vboz

Hello new to site HOPE SOMEONE CAN HELP.... moving to France this September and looking for a good primary school for 2 children (maternelle and CE1) - have applied to st germain International lycee but have been offered externes places??? but not keen on this (also not sure how you ever really get into the lycee then!) so now looking for good schools (primary and maternelle) in Versaille - private or public - any idea??

Peabrain

Hi,
If you've been offered places for your children as externes, then that means they've been accepted, but not as boarders. I imagine you'd rather they were day pupils. Once you have a place in St Germain, it makes it slightly easier to get a place in the lycée, which is one of the top lycées in the country, although there are quite a few others in the running for that sort of adjective. Getting a place in the first form (6°) probably requires an entrance exam in English and maths. (The French are obsessed with maths as a way of sorting the sheep from the lambs in the educational system.)
But where would you be living? You don't want to be having to do a school run from miles out; the area is very congested at rush hour.
In Versailles itself there are some very good schools. The Versaillais take their schools seriously. The public sector has a catchment area so it depends on where you live, not so the private sector. Saint-Benoît and St-Jean Hulst have excellent reputations. Private schooling in France won't cost you an arm and a leg, as it is heavily subsidized by the state (as long as the school is "sous contrat d'association avec l'État"). The public sector is, of course, free, apart from books etc.
If you already know where you'll be living, that would help in advising you.
Pb

vboz

Hi Tahnsk a lot for your answer, i am not sure yet where we will be leaving - we want to find the right school for the children first and then leave nearby - i will check the schools you mentioned in Versaille - thanks for your help!
Regarding the Lycee International of St Germain it seems really unclear as to how you move from being an externe (and having one day a week of lessons at the Lycee) to being a full time pupil of the lycee....

Novocastrian

Eh? Etudiant externe means day pupil (i.e. non-boarder), not one day a week.

dmu

... and also an exam in French. The French are also obsessed with grammatical and literary analysis.
If you intend to live in France until at least the end of your children's schooling, then send them to French schools (State or private). They will absorb the French way of doing Maths and also know everything about French Grammar by the end of CM2, not to mention French culture. In their last year at Primaire, you'll know whether to apply to an International School or let them go to a French Collège. In any case, IMHO, if they pass the Brevet in 4 years, without problems, there's no reason not to pass one of the many types of Bac 3 years later....
On the other hand, if your stay in France is only temporary, then schooling which follows the British curriculum would be advisable for when they return to school in the UK....
Be aware that you should enrol your children at the Mairie of your domicile before the end of June, in order to have time to meet the heads of the two schools before the school holidays and to avoid the rush the day before la Rentrée in September.
Which isn't leaving you much time to decide where to live....

Peabrain

Effectivement. I hadn't understood the somewhat arcane term of "externés". You're right, they only have one day a week, which, as the website rightly says, means parents have to get organised as regards driving them in. From an objective point of view, given the possible distances in the Paris region, you don't want to be living miles away from S.G. I would be very tempted to agree with dmu again; they'd probably be better off in a decent, solely French school, of which there are lots in the Versailles area. If your children fit in and do well at school, they won't need the international lycée. There are really good lycées in Versailles; Hoche, La Bruyère, Marie Curie are among the best state-run ones. Sending them to St Germain would be useful if they wanted to go back to Britain to university, but as far as I can see, that's a long way off.
Going to a French school is by far the best way of fitting in and learning the language.
Find out where you'll be living, always remembering that Versailles and the surrounding area are not cheap.

vboz

thanks a lot for your answers i am now looking into French schools in the area of SG and Versaille - i would still love to undertsand the St germain Lycee ways of going from an externe to full time - if anyone knows...

dmu

Hi, at Maternelle/Primaire level, you have no choice unless you choose private - the Mairie of your domicile will allocate the schools depending on your address (if the Commune has more than one Maternelle/Primaire).
At your children's age, I would have thought that your place of work would determine where you would live! On the other hand, if you want them to go to the International School eventually, then look for somewhere close to SG, not Versailles.
Can't help re how to go from externe to full-time. If no one on the forum can help, you'd best ask on the spot once you've arrived, since in any case your children won't be at the International School full-time in September...
Good luck with your decision!

