louisehilton

I've lived in Ontario for about 15 years. Now I want to return to the UK for about 5 years, to do some traveling. I'll be leaving a lot of my stuff here in Ontario, at my son's place, and I'll be returning to live with him after about 5 years. I've bought a small flat in England, and have taken things like some clothes there, but bought most things like a bit of furniture, pots and pans etc. in England.

I'd originally thought it was just a matter of figuring out where I spend most of the time, but I now know it's much more complicated than that!

I've filled out a 'determination of residency' form to determine my residency in Canada, and I suspect they'll say I'm still a Canadian resident for tax purposes, as I have so many ties to Canada, and I'll even be spending about 4 months a year in Canada on vacation to visit my grandkids and great nephews.

1) IF Canada decides that I'm still a resident for tax purposes, does that mean I'll still be able to get GST rebates, etc.
2) How do I determine my residency in Ontario? I can't find anything on the Ontario website, but the federal form specifically asks if I'm still considered a resident of the province. If I'm a resident of Canada / Ontario for tax purposes, will I still be covered by OHIP?
3) If I'm a Canadian resident for taxes, how does that affect my British taxes? It sounds like I may be a resident of both countries for taxes. One of the things I was hoping was that when I was living back in the UK for a few years I'd be able to get my pension updated instead of being frozen at the rate when I originally left the UK.
4) If I still have to pay taxes in Canada, even if *I* don't consider it my primary residence for the next few years, can I still claim exemption from paying tax to the UK on my British pension?

I'm confused!

christmasoompa

Hi, welcome to BE.

I can't see how you'd be considered tax resident in Ontario personally, if you're only spending 4 months a year there, and your only address is in the UK. That would just make you a visitor to Canada. And the UK will consider you tax resident there from what you've said, and you won't be tax resident in both places.

But either way you won't qualify for OHIP, as you have to spend 153 days out of every year in Canada to keep it, and to make Ontario your primary residence.

And lastly, just to check you have Canadian citizenship? So can come and go freely between the two countries?

Good luck with the move.

Johnboyuk

Generally, if you are in the UK for 183 days or more, they will consider you a tax resident. Just to add to the confusion, have a look at this.

https://www.gov.uk/government/public...-test-srt-rdr3

Johnboyuk

Then have a look at this. Also, you must be 'ordinarily resident' in UK to access the NHS. Best to take professional advice on this as it can get complicated if you keep a foot in both camps. I would guess in your situation that you would be better being a UK resident and a visitor when you come to Canada (with health care insurance).

https://www.canada.ca/en/revenue-age...cy-status.html


https://www.nhs.uk/nhs-services/visi...g-from-abroad/

Kingsboy48

louisehilton
If I'm a Canadian resident for taxes, how does that affect my British taxes? It sounds like I may be a resident of both countries for taxes. One of the things I was hoping was that when I was living back in the UK for a few years I'd be able to get my pension updated instead of being frozen at the rate when I originally left the UK.

Hope you can figure it out and let us know how it goes! I am considering returning to the UK 'permanently' to get my pension updated then return to Alberta. I believe to be considered to be back permanently you need only spend six months and a day back in the UK.

christmasoompa

Do check that it won't revert to the previous level when you return to Canada - I'm sure I read recently on here that it does.

Johnboyuk

Taxation is based on residency, so if you are in the UK for six months plus 1 day, that will be your tax residency and you will not have tax residency in Canada and vice versa. That is within a tax year but be careful because the tax years in Canada and the UK are not the same. You will not be taxed twice as there is a reciprocal tax agreement between the UK and Canada with a few exceptions such as the cash received from property rental.

You will have to apply to the DWP to get your pension updated. It will not happen automatically.

https://www.ageuk.org.uk/information...broad-heading/

It can be complicated so if you have any doubts, I would recommend you take professional advice. It is well worth the money.

JonboyE

Six months plus a day is national law. The tax treaty is superior to national law. It sets the tie breaker rules in article 4.

Completely agree. "Free advice is worth every penny you pay for it"

Johnboyuk

For anyone wanting to return to the UK to have their state pension unfrozen, they will have to demonstrate that they are here to stay or it could be frozen again upon leaving. Plenty of grey areas here and inequities. You could move to the USA and get your pension unfrozen.

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/...-visit-UK.html

Johnboyuk

The problem is, tax and immigration issues are complicated and it is possible to step outside of the law and actually make a criminal offence without realising it. I remember in the UK, at one time, we used to scoff at the Americans and their obsession with lawyers and litigation but we have now caught up. I ran a corporation in the UK for 15 years and relied entirely on my accountant to keep me on the straight and narrow and allow me to sleep at night. It was all money well spent what I paid him. I used to write the payment cheque to him with a smile on my face because I knew I was paying him to take a certain amount of the responsibility. There are numerous cases in the UK about people being made personally bankrupt by not adhering to the over-complicated rules when they receive that tax bill from HMRC.

Public forums are good for exchanging opinions but should never be treated as the gospel for tax and immigration issues. Every case is different. Amen.

Kingsboy48

Interesting that time spent aboard a British registered ship also gives you an uprated pension. I wonder how a 'ship' is defined and does it have to be at sea? Maybe we pensioners could each buy a small boat, register it in Torquay or similar but keep it in our backyards and 'live aboard', and get our uprated pensions, haha.

Johnboyuk

This is how I understand it. If your pension is frozen, it will revert to the unfrozen rate when you return to the UK and for the duration of your stay in the UK. However, once you leave the UK again, it will revert back to the original frozen rate. This is obviously done to stop people working around the system. Otherwise, the UK would be flooded with retirees from around the World. The triple-lock increases over the past few years would have made it worthwhile.

christmasoompa

I agree that a public forum shouldn't be relied on definitively but we are lucky enough to have several professionals that give their time on BE which gives people a starting point at least. JonboyE is an accountant and well versed in tax issues - lots of members have used his services over the years.

randomusername

There are many errors in the posts above. You can certainly be a tax resident of Canada if you are in the UK and a tax resident there. For example, if you live and work in the UK but have a spouse and children in Canada, Canada usually treats you as a resident for the purpose of taxes. I'd suggest carefully consulting the CRA pages or a tax professional.

christmasoompa

The posts above are specific to the OP. From what she's said, she would be would be working and living in the UK, no spouse or dependents in Canada, and the only home she'd have would be in the UK too.

She also says she's already done a tax residency assessment with the CRA.