Express Entry - Process Diary
May 17th 2018, 11:01 pm
#1
Forum Regular
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 2017
Location: Burlington, ON
Posts: 158
Express Entry - Process Diary
I got the idea of doing this from the thread Glendems has made on here, however this one is going to be more based on the application process leading to moving, rather than the move itself. So this thread will ultimately come to an end once we collect our PR cards at the end of it all. I wanted to consolidate some of the info I have learnt on here as well, the processes involved and some of the hurdles you may face and how we overcame them. Hopefully, if anything, this will help provide some insight and perhaps answers any general questions about the process and what you might expect.
I'll provide some minor background first. My partner has a masters degree in Environmental Geology and is 29. I have nothing, and am now 30. She was therefore the PA (primary applicant) here, and I am included under common law partner since we aren't married. She has almost 5 years working experience in her field here in the UK. Initially, our CRS score was too low for us to be considered, however we soon realised after a brief chat with Brazalot that we could achieve 471 if we obtained a CBL score of 9+. As nice as Brazalot were, they are far too expensive. We were quoted over £4000 for them to handle our case. Like many have said on this forum already, if you don't have a complex case, then you really don't need to use a consultant. Complex is normally defined by having medical conditions that are costly to treat, or you have a criminal history.
So, the initial hurdle before we even started our application was IELTS:
IELTS: IELTS is not a typical English test, so don't go in there thinking you'll ace it if you haven't done any prep. I highly recommend people do pre-test assessments and practise as much as you can. The hardest part for us, was the listening aspect. The tests are riddled with trick questions and ambiguous answers. My partner had to take the test twice before we achieved the CBL 9's that we required to take our points from around the 400 mark, to 471. To achieve a CBL of 9, you must achieve an 8 in listening, and 7 in the remainder. These basically allow you 4 mistakes in the reading and listening, whereas the writing and speaking is down to the examiner.
I cannot underestimate how important scoring highly on these is. The tests are not cheap at £160 per person, each time. To further maximise points related to IELTS, you need 3+ years’ experience in your trade. If you have a disability, for example Dyslexia, you need a clinical report that is (if I recall correctly) under 2 years old as evidence before they will offer any kind of assistance or extra time. These costs approx £500 to do privately. According to the NHS website, you cannot get assessed for adult dyslexia through them.
Verify your education certificates
My partner used WES for her education certificate verification. Her University were quite handy in the sense they sent across both transcripts for the bachelors degree and the masters degree without charging double. They sent these directly to WES. The turnaround at the University was approx 2 weeks, WES then took around 25 days to complete the verification and a further week for it to arrive in the post back to us. So overall a little over a month. It was not necessary to verify A levels since these were not relevant in our case and wouldn't have provided any extra points, just further hassle.
The application
Initially our application was refused as we put our proof of funds amount lower than required. We based the amount on the requirements displayed during the application, whereas these were incorrect at the time, instead, you must go by what is shown HERE on the main site. Once we received the ITA (invitation to apply), you then have a lot more document finding, form filling and general stress inducing tasks to fulfil.
The main ones that I found to be troublesome were:
Proof of Funds:
We did our proof of funds last so the statements would be only a few days old. We were unable to find on the CIC website how old these could be, and whether they allowed you the full 90 days as leeway. For example, if you got the POF documents within the first week, would they still accept those if you applied 90 days later still, since they are then 3 months old.
Getting the statements should have been a relatively simple task, her accounts are with one bank (Nationwide), and, aside from the average balances, everything asked for by IRCC is pretty straightforward. Not for Nationwide though!. I don't know if the branch we used were entirely full of jobsworths and just couldn't be bothered to spend 15 minutes printing some pages and writing a very simple letter, or whether they genuinely were unable to do it. On our first trip, they referred the stuff needed to their head office, who didn't respond at all. They requested an interim statement and that arrived a week later, which wasn't much help.
