Compte joint or compte indivis
 

Call me naïve or stupid but I only realized last week that our main French current account which we use for EVERYTHING is in the name of “Monsieur et Madame” and is therefore deemed a “compte indivis”.
If it were in the name of “Monsieur ou Madame”it would be a “compte joint”.

This matters apparently because in the case of a compte indivis, if one holder dies, the account is frozen until the estate is settled. The other holder has no access to it during that time.

If it is a compte joint (Monsieur ou Madame) there’s no problem - the surviving spouse can access it.

I had no idea that this distinction existed. Especially as we’ve always just put one signature on any cheques. The bank has never asked for a second signature.

I’ll ask our conseiller when she gets back from holiday if it can be changed to a compte joint.
Otherwise we’ll have to open a whole new current account.

Re: Compte joint or compte indivis
 

You are absolutely correct in what you say and is a salutary warning as people could end up with financial problems .Many Brits still insist on their account being a joint account with "et" when it should be "Ou" You are wise to get it changed over

Re: Compte joint or compte indivis
 

I can’t believe the conseiller has never drawn my attention to this. All these years she’s been pestering me to come in once a year “pour faire le point”
(which seems to be French for “flog you crappy insurance you don’t want or need”).

Re: Compte joint or compte indivis
 

+1
@helen1964 - you're neither naive nor stupid! I hadn't ever heard of the concept of "compte indivis"....
I'd add that only one of the holders' signatures is needed to sign a cheque on a compte joint.
When OH died, I was advised to use our "frozen" joint account only for necessities until probate, since the final balance was counted in the inheritance. When all was settled, the Bank simply issued cheque books and bank statements in my name only.

Re: Compte joint or compte indivis
 

In the UK, most joint accounts are set up as "either or survivor" which is the equivalent of M. ou Mme.

Re: Compte joint or compte indivis
 

It does make me wonder how many other couples are unaware of the difference and of the implications of having a joint account in the name of « Monsieur et Madame ».
For us it could be disastrous. Especially my husband who still struggles with French.
All our utilities, the Fisc, etc are paid by direct debit from our French current account. My salary is paid into it.
Our Visa cards are linked to it.

Can you imagine having to deal with losing your wife or husband and then finding you can’t even buy a tank of petrol?!

I definitely do not remember ever having a conversation about this with the bank when they opened the account for us many years ago.

Re: Compte joint or compte indivis
 

I am currently dealing with the Estate of a relative in the UK.
I had power of attorney for his accounts and before I notified his bank of his death, I transferred sufficient funds to cover necessary expenses.
I am an executor for his Estate and the surplus money will be returned into his Estate.
The solicitor who is dealing with his Estate actually suggested retaining a "float" for incidental expenses.
I will have to account for any money used.

Re: Compte joint or compte indivis
 

That’s good you were able to do that, Cyrian.
But I have no idea how flexible or inflexible the bank would be in France, should one spouse die and the other discovers that their sole current account is « indivis » and not « joint ».

I wonder is this something French people are widely aware of but foreigners aren’t.
Will conduct a little straw poll at work tomorrow!

Re: Compte joint or compte indivis
 

Thanks DMU.
I now understand that even with a « compte joint » the surviving spouse is advised not to make any major purchases involving the account until the estate is settled. But at least
they could transact day-to-day business.

Re: Compte joint or compte indivis
 

I think most French people are aware of this when they get married, and the Notaire probably advises them, depending on their régime matrimonial. OH didn't even mention the two types of account when we got married (he must have learnt about them for his first marriage).
Direct debits for Utilities, Insurances, etc... and "reasonable" day-to-day expenses can continue, but a world-wide cruise or new sports car would be contested by the other heirs (e.g. step-children from an earlier marrage). I can joke about it now, but, although I get on well with mine, it was a delicate matter at the time and I paid attention....

Re: Compte joint or compte indivis
 

When we moved to France in 2012 both the agent(who was French) and the conseilleur at the bank strongly advised us to have a OU account so perhaps we were lucky

Re: Compte joint or compte indivis
 

In France, they didn't even ask ( I think) - they just gave us a OU account.

Re: Compte joint or compte indivis
 

When my husband passed, I was forever grateful for our OU account.
Especially since his ex-wife started a claim on his pension so all payments were stopped (She didn't succeed but it took 10 months to sort out).

Re: Compte joint or compte indivis
 

All ex-wives have a right to their former husband's Pension de Réversion, on a pro rata basis. I had to share mine with his first wife 50-50, since we were both married to him for approx. the same length of time, and I was rather peeved that I didn't recover her share when she died!

Re: Compte joint or compte indivis
 

She gave up that right with the divorce where she took the house in exchange.
Luckily I found proof of that.
Very disgusting she tried though.
Oh yes, I'm talking a company pension, not state pension. He passed a few months before reaching that age.