning, I prefer
to just offer a few more suggestions. Please feel free to refuse, but it might be
worth considering them (honestly, I'm considering them, too).

1) If you had been turned down even on the oddest jobs you've applied for (for
whatever reason they have, racist or otherwise), have you considered creating your
own employment? The easiest thing I can think of to illustrate this is a hotdog
stand. I'm thinking that it might not cost too much to build/buy your own
equipments and start cooking hotdogs on busy streets. I see a lot of them where I
am now, and, to my amazement, the people manning those stands I've asked are just
employees of the owner. It made me think that hotdog stands are probably
profitable enough for their owners to be able to "expand" and hire their own
employees. Maybe TEST just maybe TEST I can be my own hotdog stand owner and earn
the same (if not more) than what I would have earned if I got accepted in one of
those odd jobs I applied to before.

There should be many other "business enterprises" that you and I can think of that
will be within our resources and talents. Also, they DON'T need to be
computer-related. Public libraries might be able to help us find and learn them, and
use them to our advantage.

2) As the article suggested, have you considered moving to other areas in Canada? I
mean, not to Ontario, British Columbia, or Alberta. I have seen several posts here
that talked about finding success when they accepted the fact that they have to
"chase" the opportunities by uprooting themselves again and again. I know this is
hard, and you're probably thinking that you didn't come to Canada to have to do
this (I sometimes feel that way, too, you know), but that's just a fact of life
here in North America (as far as I know) TEST- people move to where their jobs
take them or need them to be. .

I know these suggestions are degrading, disappointing, discouraging, maybe doesn't
even make sense to you (or anyone else on the same situation as yours and mine), but
my point is, you and I have to try all possible options we have to survive or, at
least, buy more time for us. Whatever decision we've made in the past, right or
wrong, has already been made and we must learn to cope with the consequences.

Again, please bear in mind that I'm coming from the same situation as you, so these
suggestions are as directed to me as they are to you. This newsgroup, unfortunately,
is not really a support group for immigrants "in trouble" like us, and I'm hoping
someone could point out where to find such (or create such).

    > GOD SAVE Would-be immigrants.
    >

I hope this helped. Thanks!

Greg

Sergey M. Drach

Actually, the idea of a hotdog stand is pretty sound. When I used to work for Future
Shop store sellling cell phones, there was always a guy with his hotdog stand outside
(in any weather!). I thought he was a fool to do this but I changed my mind quickly
after my colleague from the TV and Home Electronics Department was recently talking
to this "hotdog" guy about a projection TV.

I said, "Can he afford?" My colleague said, "Don't look at his greasy pants
and jacket... That guy makes 10 grand a month." I thought it was a joke, but
he was serious.