On the second trip, we pre-arranged a time to speak with the manager of the branch. She was slightly more helpful, but was also present on the original visit where they said they couldn't do anything. Magically, on this occasion, she was able to do what we needed. The next problem arose from the fact we have a Credit Card with Nationwide. We were told in branch, they cannot see or access anything on the credit card. The account had a zero balance on it for 3 months prior, so no statements were generated either, making proving no debt on it next to impossible. We closed the credit card account when we got back home and rescheduled another visit to the bank to have the letter they wrote amended so there was no mention of the credit card. They refused to address the letter to Canada Immigration as well.
Overall, something that should have been done in 1 trip, took 3 trips and some very reluctant workers doing the jobs they are paid to do.
In addition to this, my parents donated a fair portion of the required funds. We assumed that IRCC would find this suspicious so we preemptively had my parents write, and sign, a document stating the amount, the date, and the fact it was a gift, waiving any rights to the money and confirming it is ours to do as we see fit. We included this in the POF section at the top.
Proof of Common Law
This one was quite difficult to prove. We have lived together for almost 5 years, renting and mortgage together. However, in the last year, we moved in with my grandmother so I could provide care for her, and so we could actually save money instead of breaking even each month. On that basis, we have no real evidence of our relationship over the last year. We had our declaration form, and included with it the evidence of mortgage, rent etc, and house sale. Further on from that, we obtained written statements from my parents confirming the situation, and a letter from our GP who confirmed the relationship as well. This was on top of copies of pet insurance documents showing both names, and our cats registration certificates showing both names and the same address. We hope these will be sufficient, aside from getting married there is very little else we can do to prove our relationship at this point. The main point I want to make with this one is this: If you are able to question anything, or have gaps in the paperwork you supply, then you'll need to find something, or someone, who will clarify and confirm on your behalf.
Family History
If your family history is complex, for example, you have half brothers/sisters who you have no communication with and never have done, then this section can prove somewhat tough. We managed to get most of the information from birth records knowing the surnames at the time and a rough year of birth. I won't go into too much detail here, but on my partners side, reaching out to family members was not a possibility, which made finding out certain information quite difficult. Ultimately, nearly everything can be found via registry checks for birth, marriage and death.
Job References
These are relatively straight forward to do, however with your current employer, i'd recommend saying the reference is for banks. Say it is for a mortgage perhaps. More easy to do if you recently started a job and have been there under 3 months since most banks will ask for references if you apply for a mortgage and haven't been in employment at that place for long. I highly doubt starting a new job and then asking for a Visa reference would go down well. Some managers/HR people don't like to spend the time doing the reference so you may have to be a little... persistent, to get things moving along. Also, it is crucial that they include details of your job role. One of hers initially just wrote 'do jobs as required by company', which really wasn't helpful and does not show an immigration agent you have done the job as listed on the NOC code you have specified.
Multiple names
A lot of people have middle names you can spell differently, or were given 2 middle names at birth but have since dropped it and only use one on the passport. More confusing if you've done both, as in our case. Our application was recently updated to say they do not require any extra information from us, so on that basis I'm going to say they were satisfied with the answer we gave them for multiple name usage. Provided your passport matches the name you have used elsewhere on official documents (ie, rental/mortgage agreements), I can't see things like different spellings or dropping a middle name being a crucial issue. At the end of the day, the passport is an official document. In the UK at least, you are allowed to drop a middle name, or spell your name differently without declaring it via Deed Poll, which is something we pointed out in our explanation of names.
The Medical
This one confused us after we finished it, as it did not appear to be that in depth at all. Consequently, we now realise that the Dr we saw at least, likely just answered no to things if we never mentioned them. I was expecting them to contact our own GP at some point to obtain medical records, or at least request GP details, but there is none of this. Whilst I would never condone doing this, the medical gave the impression that you could quite simply not declare something and they'd never know. One thing I will say, is to bring along anything that will support you in saying an issue is OK. For example, if you have damaged discs in your back and have had epidurals in the past andyou no longer require treatment, make sure you bring something that says this. In addition, bring along X-Ray results where they detail what is actually wrong with the back. Try not to worry about the medicals too much, they are looking for expensive issues, life long issues or terminal issues mainly. The Dr we saw was reassuring. Whilst they cannot confirm if IRCC will want further details, they will say if they see anything being a potential issue. As it happens, we got grade A for both of us, and passed the medical today according to our IRCC profile.
