mihoz

Thanks again, everyone! I had my heart set on France, but I'm not quite ready to retire yet. So a lot to think about.
I appreciate all your answers.

EuroTrash

Depending whereabouts you live, but there are usually opportunities to get involved in volunteer work. Red Cross, Restos du Coeur, etc. Volunteering is taken seriously here, applicants are thoroughly vetted before being accepted and once you have been accepted, the association will usually be prepared to invest in you and provide formal training if you wish, and give you scope for personal development. I think that's what many incomers do in your situation who feel they still need a challenge and have something to contribute. And obviously the French too of course, because it can sometimes actually be disadvantageous to run a small business after you've retired, on account of the way cotisations / pensions / benefits work (though possibly less so now than it used to be). Just about all my neighbours of a certain age do volunteer work of one kind or another.
For incomers it's a very good way of "integrating" as well.
It's what I would have done if I hadn't kept working.

ddaddy

It sounds like we are in very similar situations. Our U.K. house goes on the market this week and we are heading to France in the new year to find our next home with a gîte or two (A place in the sun has a lot to answer for!).
I’ve been researching visas for months and get different answers every time I speak to a ‘professional’.

As has been pointed out, I believe you can in fact rent a gîte out without a work permit. After all, from the U.K. you could buy a French property and then rent it out. France will most definitely want their share of the taxes from it even though you are in the U.K.

Personally I have a U.K. company and work I can transfer to France, as well as U.K. rental income, but this makes my decisions much harder although I’m pretty sure easier to obtain a basic work visa.

I was advised to take the ‘visitor’ visa route for a year or two as this is simple to get and gives the fallback of returning to the U.K. if things don’t go to plan (ie. Not transferring business etc..) and still rent out a gîte or two as long as we don’t cross the thresholds.
However just this morning I was looking into ‘changing visa status from visitor to worker’ and read that it’s practically impossible the change your visa/residence status one already in France! I’m not sure how true this is, but certainly throws a spanner in the works and shows the importance of getting it right first time.
Does anyone have experience of changing from a visitor to a worker? (Worker used loosely to represent business owner/self employed).

mihoz

Hi ddaddyy

it does sound that we are in a very similar position as we also have our own business in the UK and hence the reason we need to be sure we could stay in France permanently before giving everything up.
it is indeed so complicated and there is no concrete information available from the french Government.

ddaddy

This is something else I have found (and been told several times). Most bureaucracy in France isn’t black and white. It’s kind of grey. They love their paperwork to justify a decision on something but that doesn’t mean it’s the same for the next person. There’s a phrase I read that went something like “If every person in France followed every rule/law to the letter, they’d never be allowed out of bed”.
Everything seems open to interpretation.

Maybe we should keep in touch as we might be able to help each other out.

Listen Very Carefully

If you are moving to France permanently then you need a Visa and show how you are going to support yourself so if you do not have a pension or other income from outside France ie rental income then if you want to work or open a business such as a gite then you need a work visa because you have to show that you are not going to be a burden on the state
There is plenty of information available see
https://www.service-public.fr/partic...osdroits/F2728
https://france-visas.gouv.fr/en_US/web/france-visas/
And the history of expats in France is littered with people who believed that French bureaucracy is flexible and can be bent to suit the applicant and there are lots of people who have found out to their cost that this is not the case and it will be even more so after Brexit You have to get it right at the beginning or else nothing will go right afterwards
I have been an expat(in two different EU countries) for a number of years and have seen the problems caused by not on top of things from the start

ddaddy

Thanks for your insight.
I wasn't really meaning that the bureaucracy is flexible and there to be twisted to suit. I was merely pointing out that it's hard to find a black or white answer to things.
And agree on the importance of getting this right from the beginning, hence the research.

I don't think either of us have a problem meeting the earnings requirement to not be a burden on the state, and in my specific situation I could legally come on a long term visitor visa and not work or setup as a freelancer and come on a work visa. I think the complications come from wanting to earn some extra money on the side (Completely legitimately) but them earnings themselves not being enough to classify as a business for a visa application.
Again in my specific situation (I can't speak for the original poster), i'm swaying towards getting a work visa to setup my business in France but my concern is my wife being allowed to "work" in our gîte's. Not because we need to income, but it's something for her to do and the extra beer money would be welcomed. She has ideas to offer art classes or yoga sessions (Yes I know this in itself has even more bureaucracy, but let's just humour that for that) and I believe this would require her to be registered as a business/self employed and thus requires a work visa.

EuroTrash

Perhaps the reasons the answers are not the same for everybody is because it is very rare to find two individuals who are in exactly the same situation?
Broadly the same situation, yes - British, moving to France, want to do X Y and perhaps Z.
But the devil is very much in the detail, and you and me don't even know which details they will be looking at. Often they don't tell you because they know that if they did, people would get busy with the airbrush and they don't want that.

Moses2013

Well said and just because Gite A is successful doesn't mean Gite B will be successful, even if both parties are in the same village. Although ddaddy says it is only to keep the wife busy, I don't get the obsession with gites in France and in Spain it seems to be a pub. With Airbnb and other sites, the market must be flooded these days and surely there must be other ways to pass the time.

Listen Very Carefully

Spot on - the gite business is not what is was and all it needs another mutation...