URSSAF ... no bill
 

Hi
Tried to find the old thread where I mentioned I hadn't received a bill, I think it was in 2016.
I was told then, that they were changing the system, and the bill will come.

It is now 2018 and I still haven't received a bill ... Did receive a little form last July to fill in, and expected they would start the billing process again, but so far nothing.

Any idea what I should do ? Did ring them beginning of last year where they told me to wait.
In this case, I must admit, I have a lot of patience, but I am a bit worried they might sent me something huge soon ???

For information : have lived in France since 1996 and paid contributions till they stopped sending bills (end of 2015 (!!!) ) ,,, I am an early retiree and widow, Belgian.

Anyone ??? Thank you :nod:

Re: URSSAF ... no bill
 

Some people have reported having received their bills just before Christmas, with a month to pay. These bills are for healthcare during calendar year 2016, based on the tax return you submitted in 2017.

The method of calculation has changed so maybe you no longer have to pay? Do you have a pension or something that is exempt from contributions?

But if you wanted to set your mind at rest, I guess it wouldn't do any harm to check with URSSAF.

Re: URSSAF ... no bill
 

Thanks for your reply.

Don't think my pension is exempt from anything :lol:, especially anything to do with contributions. They normally find me rather quickly.

Yes, I assume I better ring them. Hoped I could avoid that, since it takes ages to get someone on the phone.
Will do that next week, as soon as I have another phone (this one blew up in a thunderstorm...).

Re: URSSAF ... no bill
 

This looks like a good explanation of who pays and who doesn't, you may have already seen it, but maybe it will clarify
https://www.previssima.fr/actualite/...e-maladie.html

Re: URSSAF ... no bill
 

Thanks for the link, tried to find that today and couldn't ...

If I understand it well, they should have sent me a bill the end of november, payable within 30 days. OUPS ...
It is true, it was CMU-b which is now replaced (by name only I think). Looks like the calculation is more or less the same.
Does this mean they are now linked to the Tax office and we don't have to fill in the form they normally sent in August ? Makes life easier I suppose.

If I understand correctly, everybody who earns more than 3800 and a bit has to pay so I should pay.
Will definitely ring them ASAP since I see there is a fine if one pays too late :blink:

Thanks for your effort.

Re: URSSAF ... no bill
 

Yes but it's the first time they've done the exercise and there were a few teething problems. They didn't send any bill out until mid-December.

That's correct. It's also one of the reasons for the delay - apparently somebody realised, in mid-November, that it would be constitutionally incorrect for the tax office to share confidential personal information with URSSAF without legal approval, so they had quickly draft, discuss and pass an Order to give permission for certain specific personal details to be shared. :lol: So URSSAF didn't receive the data until early December, and then they had to process it.


I thought the threshold for early retireees was just under, 10,000 not 3,800? Isn't 3,800 the threshold that you have to earn if you're working, in order to not have to pay supplementary cotisations on top of what you've already paid?

Re: URSSAF ... no bill
 

:thumbsup::thumbsup:

One has to love them hey, Very French ... Main reason to come to France, le joie de vivre !

Maybe I misunderstood the threshold, but it's not applicable anyway so never mind.
I understood they will deduct 9800 (or so) from your revenu fiscal de reference and then one pays 8 % over that ?

If they only started half December, in the Var they are always a bit slower, so it might come soon. (Shoot ....) Life was nice without these contributions.

Re: URSSAF ... no bill
 

Right, contacted Ameli who sent me to URSSAF who sent me to CPAM I am still no wiser ...
The information I received was, that it is the Taxman who decides whether or not one has to pay and then he sends the information to URSSAF who then will sent a bill.
Since the Taxman did not sent them the info, they assume I do not have to pay.
I have paid them for 17 years and suddenly I don't have to pay any more ???
Do I love the Taxman ???
I can assure you, my income is well above any minimum required for payment.
Should I ring the taxman as well ???

Re: URSSAF ... no bill
 

I would send him a bouquet of roses.

Re: URSSAF ... no bill
 

:nod::nod:

Think what I will do is, set the money that I reckon I have to pay aside (calculation as per post no 7) and just sit and wait.
I have tried my best and am fed up ringing people begging for a bill ;)

Re: URSSAF ... no bill
 

Having read a number of articles and forum posts about this - it would appear that anyone in receipt of any pension is no longer liable to cotisations. I guess we will have to wait and see if this is an unintentional loop-hole which will be closed when the authorities realise what has happened.