VAurelius

Both my children are externes at the Lycee International. The elder one will be going there full time from september.
Anyone can apply for a full time place, and yes there are entrance tests

It was our decision to go for the one day a week option at first and 'externes' do seem to get preferential treatment for places when they do apply to go full time. This includes where they study, as the lycee international operates on several sites, with the main site (the former SHAPE HQ) the preferred option for us.
The British section at the school is easily the largest -- accounting for about half the students -- but there are plenty of parents who are very keen on the education received in the American section, and all nationalities can also apply there.
BTW there is another very good college/lycee in Saint Germain en Laye which offers English classes and examinations for native English speakers. It's called the Institut Notre Dame and, as the name suggests, is a Catholic college, and is a private school. Unlike the Lycee International, Notre Dame prepares students for the regular baccalaureat, rather than the OIB version which was jointly developed by the Lycee International and Cambridge University.
The other advantage of having some teaching from native English teachers is that the style of teaching -- more discursive and enquiring -- which can be a very useful addition to the traditional learning by rote, which is much more the norm in regular French schools.

vboz

Thank you SO much for your answer!! So can i just confirm with you the following: both my kids took an entrance test few weeks ago to be full time pupils at the lycee, i was offered a full time space for my daughter in Maternelle but not for my son and he was therefore offered an externe place - however i would like him to become a full time pupil of the lycee like my daughter and avoid having the kids at 2 different schools - so
1) do you think my son will have to re-take an entrance test next year to apply again for a full time space at the lycee? my issue is that i am French so i am worried his English will get worse by then....
2) which school would you recommend for my son in St germain if he is an externe at the lycee? he will be in CE1 in September
3) do you know how is the OBI received internationally? do the French like it/know about it? i.e if the kids after the Lycee want to carry on studying in France can they join a good prepa? do the English know about it?
Thank you so much for your help.... as really hard from here to try and get to the bottom of all this!!!

VAurelius

Glad to be of any help. I know what a pain this stuff can be. The good part is that if your son is an 'externe' he will go to the Lycee International only for the English medium part of the curriculum. So his English level should improve and with a sister already in the school full time, if she does ok he should have a reasonable chance when he applies again. Have a word with the school, he may not have to wait a whole academic year to try again. As for other schools in St Germain-en-Laye, we've been in the Catholic school system so those are the ones we know best. A popular option among the French parents is St Erembert. The Institut Notre Dame is a private Catholic school with special English tuition. Their system is a bit like the Lycee International but with a regular French baccalaureat at the end of it. As for the OIB it is certainly recognised in Britain, the question there is whether universities recognise the extra work that goes into it and alter their entrance offers accordingly (some do but -- according to my very unscientific survey -- the majority don't). It is also recognised in France. The OIB was set up by the French education department in conjunction with Cambridge University. It is a French-recognised version of the International Baccalaureat which is actually a Swiss invention and not recognised in France. The students leaving the Lycee International go to a range of universities. Most of those who go on to study in English (the biggest group) get places in the Russell group of Universities and I think of last year's graduates three of four ended up in Oxbridge colleges. The ones who remain in France also go onto to good prepas and grande ecoles. In general the Lycee International has a history of churning out very good IOB results. But there too, if there is one, lies the problem. Some kids -- and indeed their parents -- feel it is too much of a hothouse or conveyor belt with the children getting loads of homework etc. We've told our daughter that if she really doesn't like it we'll look at other options after a year. BTW what year are your children going to be in, in the summer? Maybe they'll be classmates with my two.
The problem that English (or Scottish or ther) universities can have with any French lycee graduate (anywhere in France) is that the education is relatively broad and shallow. That's fine for most arts and humanities subjects but not so good if you want to secure a place to study chemistry, physics etc where a depper more narrow knowledge may be required. Just a thought and, as I say, this is nothing in particular to do with any schools in St Germain its just the general French education system which tends to churn out good, hardworking all-rounders.

vboz

Ok all much clearer now - actually my children are in a catholic school now (in Richmond) - my son is in year 2 so he will start in CE1 in September and my daughter is still very young and will start in Maternelle 3 in September - i will try and contact St Erembert or do you know a good catholic school in St Germain which works with the Lycee and the externe system?
I absolutely agree with you as to the amount of homework - we will stick with it as long as i feel the kids are happy and have enough time to enjoy sports, family, friends ....
Can i ask you why you chose for your children to be externe at the lycee and not full time?

Novocastrian

I hope, while there, they learn to use paragraphs.

Chatter Static

Honestly the boffins at Internet Brands should come up with an auto paragraph filter it would get more use than the swear filter.

vboz

Don't really mind ...paragraphs/no paragraph what mattered to me was to get an answer from someone that knew what externe at the Lycee meant and did not “ROFL” when I wrote that it meant spending a day a week at the Lycee .
Also sorry to disappoint but French curriculum focuses on content and not so much on form, shape and paragraphs…