I think this is about it so far, if I think of anything else i'll add it in a follow up post. Feel free to ask any questions on the process and i'll do my best to answer them if I can, or clarify accordingly. I'll update this further as things progress with our application. Hopefully, all being well, there won't be much to update with!
I'll provide some minor background first. My partner has a masters degree in Environmental Geology and is 29. I have nothing, and am now 30. She was therefore the PA (primary applicant) here, and I am included under common law partner since we aren't married. She has almost 5 years working experience in her field here in the UK. Initially, our CRS score was too low for us to be considered, however we soon realised after a brief chat with Brazalot that we could achieve 471 if we obtained a CBL score of 9+. As nice as Brazalot were, they are far too expensive. We were quoted over £4000 for them to handle our case. Like many have said on this forum already, if you don't have a complex case, then you really don't need to use a consultant. Complex is normally defined by having medical conditions that are costly to treat, or you have a criminal history.
So, the initial hurdle before we even started our application was IELTS:
IELTS: IELTS is not a typical English test, so don't go in there thinking you'll ace it if you haven't done any prep. I highly recommend people do pre-test assessments and practise as much as you can. The hardest part for us, was the listening aspect. The tests are riddled with trick questions and ambiguous answers. My partner had to take the test twice before we achieved the CBL 9's that we required to take our points from around the 400 mark, to 471. To achieve a CBL of 9, you must achieve an 8 in listening, and 7 in the remainder. These basically allow you 4 mistakes in the reading and listening, whereas the writing and speaking is down to the examiner.
I cannot underestimate how important scoring highly on these is. The tests are not cheap at £160 per person, each time. To further maximise points related to IELTS, you need 3+ years’ experience in your trade. If you have a disability, for example Dyslexia, you need a clinical report that is (if I recall correctly) under 2 years old as evidence before they will offer any kind of assistance or extra time. These costs approx £500 to do privately. According to the NHS website, you cannot get assessed for adult dyslexia through them.
Verify your education certificates
My partner used WES for her education certificate verification. Her University were quite handy in the sense they sent across both transcripts for the bachelors degree and the masters degree without charging double. They sent these directly to WES. The turnaround at the University was approx 2 weeks, WES then took around 25 days to complete the verification and a further week for it to arrive in the post back to us. So overall a little over a month. It was not necessary to verify A levels since these were not relevant in our case and wouldn't have provided any extra points, just further hassle.
The application
Initially our application was refused as we put our proof of funds amount lower than required. We based the amount on the requirements displayed during the application, whereas these were incorrect at the time, instead, you must go by what is shown HERE on the main site. Once we received the ITA (invitation to apply), you then have a lot more document finding, form filling and general stress inducing tasks to fulfil.
The main ones that I found to be troublesome were:
Proof of Funds:
We did our proof of funds last so the statements would be only a few days old. We were unable to find on the CIC website how old these could be, and whether they allowed you the full 90 days as leeway. For example, if you got the POF documents within the first week, would they still accept those if you applied 90 days later still, since they are then 3 months old.
Getting the statements should have been a relatively simple task, her accounts are with one bank (Nationwide), and, aside from the average balances, everything asked for by IRCC is pretty straightforward. Not for Nationwide though!. I don't know if the branch we used were entirely full of jobsworths and just couldn't be bothered to spend 15 minutes printing some pages and writing a very simple letter, or whether they genuinely were unable to do it. On our first trip, they referred the stuff needed to their head office, who didn't respond at all. They requested an interim statement and that arrived a week later, which wasn't much help.
On the second trip, we pre-arranged a time to speak with the manager of the branch. She was slightly more helpful, but was also present on the original visit where they said they couldn't do anything. Magically, on this occasion, she was able to do what we needed. The next problem arose from the fact we have a Credit Card with Nationwide. We were told in branch, they cannot see or access anything on the credit card. The account had a zero balance on it for 3 months prior, so no statements were generated either, making proving no debt on it next to impossible. We closed the credit card account when we got back home and rescheduled another visit to the bank to have the letter they wrote amended so there was no mention of the credit card. They refused to address the letter to Canada Immigration as well.
