Deadline today for 1000s of temp. foreign workers
Apr 2nd 2015, 2:53 pm
#46
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Re: Deadline today for 1000s of temp. foreign workers
A general point, not aimed at anyone...Umm isn't everyone in Canada (except first nations, and some of those only came here in the 1900's fleeing the Americans) originally an immigrant, the driving force that brought your fore-fathers here is all that is driving people today...in search of a better life, be that financial, emotional or educational...if the current public trend of sticking the boot into people wanting to chase a better life was prevalent then, you may not exist as your ancestors died in wars/plagues/returned to religious persecution etc.
I'll never condemn those that paid taxes, with no rights (to vote, EI, etc) for years, who took jobs, that at that time, most Canadians deemed below them or brought skills in demand (just as your fore-fathers did), and it was all fine and dandy to have this under-class, now it's suddenly not acceptable...fine, those people will I'm sure, go home (they have no choice) and those jobs will be filled by hundreds of Canadians who will happily work in these less than desirable jobs rather than milk the system for welfare/EI/workers comp and increase your taxes, which of course they can do, but those temporary workers had to work (as they had no government help) or they couldn't eat/pay rent etc, and as those temporary workers taxes went into the pot with no claim against them they actually helped to lower taxes...hmm you can see the problem.
I follow the philosophy of "there go i but for the grace of god"
I actually find this, almost UK Independence party attitude towards immigrants on a forum supposed to be for British Ex-pats, all of whom allegedly have known the anguish and trauma of trying to build a new life for themselves, just as you have done, rather disturbing..almost a "I'm all right jack, so you shouldn't get the same chances I (or my fore-fathers) did".
I'm not looking for an argument, it just strikes me in a country built on immigration, and on an Ex-pat forum of immigrants to see some aspects of this thread...disturbing.
I'll never condemn those that paid taxes, with no rights (to vote, EI, etc) for years, who took jobs, that at that time, most Canadians deemed below them or brought skills in demand (just as your fore-fathers did), and it was all fine and dandy to have this under-class, now it's suddenly not acceptable...fine, those people will I'm sure, go home (they have no choice) and those jobs will be filled by hundreds of Canadians who will happily work in these less than desirable jobs rather than milk the system for welfare/EI/workers comp and increase your taxes, which of course they can do, but those temporary workers had to work (as they had no government help) or they couldn't eat/pay rent etc, and as those temporary workers taxes went into the pot with no claim against them they actually helped to lower taxes...hmm you can see the problem.
I follow the philosophy of "there go i but for the grace of god"
I actually find this, almost UK Independence party attitude towards immigrants on a forum supposed to be for British Ex-pats, all of whom allegedly have known the anguish and trauma of trying to build a new life for themselves, just as you have done, rather disturbing..almost a "I'm all right jack, so you shouldn't get the same chances I (or my fore-fathers) did".
I'm not looking for an argument, it just strikes me in a country built on immigration, and on an Ex-pat forum of immigrants to see some aspects of this thread...disturbing.
Apr 2nd 2015, 3:14 pm
#47
Forum Regular
Joined: Oct 2008
Location: Toronto
Posts: 201
Re: Deadline today for 1000s of temp. foreign workers
By the sounds of this article, the IEC and similar visas are going to be next....
Ottawa to limit number of foreign youth working in Canada - The Globe and Mail
Ottawa to limit number of foreign youth working in Canada - The Globe and Mail
Apr 2nd 2015, 3:20 pm
#48
slanderer of the innocent
Joined: Dec 2008
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 6,695
Re: Deadline today for 1000s of temp. foreign workers
"Ottawa has reciprocal agreements with 32 countries, but is concerned that Canada accepts far more young workers each year than the number of young Canadians accepted by partner countries"
fair enough.
fair enough.
Apr 2nd 2015, 3:22 pm
#49
slanderer of the innocent
Joined: Dec 2008
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 6,695
Re: Deadline today for 1000s of temp. foreign workers
However, The Globe reported this week that the Citizenship and Immigration department flagged research that concluded the acceptance of foreign youth through such working holiday programs does hurt local youth unemployment.
interesting.....
interesting.....
Apr 2nd 2015, 3:22 pm
#50
Binned by Muderators
Joined: Jul 2007
Location: White Rock BC
Posts: 11,682
Re: Deadline today for 1000s of temp. foreign workers
...I actually find this, almost UK Independence party attitude towards immigrants on a forum supposed to be for British Ex-pats, all of whom allegedly have known the anguish and trauma of trying to build a new life for themselves, just as you have done, rather disturbing..almost a "I'm all right jack, so you shouldn't get the same chances I (or my fore-fathers) did"...
1) You can take the person out of Britain ...
2) And they say that Canadians have no sense of irony
3) We're British, we are not really immigrants like all those furriners.
Apr 2nd 2015, 3:41 pm
#51
slanderer of the innocent
Joined: Dec 2008
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 6,695
Re: Deadline today for 1000s of temp. foreign workers
the point is there are limited resources and arguably a nation state has the right to restrict those resources to the citizens/permanent residents that are part of that state.
Apr 2nd 2015, 3:58 pm
#52
Bex in the city
Joined: Jun 2013
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 3,899
Re: Deadline today for 1000s of temp. foreign workers
I think Citizens should still get priority over PR!
Apr 2nd 2015, 4:02 pm
#53
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Joined: Aug 2014
Location: Edmonton AB
Posts: 685
Re: Deadline today for 1000s of temp. foreign workers
so ................
does the Canadian government have any right to govern who enters the country, and how they enter?
