Dependent child citizenship?

Old Aug 24th 2016, 8:07 pm
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Default Dependent child citizenship?

Hi all,

I have a daughter in the U.K she will be 17 years old in January.

We received our PR January 2015 , she too received the letter of acceptance after taking her medical, but she hasn't activated as she is content in England currently. I am under the impression therefor Her Permanent Residency expires January 2020 and she is unable to renew unless she moves out by December 2017 and lives here for 24 months.

My Question is:

If we apply for citizenship, where does this leave her? Does she too become a Citizen because of her age , does she loose her PR?

Can't seem to find the answers online.

Thanks.
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Old Aug 24th 2016, 8:42 pm
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Default Re: Dependent child citizenship?

Never mind. I thought we had to of been here for 2 years as a PR to apply, looks like its 1365 days. Sorry not sure I can delete the thread.
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Old Aug 24th 2016, 9:15 pm
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Default Re: Dependent child citizenship?

Originally Posted by convoy104
Hi all,

I have a daughter in the U.K she will be 17 years old in January.

We received our PR January 2015 , she too received the letter of acceptance after taking her medical, but she hasn't activated as she is content in England currently. I am under the impression therefor Her Permanent Residency expires January 2020 and she is unable to renew unless she moves out by December 2017 and lives here for 24 months.

My Question is:

If we apply for citizenship, where does this leave her? Does she too become a Citizen because of her age , does she loose her PR?

Can't seem to find the answers online.

Thanks.
Actually if she never landed and activated her PR status then she is in non compliance with the Act and to have PR conferred you have to actually land so therefore the COPR form issued has expired. In other words she isn't a PR.
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Old Aug 24th 2016, 9:59 pm
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Default Re: Dependent child citizenship?

Originally Posted by Former Lancastrian
Actually if she never landed and activated her PR status then she is in non compliance with the Act and to have PR conferred you have to actually land so therefore the COPR form issued has expired. In other words she isn't a PR.
Oh really, so any Dependent has only 6 months to move?

so she is unable to renew at all?
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Old Aug 24th 2016, 10:19 pm
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Default Re: Dependent child citizenship?

Any person with a COPR has until the date stated on it to 'land' and activate their PR. Once activated, they can return to the UK (or wherever) until such time that they wish to move to Canada - with the provisio that they need to reside in Canada for 2 years out of every 5.

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/helpcen...num=797&top=10
http://britishexpats.com/wiki/Landing_as_PR-Canada

If she didn't activate her PR by landing before it expired, then it will be null and void.

You would need to apply to sponsor her, I believe - perhaps others can confirm.

Last edited by Siouxie; Aug 24th 2016 at 10:26 pm.
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Old Aug 24th 2016, 10:22 pm
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Default Re: Dependent child citizenship?

Originally Posted by Siouxie
Any person with a COPR has until the date stated on it to 'land' and activate their PR. Once activated, they can return to the UK (or wherever) until such time that they wish to move to Canada - with the provisio that they need to reside in Canada for 2 years out of every 5.

If she didn't activate her PR by landing before it expired, then it will be null and void.

You would need to apply to sponsor her, I believe - perhaps others can confirm.
wow I was told once she has it she has until 2020. But if she doesn't move before the letter expiry she will need to re take another medical exam...
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Old Aug 24th 2016, 10:24 pm
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Default Re: Dependent child citizenship?

Originally Posted by convoy104
Oh really, so any Dependent has only 6 months to move?

so she is unable to renew at all?
COPR forms are usually issued for 12 months from the result of the medical exam results UNLESS the passport submitted with the application expires within that 12 months. Once COPR has been issued it must be activated within the validity date.
There is no requirement to actually stay in Canada on landing but they must travel to Canada to activate it. Many just stay for a day then return home and spend up to 3 yrs back home before they actually move to Canada bearing in mind they must spend 730 days in Canada in every 5 year rolling period.

Taken from the CIC Manual as there could be a case for H & C grounds but a lawyer would need to be retained if challenging the loss of PR or other factors.

Under the former Immigration Act, if a child under 18 years of age left Canada with their parents and, after becoming an adult, sought to re-enter Canada as a permanent resident, jurisprudence dictated that the person could not have formed the intent to abandon Canada as a child and therefore retained permanent resident status.

In IRPA, intent to abandon is no longer the test for retaining permanent resident status. Therefore, the inability to form “intent” no longer results in automatic retention of permanent resident status. The new test requires that humanitarian and compassionate considerations be taken into account. Although the reasons for leaving and remaining outside Canada may be considerations, the fact that a minor did not have the intention to abandon Canada or left as a dependent is not determinative.

In your case the child never landed but there might be a case or argument that the child was not aware of the implications by not landing especially if all of the family reside in Canada.
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Old Aug 24th 2016, 10:29 pm
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Default Re: Dependent child citizenship?