Overall, something that should have been done in 1 trip, took 3 trips and some very reluctant workers doing the jobs they are paid to do.
In addition to this, my parents donated a fair portion of the required funds. We assumed that IRCC would find this suspicious so we preemptively had my parents write, and sign, a document stating the amount, the date, and the fact it was a gift, waiving any rights to the money and confirming it is ours to do as we see fit. We included this in the POF section at the top.
Proof of Common Law
This one was quite difficult to prove. We have lived together for almost 5 years, renting and mortgage together. However, in the last year, we moved in with my grandmother so I could provide care for her, and so we could actually save money instead of breaking even each month. On that basis, we have no real evidence of our relationship over the last year. We had our declaration form, and included with it the evidence of mortgage, rent etc, and house sale. Further on from that, we obtained written statements from my parents confirming the situation, and a letter from our GP who confirmed the relationship as well. This was on top of copies of pet insurance documents showing both names, and our cats registration certificates showing both names and the same address. We hope these will be sufficient, aside from getting married there is very little else we can do to prove our relationship at this point. The main point I want to make with this one is this: If you are able to question anything, or have gaps in the paperwork you supply, then you'll need to find something, or someone, who will clarify and confirm on your behalf.
Family History
If your family history is complex, for example, you have half brothers/sisters who you have no communication with and never have done, then this section can prove somewhat tough. We managed to get most of the information from birth records knowing the surnames at the time and a rough year of birth. I won't go into too much detail here, but on my partners side, reaching out to family members was not a possibility, which made finding out certain information quite difficult. Ultimately, nearly everything can be found via registry checks for birth, marriage and death.
Job References
These are relatively straight forward to do, however with your current employer, i'd recommend saying the reference is for banks. Say it is for a mortgage perhaps. More easy to do if you recently started a job and have been there under 3 months since most banks will ask for references if you apply for a mortgage and haven't been in employment at that place for long. I highly doubt starting a new job and then asking for a Visa reference would go down well. Some managers/HR people don't like to spend the time doing the reference so you may have to be a little... persistent, to get things moving along. Also, it is crucial that they include details of your job role. One of hers initially just wrote 'do jobs as required by company', which really wasn't helpful and does not show an immigration agent you have done the job as listed on the NOC code you have specified.
Multiple names
A lot of people have middle names you can spell differently, or were given 2 middle names at birth but have since dropped it and only use one on the passport. More confusing if you've done both, as in our case. Our application was recently updated to say they do not require any extra information from us, so on that basis I'm going to say they were satisfied with the answer we gave them for multiple name usage. Provided your passport matches the name you have used elsewhere on official documents (ie, rental/mortgage agreements), I can't see things like different spellings or dropping a middle name being a crucial issue. At the end of the day, the passport is an official document. In the UK at least, you are allowed to drop a middle name, or spell your name differently without declaring it via Deed Poll, which is something we pointed out in our explanation of names.
The Medical
This one confused us after we finished it, as it did not appear to be that in depth at all. Consequently, we now realise that the Dr we saw at least, likely just answered no to things if we never mentioned them. I was expecting them to contact our own GP at some point to obtain medical records, or at least request GP details, but there is none of this. Whilst I would never condone doing this, the medical gave the impression that you could quite simply not declare something and they'd never know. One thing I will say, is to bring along anything that will support you in saying an issue is OK. For example, if you have damaged discs in your back and have had epidurals in the past andyou no longer require treatment, make sure you bring something that says this. In addition, bring along X-Ray results where they detail what is actually wrong with the back. Try not to worry about the medicals too much, they are looking for expensive issues, life long issues or terminal issues mainly. The Dr we saw was reassuring. Whilst they cannot confirm if IRCC will want further details, they will say if they see anything being a potential issue. As it happens, we got grade A for both of us, and passed the medical today according to our IRCC profile.