It almost sounds as if some of you do not believe that.
If that is the case .............. then we could end up in a similar situation to the UK who do not seem able to govern who enters the country from Europe.
sympathy for the workers ................ yes
Grandfathering .............. I don't think.
If they kept renewing their TEMPORARY visas, they still knew they could have to leave at some point. So they should have been making attempts to change to permanent status
does the Canadian government have any right to govern who enters the country, and how they enter?
It almost sounds as if some of you do not believe that.
If that is the case .............. then we could end up in a similar situation to the UK who do not seem able to govern who enters the country from Europe.
sympathy for the workers ................ yes
Grandfathering .............. I don't think.
If they kept renewing their TEMPORARY visas, they still knew they could have to leave at some point. So they should have been making attempts to change to permanent status
I too feel for them but grandfathering people into Canada risks having a future situation like the UK. Canada needs to keep a tight grip on Immigration, What i'm not sure is did someone somewhere in the process of bringing unskilled workers in tell them they WOULD get residency ????
Depending on your trade etc we all knew we where at least eligible to stay, i for one would not have come to Canada if i didn't have the option to stay for good, coming here to work for a couple of years wouldn't have interested me at all.
Apr 2nd 2015, 4:09 pm
#54
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Re: Deadline today for 1000s of temp. foreign workers
lets face it the system needs overhauling.
Temporary work permits are just that , temporary.
They allow companies to temporarily plug gaps in their workforce and allow flexibility to people who don't actually want to live here permanently.
As far as I can tell this is being abused on both sides
companies are keeping people here on TWP after TWP which isn't at all beneficial for the worker
and workers are using the TWP as a path to PR.
The system needs overhauling to stop workers being abused by keeping them on endless TWPs and offer companies with legitimate needs and shortages the means to employ people on a permanent basis in a timely fashion.
Temporary work permits are just that , temporary.
They allow companies to temporarily plug gaps in their workforce and allow flexibility to people who don't actually want to live here permanently.
As far as I can tell this is being abused on both sides
companies are keeping people here on TWP after TWP which isn't at all beneficial for the worker
and workers are using the TWP as a path to PR.
The system needs overhauling to stop workers being abused by keeping them on endless TWPs and offer companies with legitimate needs and shortages the means to employ people on a permanent basis in a timely fashion.
Apr 2nd 2015, 4:46 pm
#55
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Re: Deadline today for 1000s of temp. foreign workers
Apr 2nd 2015, 5:00 pm
#56
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Re: Deadline today for 1000s of temp. foreign workers
That's exactly what my friends in America with green cards did; they got a temporary work permit and then applied for the green card, which took even longer than Canadian PR.
Apr 2nd 2015, 5:13 pm
#57
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Re: Deadline today for 1000s of temp. foreign workers
if its what the worker wants then fine but its massively open to abuse, and the lowest paid are the most vulnerable.
Apr 2nd 2015, 5:17 pm
#58
Born again atheist
Joined: Jul 2005
Location: Europe (to be specified).
Posts: 30,259
Re: Deadline today for 1000s of temp. foreign workers
Prior to Kenny's meddling, a TFW was defined as a seasonal worker predominantly in the agriculture sector. Temporary Work Permit holders were a different category who had the skills to do needed jobs in all sectors, jobs for which qualified or willing Canadians had not been found after due diligence.
Kenny lumped them together and, in his original proposal, would have allowed employers to pay the newly defined TFWs up to 15% less than the going wage for the job and region. This latter part was scrapped after heated objections from Canadian workers.
The abuse came about intentionally as employers laid off Canadians and hired TFW often forcing them to live in accommodation owned by the employer thus stealing a large part of their measly wages as bloated compulsory rent. There were other abuses as have already been mentioned.
The blame for all this lies not primarily with the employers but with our glorious government who designed the program this way with intent.
Throw in the added difficulties of converting from TFW to PR, the introduction of an arbitrary 4 year maximum stay as a TFW, the yet to be proven "Express" Entry system and the gutting of funding to the public sector since 2010 as well,and, hey presto, you have total chaos caused intentionally and entirely by Harpers band of incompetents.
Good luck for the future Canada, you're going to need it.
Last edited by Novocastrian; Apr 2nd 2015 at 5:21 pm.
Apr 2nd 2015, 6:24 pm
#59
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 12,830
Re: Deadline today for 1000s of temp. foreign workers
The abuse came about intentionally as employers laid off Canadians and hired TFW often forcing them to live in accommodation owned by the employer thus stealing a large part of their measly wages as bloated compulsory rent. There were other abuses as have already been mentioned.
Mexico accused of blacklisting seasonal workers who unionize in Canada | rabble.ca
Apr 2nd 2015, 6:52 pm
#60
Born again atheist
Joined: Jul 2005
Location: Europe (to be specified).
Posts: 30,259
Re: Deadline today for 1000s of temp. foreign workers
Don't know about other TFW, but under SAWP, the employer has to pay for flights both way, provide accommodation and pay at least minimum wage. Equates all in to about $16 an hour. SAWP TFW are now unionising to get more, so quite possibly we'll see the end of the SAWP soon as employers go back to local labour.
Mexico accused of blacklisting seasonal workers who unionize in Canada | rabble.ca
Mexico accused of blacklisting seasonal workers who unionize in Canada | rabble.ca
http://www.socialistproject.ca/relay/r12_grez.pdf
Anyway, these poor folk have always been royally screwed over. The thread is about what used to be TWP folk.