-Sergey Drachev Toronto

"Greg Del Pilar" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > Kumar:
    >
    > > I believe that you are a well settled lucky white immigrant. I apologize for
    > > using the term 'white' but it is a fact that there is subtle racism when it
    > > comes to jobs in Canada. My intention is not to start a debate on racism...
    > > If you are offended by the term, I apologize.
    > >
    >
    > I am not offended. But, just for your info, I am an Asian immigrant too,
and
    > am also presently experiencing the same difficulties you're having. And, like you,
    > I am also sometimes wondering if I made the right decision to
move
    > here. However, I feel that I have not explored all my options yet, and
thus
    > I am still optimistic about my own personal situation.
    >
    > > What I was counting on was to get an odd job for 1-2 years till things settle
    > > down. $7-10/per hour is just abt enough for me to survive. BUT TO MY DISMAY, EVEN
    > > ODD JOBS ARE HARD TO COME BY. I have tried security, dishwasher, cleaning,
    > > cashier, car park attendant, kitchen helper, bakery helper, food basics helper,
    > > Tim Hortons helper......... Every damn thing wants some experience.. or some sort
    > > of certificate....
    > >
    >
    > I understand your frustrations, and you've pointed out very valid arguments.
    > However, instead of blaming you or the Canadian goverment for
all
    > that's happenning, I prefer to just offer a few more suggestions. Please feel
    > free to refuse, but it might be worth considering them (honestly, I'm considering
    > them, too).
    >
    > 1) If you had been turned down even on the oddest jobs you've applied for (for
    > whatever reason they have, racist or otherwise), have you considered creating
    > your own employment? The easiest thing I can think of to
illustrate
    > this is a hotdog stand. I'm thinking that it might not cost too much to build/buy
    > your own equipments and start cooking hotdogs on busy streets. I see a lot of them
    > where I am now, and, to my amazement, the people manning those stands I've asked
    > are just employees of the owner. It made me think that hotdog stands are probably
    > profitable enough for their owners to be able to "expand" and hire their own
    > employees. Maybe TEST just maybe TEST I can be my own hotdog stand owner and earn
    > the same (if not more) than what
I
    > would have earned if I got accepted in one of those odd jobs I applied to before.
    >
    > There should be many other "business enterprises" that you and I can think of that
    > will be within our resources and talents. Also, they DON'T need to be
    > computer-related. Public libraries might be able to help us find and learn them,
    > and use them to our advantage.
    >
    > 2) As the article suggested, have you considered moving to other areas in Canada? I
    > mean, not to Ontario, British Columbia, or Alberta. I have seen several posts
    > here that talked about finding success when they accepted
the
    > fact that they have to "chase" the opportunities by uprooting themselves again and
    > again. I know this is hard, and you're probably thinking that
you
    > didn't come to Canada to have to do this (I sometimes feel that way, too, you
    > know), but that's just a fact of life here in North America (as far as
I
    > know) TEST- people move to where their jobs take them or need them to be. .
    >
    > I know these suggestions are degrading, disappointing, discouraging, maybe doesn't
    > even make sense to you (or anyone else on the same situation as yours and mine),
    > but my point is, you and I have to try all possible
options
    > we have to survive or, at least, buy more time for us. Whatever decision we've made
    > in the past, right or wrong, has already been made and we must learn to cope with
    > the consequences.
    >
    > Again, please bear in mind that I'm coming from the same situation as you, so these
    > suggestions are as directed to me as they are to you. This newsgroup,
    > unfortunately, is not really a support group for immigrants "in trouble" like us,
    > and I'm hoping someone could point out where to find
such
    > (or create such).
    >
    > > GOD SAVE Would-be immigrants.
    > >
    >
    > I hope this helped. Thanks!
    >
    > Greg
    >

Kumar

Leisure <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
    > I've seen so many posts about how tough is to settle in Canada, and how people
    > think they deserve better. My biggest question to all of you who think Canada has
    > not been fair to you is: Why did you left your country to begin with?
If I did not expect it to be tough to get an odd job??

    >
    > I don't think Canada, or any other country, needs 250,000 CIOs or CEOs a year. It
    > is stupid to think that whenever you land you will be getting this dream job and
    > that you will be making ten times of what you used to
As I said previously, I never came here expecting a dream job.!!

    > make. Well, I guess it is time for a reality check... Things just don't work that
    > way! not where you don't know a soul. I think that the only difference between
    > Canada and your home country is the networking and people you know. Don't blame
    > Canada, try to immigrate to any other country without knowing shit. The result ===>
    > Same thing! Canda is more evident becasue it is onde of the FEW places with open
    > immigration policies. Needless to say, the environment is much more competitive.
    >
I guess you are not stupid after all.!

    > I am trying to immigrate to Canada because things in my home country suck big time.
    > I am perfectly aware that I might need to start from scratch, who cares, it is not
    > the first year that I am looking forward for, it is the rest of my life.
I come from a place which is same as you.

    >To be honest, I'd rather clean toilettes in Canada than in my home country (Nobody
    >says you will never need to that that).

You would need experience to get this job in Canada. Starting cleaning toilets in
your home country.. and don't forget to bring you references.

    >And do you know why? Because of the other 10,000 things that Canada offer that are
    >not highlited in this depressing articles/posts. Besides, why would you think the
    >age is such an important factor for qualifying? Immigration is not for everybody who
    >was born in shitty place!
    >
What did I say about age??