I think this is about it so far, if I think of anything else i'll add it in a follow up post. Feel free to ask any questions on the process and i'll do my best to answer them if I can, or clarify accordingly. I'll update this further as things progress with our application. Hopefully, all being well, there won't be much to update with!
Last edited by jimmynoshoes; May 17th 2018 at 11:10 pm.
Jun 16th 2018, 4:27 pm
#2
Just Joined
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 9
Re: Express Entry - Process Diary
hey!
How is everything progressing for you?
How long was it after submitting docs that you noticed any changes on your account? I submit mine on 7th June, after getting my ITA 9th May, and nothing has changed yet. I took my medical on the 22nd May so all that info should be there.
I am not sure where my application is being processed so just trying to gauge a potential timescale at the moment for this, and know you are applying from UK too
Good luck
How is everything progressing for you?
How long was it after submitting docs that you noticed any changes on your account? I submit mine on 7th June, after getting my ITA 9th May, and nothing has changed yet. I took my medical on the 22nd May so all that info should be there.
I am not sure where my application is being processed so just trying to gauge a potential timescale at the moment for this, and know you are applying from UK too
Good luck
Jun 16th 2018, 8:07 pm
#3
Forum Regular
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 2017
Location: Burlington, ON
Posts: 158
Re: Express Entry - Process Diary
Hey there.
Two weeks ago we were messaged asking us to pay for our Right of Permanent Residence fee, which, as I understand it, means we are nearing the final stages of our application. When we paid originally, we didn't see any way of paying for the above at the same time like the CIC website seems to suggest.
We have never at any point recieved any notification from IRCC about any updates on the profile, except when the message came through asking for payment, we do however, check it daily as their emails appear to arrive a good few hours later than when something actually happens, or in the case of medical being updated to passed, not at all. Your profile status however, will change from 'Submitted' to 'Updated' once the medical status is changed, then return to 'Submitted' once you look at it.
I assume your application currently say that they do not require any additional documents? Initially ours said they do not require any additional docs. After our payment request it was updated to say they are reviewing the additional document (receipt you have to upload). See below: (this is how it has looked since 1st June)
Regarding medical - we applied on 08 May and the medical was updated to say passed on the 18th May, so you should hopefully get an update on your profile in the coming week, all being well. I assume you got an email of your medical report sent to you as well? Ours was a grade A, if yours is the same then I wouldn't worry too much. As I understand it, A is the highest you can get so that may be why ours was passed so quickly perhaps.
Try not to stress on it too much, no communication from them is a good thing as I see it, our heart skipped a beat when we saw the request for additional documents. Sigh of relief when we saw and understood what it was actually for though!
Two weeks ago we were messaged asking us to pay for our Right of Permanent Residence fee, which, as I understand it, means we are nearing the final stages of our application. When we paid originally, we didn't see any way of paying for the above at the same time like the CIC website seems to suggest.
We have never at any point recieved any notification from IRCC about any updates on the profile, except when the message came through asking for payment, we do however, check it daily as their emails appear to arrive a good few hours later than when something actually happens, or in the case of medical being updated to passed, not at all. Your profile status however, will change from 'Submitted' to 'Updated' once the medical status is changed, then return to 'Submitted' once you look at it.
I assume your application currently say that they do not require any additional documents? Initially ours said they do not require any additional docs. After our payment request it was updated to say they are reviewing the additional document (receipt you have to upload). See below: (this is how it has looked since 1st June)
Regarding medical - we applied on 08 May and the medical was updated to say passed on the 18th May, so you should hopefully get an update on your profile in the coming week, all being well. I assume you got an email of your medical report sent to you as well? Ours was a grade A, if yours is the same then I wouldn't worry too much. As I understand it, A is the highest you can get so that may be why ours was passed so quickly perhaps.
Try not to stress on it too much, no communication from them is a good thing as I see it, our heart skipped a beat when we saw the request for additional documents. Sigh of relief when we saw and understood what it was actually for though!