Re: URSSAF ... no bill
 

Oh, right, French way of doing things ;)

Thank you for this info.
Waiting for the authorities might take a while, mind you, there is money involved ... Maybe goes a bit quicker.

Re: URSSAF ... no bill
 

Hi Annetje

I apologise if this is off topic, but in the past week I have had a 'problem' with the Belgian Tax authorities, that my accountant resolved.

Because of the 'Dual Tax Agreement' (DTA) between UK/BE my UK pension is not taxed in Belgium, but in the UK.

I have to declare the income, but they put a 'theoretical tax' amount on it and apply a small 'community tax' to that amount (just a few euros), and then they remove the theoretical tax.

Simple yes!:sarcasm:

So I pay no income tax in BE on that.

I would suspect that the French have a DTA as well with similar reporting ... but you ever know with the French!

Re French taxes I heard today that 'Big capital gains tax changes in store for second home owners in France'

​http://immobilier.lefigaro.fr/articl...d1d10f0b1e/​

https://www.franceinter.fr/emissions...evrier-2018​

I personally am not sure that AirBnB are the culprits here.... where more tax money is concerned!

Jon

Re: URSSAF ... no bill
 

Hi Jon,

Still flying between BE and SP ?

In France, I declare everything (all incomes no matter where it comes from)
My private pension is taxed in France and not in the UK at all (taxcode NT)
A rental I receive in the UK is taxed in the UK. Since I have to declare this as well in France, they calculate the French tax on it and then deduct the UK tax from my total tax bill.
I understand a state pension (not that old yet ;)) would be taxed in the UK. I assume that would be the same system as they do for the rental.

One would hope that, after Brexit (IF it happens) the agreements will go on as now, but who knows.
We will see ......

Re: URSSAF ... no bill
 

UK state pensions are taxed in France. Only UK government pensions (e.g. police, fire service, etc.) are taxed in the UK as per rental income.

Re: URSSAF ... no bill
 

Goeie dag Annetje - I am actually in SP right now. Grey and wet, unusually. We just left Brussels in full sunshine. But the 'beast from the east' has hit. -5 in Bxl and getting colder. So a 20 degree difference in a couple of days SP vs BE! My BH's son in the Ardennes has had -13! And its getting colder. So I a happy to trade that with the current bad weather here.

I agree that one should declare everything, but I am surprised to see that there is a different handling of UK pensions in France than BE. (In my case its a private pension). Ive still got a while (getting longer as they up the age) before I get my state pension (+ bus pass and cold weather payment :) ) When I get closer to that I'll find out how the State pension will be handled in BE.

My private UK pension as mentioned, is declared in BE but after some weird manipulation is untaxed. After a little shock last week - when I got a registered letter from the fisc - I'm really glad we've done the exercise, with my accountant - and I will shortly write to the Tax authorities and explain the situation. Sometimes international stuff needs some explanation.

The whole purpose of DTA's is that you don't pay twice - but (depending on the situation) pay the tax in one country and get a credit for this and pay the difference (if any) in the other - as you know.

I took advice from an international tax lawyer and he said that renegotiating DTA's is a cumbersome process and doubts that it will change as a result of Brexit. Even if it did it would take a long time and we would be prewarned.

So I am not worried about Brexit for this.

Groetjes

Jon

Re: URSSAF ... no bill
 

The DTA is nothing to do with the EU.
It is a Treaty between country A and country B.
Such Treaties exist between many non-EU countries also.

Re: URSSAF ... no bill
 

Thank you for that but I will cross that bridge if I ever get to that age ...

I assume the UK has different agreements with different countries.
It is amazing you get taxed in the UK for the same sort of pension that I get taxed in France for. In my case (not sure why) I only pay about half of what I should pay in the UK, so I'm a happy little bunny ;)

Here in the South we have a snow blizzard going (horizontal snowfall) and the temperature must feel like - 10 ...... Never had that before here (or in any country I lived in).
Nearly Easter now ...... SPRING !!!!!

Re: URSSAF ... no bill
 

So nothing will change then, Thank you very much !

Re: URSSAF ... no bill
 

I think I said that. Brexit doesn't impact the DTA's and Im not worried about Brexit & DTAs. I think we all know that a DUAL agreement is between 2countries.

Re: URSSAF ... no bill
 

Yes it is weird having different tax treatment BE-FR. Also funny that its better for you to be taxed in FR whereas better for me to be taxed in UK. Both BE & FR Are considered high taxation countries.

It also depends on each individual situation of course.

Keep warm and wear those thermals :)

Jon