    > I've always believed that Countries open to immigration are the best places to live
    > in, just becasue the fact that most people that immigrate work hard towards making
    > their new home a much better place. If the only thing you can do is bitch and
    > whine, stay where you are. No country in the world needs you. Remember immigration
    > is a two way street.
    >
Too late for that. When you come to Canada.. you have to put up with alot of people
who whine and bitch....!

    > I think a lot of people will apprecieate if you stop destroying hopes of a new
    > life. Hope is the only thing that keeps us alive!
I am trying to give them the real show. Everybody is welcome to their opinions. My
primary goal of starting this discussion is to get would be immigrants to first spend
abt 2 months if possible and experience the real situ in Canada. I know it is not
possible for all.. but let us try.

I felt exactly like you before I came. Alot of people already in Canada were saying
shitty things. I did not listen to them.

And you know what... I am trying to earn my bread in Canada instead of living on
Social Assistance, or faking medical disabilities, or as a fake refugee.

All I am asking is for the Government to make it easier for new people to get the $7
dollar per hour job at least.

iancurtis

Hi,

My wife and I applied for Visas last October and up 'till now we were really disappointed that we'd heard nothing. Now I think the delay has been a blessing in disguise as it's allowed me time to investigate discussion forums like this that give you a much truer picture of the 'real' Canada.

I'm an IT Project Manager with an Honours degree in Computing Science. We live in the UK and the reason we want to move is for a higher quality of life. Now money is not everything but without it life is pretty shit. Also, your job is a very big part of your self-respect and without putting down anyone else, I didn't study for 4 years for my degree and work my way up the ranks for 14 years in IT just to start flipping burgers or emptying rubbish at the age of 35.

This 'My Grandparents had to work hard as immigrants, why can't you?' attitude is a load of nonsense. This is the 21st century ! As a British citixen, I can work in Germany with little or no barriers put in my way. Now, 60 year ago, we were at each other's throats but thing's have moved on for the better and Europeans now understand that we're stronger together. Sadly, the North American continent doesn't seem to see this and Canada seems to have a definite underlying 'Canadians first' attitude which probably show itself more obviously to non-white people but still applies to all immigrants.

We've now decided that we're not going to go to Canada and without sounding arrogant, Canada has lost 2 intelligent had-working people who would have contributed greatly to their society. I'm sure that Canada is suffering from the same brain-drain as most other countries so without attracting good quaility immigrants, Canada will end up as a giant McDonalds full of burger-flippers.

So all I want to say to Candians is to drop the protectionist job policies and start accepting that we are all citizens of the world and that the best person should get the job, not the most Canadian.

Anyway, D'you want fries with that burger ?

levu

ian,

the world may have changed but something never change and one of those things is that bettering yourself requires hard work.

You studied and worked for years to get where you are today...and going to Canada might make your life even better still....but like getting to where you are, going further is going to need even more work. You can't expect just to fill out a few forms, jump on a plane and the next thing you know you have double the disposable income and are surrounded by unparalled natural beauty - life just doesn't work like that, 21st century or not - nobody has a 'right' to anything, everything must be earned.

As for your idea that Canada is "Canadian first" while here in Europe we are so must smarter and more worldly aware is bullshit. Canada accepts more immigrants every year than all the other countries in the world put together. No european nation comes close in terms of openness.

If a 1/2million Germans were coming into the UK (proportionately the same as what Canada takes) every year and taking British jobs while 7% of the British population were unemployed, then you'd soon see some protectionism.....the only reason the EU appears to be "open" is because despite open laws, language barriers have largely stifled any possible worker movements around the union.

Personally I'm amazed that so many immigrants do find work - the rate they are arriving is simply enormous. The UK government thinks its wonderful if the economy churns out anymore than 200 00 new jobs in a year, well Canada, with 1/2 the population manages to create about 300 000 new jobs every year....absorbing all those immigrants and cutting the national unemployment rate at the same time. Its a spectacular success. The UK would need to create almost 1million jobs a year to match it.