Last edited by jimmynoshoes; Jun 16th 2018 at 8:15 pm.
Jun 20th 2018, 12:36 am
#4
No beginning to my talent
Joined: Dec 2017
Location: Hamilton, Ontario
Posts: 357
Re: Express Entry - Process Diary
I would just add to Jimmy's excellent guide above, to do your best to anticipate any extra paperwork that might be required and go and try and get it ahead of time, as I can hopefully illustrate with this example from our case.
We finally hit the 'submit' button on our application two days ago after several months of research and preparation (we received our ITA in the same round as Jimmy) and having had our medicals earlier in the day. At the medical, as we suspected might happen we were asked if either of us had ever had any serious medical conditions. Having given no consideration whatsoever to lying, we disclosed that my wife had a major operation in 2009 and duly produced her medical notes, ordered from the Medico Legal department at the hospital where she was treated at a cost of £50.
My wife attended follow-up appointments until 2012 when she was discharged from the clinic, and she has not attended or (thankfully) suffered health issues of any kind since. However, and this is where I am kicking myself for not acting on my instincts, the notes we received from the hospital were incomplete due to some of them having already been destroyed. Crucially what was missing was a letter from the hospital to her GP proving that she no longer attended the clinic as she was now in perfect health, which the panel physician said would have been incredibly helpful to submit to IRCC. We reviewed her notes together prior to going for the medical and I noticed this myself, but stupidly did nothing about it and hoped that what we had would be enough.
So the moral is, if you have an inkling that you need something extra and the clock is ticking on your deadline to submit, take a belt and braces approach and get it sorted asap. What should have been a joyous moment when we submitted our application was overshadowed by the possibility that my wife could be found medically inadmissible (the physician thinks it's unlikely but you never know) and by the fact that we are now reliant on a GP receptionist to supply that last bit of paperwork needed (don't get me started on GP receptionists!)
One of the most stressful parts of applying for EE as a FSW is extent to which you have to rely on other humans, who have no vested interest in the process, to supply things for you! So, hope that's helpful and keep your fingers crossed for us.
We finally hit the 'submit' button on our application two days ago after several months of research and preparation (we received our ITA in the same round as Jimmy) and having had our medicals earlier in the day. At the medical, as we suspected might happen we were asked if either of us had ever had any serious medical conditions. Having given no consideration whatsoever to lying, we disclosed that my wife had a major operation in 2009 and duly produced her medical notes, ordered from the Medico Legal department at the hospital where she was treated at a cost of £50.
My wife attended follow-up appointments until 2012 when she was discharged from the clinic, and she has not attended or (thankfully) suffered health issues of any kind since. However, and this is where I am kicking myself for not acting on my instincts, the notes we received from the hospital were incomplete due to some of them having already been destroyed. Crucially what was missing was a letter from the hospital to her GP proving that she no longer attended the clinic as she was now in perfect health, which the panel physician said would have been incredibly helpful to submit to IRCC. We reviewed her notes together prior to going for the medical and I noticed this myself, but stupidly did nothing about it and hoped that what we had would be enough.
So the moral is, if you have an inkling that you need something extra and the clock is ticking on your deadline to submit, take a belt and braces approach and get it sorted asap. What should have been a joyous moment when we submitted our application was overshadowed by the possibility that my wife could be found medically inadmissible (the physician thinks it's unlikely but you never know) and by the fact that we are now reliant on a GP receptionist to supply that last bit of paperwork needed (don't get me started on GP receptionists!)
One of the most stressful parts of applying for EE as a FSW is extent to which you have to rely on other humans, who have no vested interest in the process, to supply things for you! So, hope that's helpful and keep your fingers crossed for us.
Jun 20th 2018, 9:06 am
#5
Just Joined
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 20
Re: Express Entry - Process Diary
This is legitimately the second hardest part of the process (In my opinion). The first part being the waiting and the unknown. Don't underestimate how long the background check can take as well. It's the last thing we are waiting for and have been waiting for since March, we aren't even sure it's been started yet, we hit the soft 6 month deadline next month.