Originally Posted by Former Lancastrian
COPR forms are usually issued for 12 months from the result of the medical exam results UNLESS the passport submitted with the application expires within that 12 months. Once COPR has been issued it must be activated within the validity date.
There is no requirement to actually stay in Canada on landing but they must travel to Canada to activate it. Many just stay for a day then return home and spend up to 3 yrs back home before they actually move to Canada bearing in mind they must spend 730 days in Canada in every 5 year rolling period.

Taken from the CIC Manual as there could be a case for H & C grounds but a lawyer would need to be retained if challenging the loss of PR or other factors.

Under the former Immigration Act, if a child under 18 years of age left Canada with their parents and, after becoming an adult, sought to re-enter Canada as a permanent resident, jurisprudence dictated that the person could not have formed the intent to abandon Canada as a child and therefore retained permanent resident status.

In IRPA, intent to abandon is no longer the test for retaining permanent resident status. Therefore, the inability to form “intent” no longer results in automatic retention of permanent resident status. The new test requires that humanitarian and compassionate considerations be taken into account. Although the reasons for leaving and remaining outside Canada may be considerations, the fact that a minor did not have the intention to abandon Canada or left as a dependent is not determinative.

In your case the child never landed but there might be a case or argument that the child was not aware of the implications by not landing especially if all of the family reside in Canada.
This is devastating we had no idea. We were told she had until 2020 (dec 2017 to renew) but would need to re take the medical if she wasn't readywhen the first document was issued.

I guess I should email CIC first and see if theres anything they can do.

Thank you
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Old Aug 24th 2016, 10:34 pm
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Default Re: Dependent child citizenship?

She would have had it until 2020, but it doesn't sound like she's ever actually got her PR? As she hasn't landed, and that's when the final checks are done and she is then given PR - not before.

So there's nothing to renew, because she never got PR status, as she didn't complete the process.
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Old Aug 24th 2016, 10:40 pm
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Default Re: Dependent child citizenship?

Originally Posted by christmasoompa
She would have had it until 2020, but it doesn't sound like she's ever actually got her PR? As she hasn't landed, and that's when the final checks are done and she is then given PR - not before.

So there's nothing to renew, because she never got PR status, as she didn't complete the process.
No she never landed after the fact. She came out in February for a visit and the PR was issued in June.

god I feel awful. She's planning to come out, just wanted to finish her gcse's first
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Old Aug 24th 2016, 10:51 pm
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Default Re: Dependent child citizenship?

Originally Posted by convoy104
This is devastating we had no idea. We were told she had until 2020 (dec 2017 to renew) but would need to re take the medical if she wasn't readywhen the first document was issued.

I guess I should email CIC first and see if theres anything they can do.

Thank you
You can always apply to sponsor them. CIC would see that she was declared a member of the family class on the initial application. It should be straight forward bar getting a new Police Certificate and having another Medical if you get a reviewing officer who uses common sense seeing that she had previously been accepted and issued a COPR.

Determine your eligibility – Sponsor your spouse, partner or children

If doing an outland application she could not work or study until she got PR status i.e. actually landed in Canada so bear in mind the difference between outland and inland applications which can be found on the wiki button.
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Old Aug 24th 2016, 10:53 pm
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Default Re: Dependent child citizenship?

Originally Posted by convoy104
No she never landed after the fact. She came out in February for a visit and the PR was issued in June.

god I feel awful. She's planning to come out, just wanted to finish her gcse's first
This is why we prefer people ask before doing or relying on someone told me.
I have seen too many doing then asking and then finding out they had done it wrong and now face consequences. Unfortunately people only find out about this site after doing something.
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Old Aug 24th 2016, 10:54 pm
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Default Re: Dependent child citizenship?

Originally Posted by convoy104
No she never landed after the fact. She came out in February for a visit and the PR was issued in June.

god I feel awful. She's planning to come out, just wanted to finish her gcse's first
Which June? It's not clear when you're talking about.

Not sure who is 'advising' you, but ignore them completely in the future as they've given you some truly atrocious advice! Only use official sources, the COPR will have told you the date she had to 'land' by, but you can always check things on the CIC website if in doubt.

But don't beat yourself up about it now, no point crying over spilt milk as my mother would say! Unfortunately now you'll have to apply to sponsor her (assuming she still meets the definition of a dependent child), but at least you've got time to do that before she's no longer classed as a dependent child.

Good luck.
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Old Aug 24th 2016, 11:56 pm
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Default Re: Dependent child citizenship?

I agree with Christmas. Your timeline isn't quite clear.

When (date) were you issued your landing documents (which would have had an expiry date on them by when you had to arrive in Canada)?

Which of you went to Canada and landed? (who became Permanent Residents?). All three of you/husband? Or only you? And on what date?

Who has Permanent Resident Cards? All 3 of you or you and your husband but not your daughter?

Who "told" you these things? (about 2020 etc.).

Depending on your answers which I suspect we all know but want confirmation of, Christmas is (of course) right. There is a fix, it's a bit of a hassle, you have time (but you'll have to move quickly).

S

PS: Applying for Citizenship requires 1460 days physical presence currently (although is likely to be changed to require less days from sometime next year).

Last edited by Snowy560; Aug 25th 2016 at 12:03 am.
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