So yes, Immigrating to Canada is tough, and its right that you have assessed whether you are prepared to accept that challenge with a fully informed view of the scale of the undertaking. It seems you have decided that life in the UK is not all that bad enough to warrant the work involved in going to Canada.

I should warn you however, that my parents came to the same conclusion back in 1987 and they've been regretting it ever since.

I've since decided to try to finish what they started, and am hopefully going to immigrate next year. I'm also worried about the challenges involved in finding work....but if I don't at least try, I'll regret it the rest of my life.

CN Tower

ian...
have you seriously changed your mind after all that effort, because of what you have read in a newsgroup? I am emigrating from the UK too so I know of the 'shit' you refer to. I'm not denying there is much posting of desperate and depressing circumstances in this group and I can acknowledge how difficult it is and has been for some people. I also don't think I am naively leaping into the unknown, assuming all will be well, because it might not - but I don't know. And that's what struck a chord with your post: no-one is you, therefore no-one can know what would happen for you in Canada.

The people who are settling in with no trouble and are busy making a new life for themselves have little need to visit
misc.immigration.canada and post what success they have had because they have moved on. No news is good news, if you like.

I don't mean to sound judgemental; I just felt quite sad that you had given up on Canada when it is very likely that there are positive stories out there that haven't been told.

If you were interested, at the address below is a Yahoo Group of Brits: some that are already in Canada, others that are going through the process. It is a very supportive and knowledgeable environment.

Unless you had already started the application for Oz, that is

Good luck, wherever you end up,

Claire

chawra

Ian,

How about taking a vacation of couple of weeks to CANADA and then decide , want to migrate or not ?????

Rus

I wish I was smart enough to read something like this two years ago.... Oh well...
Life is full of surprises.....

Think twice before you cut your own umbilical

"iancurtis" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > Hi,
    >
    > My wife and I applied for Visas last October and up 'till now we were really
    > disappointed that we'd heard nothing. Now I think the delay has been a blessing in
    > disguise as it's allowed me time to investigate discussion forums like this that
    > give you a much truer picture of the 'real' Canada.
    >
    > I'm an IT Project Manager with an Honours degree in Computing Science. We live in
    > the UK and the reason we want to move is for a higher quality of life. Now money is
    > not everything but without it life is pretty shit. Also, your job is a very big
    > part of your self-respect and without putting down anyone else, I didn't study for
    > 4 years for my degree and work my way up the ranks for 14 years in IT just to start
    > flipping burgers or emptying rubbish at the age of 35.
    >
    > This 'My Grandparents had to work hard as immigrants, why can't you?' attitude is a
    > load of nonsense. This is the 21st century ! As a British citixen, I can work in
    > Germany with little or no barriers put in my way. Now, 60 year ago, we were at each
    > other's throats but thing's have moved on for the better and Europeans now
    > understand that we're stronger together. Sadly, the North American continent
    > doesn't seem to see this and Canada seems to have a definite underlying 'Canadians
    > first' attitude which probably show itself more obviously to non-white people but
    > still applies to all immigrants.
    >
    > We've now decided that we're not going to go to Canada and without sounding
    > arrogant, Canada has lost 2 intelligent had-working people who would have
    > contributed greatly to their society. I'm sure that Canada is suffering from the
    > same brain-drain as most other countries so without attracting good quaility
    > immigrants, Canada will end up as a giant McDonalds full of burger-flippers.
    >
    > So all I want to say to Candians is to drop the protectionist job policies and
    > start accepting that we are all citizens of the world and that the best person
    > should get the job, not the most Canadian.
    >
    > Anyway, D'you want fries with that burger ?
    >
    >
    >
    > --
    >
    >
    > Posted via http://britishexpats.com

iancurtis

Actually, we have started to look at Oz and its seems much more promising both in terms of employment and in the initial advantage of a good exchange rate for our sterling.

We did visit Vancouver last year and we loved it. It was fresh and clean with stunning scenery and the people were warm & friendly. We'd love to live there but we're not willing to put up with poverty and degredation just for the privilege.