Shewolf48

Can someone please help me, as I am very confused!
We are looking for a place to live, either in Brittany, Loire, or Charente area to live permanently. I am 48 and my husband is 50. We have been planning this for four years and now ready to take action.
My husband is self-employed (which seems to be number 1 problem encountered) and is currently working part-time in the UK (approx 12 weeks a year). He can continue to do so when we live in France, but I have been told that this may cause considerable problems with paying tax. Do we still pay tax to the UK or to the French tax office, and if so; will we have problems getting our health/medical cards?
We are also hoping to supplement our income by having a gite to hire out seasonally (fingers crossed and would welcome any ideas on best areas for this, as we do realise that some place may be swamped now) and wondered if we should register as an Auto Entrepreneur for this? If so, I have heard that we cannot claim expenses?
The other plan is for me to carry on with my very small business, making natural soap, bath & body products. I have my own website and my products are EU certified by an English cosmetic chemist and all is trading standards approved too. I have heard that if I follow procedure at the local Marie office, I could sell at the local markets?
We just want to fit in and not upset anyone – especially the French locals, but we do need to survive. Do we also need to get the Marie’s permission to have a gite or natural products business? Luckily, in five years’ time, my husband will be able to claim his private pension, so that will help too.
I have read many of the threads and found help about our cars and re-registering them (although not sure how to prove the tax paid on our cars! Mine is 8 years old, but Mike’s is 20).
Is it possible to still have a successful small gite business and be self-employed? Will the French system cripple us? Any help is much appreciated.
Many thanks xx

cyrian

Hi
Up until November you appear to have been moving to South Africa - now it is France.
Do you have any experience of France?
Do you speak french?
Is this an ambition that you have held for a long time?
Is it just a big idea of "lets just move to France"?
Why don't you rent somewhere for 6 months and see how it works for you.
You would be onsite to discover business setup and admin reality in France.
You could get your cars insured for 6 months and as long as they have an MOT would be valid to drive in France.
You would be covered for healthcare by your UK NI contributions.
Running businesses are not as easy as in the UK - costs are higher and you need to adjust your prices accordingly.
My daughter went to France to study at a french university after having studied french for 9 years (school and university) but initially she struggled with the day-to-day language and relied on my wife to set up flat rental and registering for electricity and bank account etc.
You have lots to think about - good luck

dmu

Hi, some one will come along with more detailed info about income tax and healthcare coverage for your particular situation, which may turn out complicated.
And also info on Auto-Entrepreneurs - what is your OH's line of work? He would have to register as an A-E to continue that (and apparently the powers-that-be are suspicious of A-Es with just one client) and AFAIK one person isn't allowed to have two A-E set-ups. You yourself would have to be a separate A-E either to run your business or run a gîte. Apart from registering at the Mairie where the gîte is located and/or where you intend to have a stall, you have to be registered with other organisations (there again, some one will come along with details). Expenses cannot be claimed back in the A-E régime, but it does give healthcare coverage....
All this red-tape implies an adequate knowledge of French in order to cope (even French people can be flummoxed by it). French bureaucracy is not for the faint-hearted!

Shewolf48

Indeed, yes, you are correct - up until The end of March there was a very strong possibility of us going to South Africa, but the company that wanted to enlist Mike, messed him around some much (4 months waiting), that we gave up on the idea.

We had originally planned to move out to France nearly four years ago, but Mike got locked up into long term contracts. Now we are ready and want to cover as much as we can first. We are not fluent in French and i doubt that most expats are either, although it would be a good idea. Mike understands a lot of French and we are always keen to practice it on our regular trips to France. It odes seem, that unless you are retired with a generous pension; living in France and working looks like a nightmare of red tape - but surely there are some who manage to do it?

EuroTrash

Hi, you really need to speak to HMRC and see if they will advise, as you do not fall into the boxes.

You would need to register your business in France if you want to run it from here. For your husband, it would depend on where he is, physically, when he does the work - which I don't think you said, or if you did I missed it.

Things to consider about AE:
- cotisations are massively higher than NI contributions in the UK; don't even try to compare
- it is not a good regime for businesses with high overheads
- unless you earn quite a lot you do not get anything towards your pension.

As for running a gite as an AE, I believe you are not obliged to register the gite as a business unless it is your main or only source of income. However if you, and possibly hubby too, are registered as AEs, you will have health cover so why register the gite as well and pay yet more cotisations?

Not sure why you are worrying about proving tax on cars - that will not be an issue. Re-registering your car is the easy part, re-registering a 20 year old car may be a problem depending on the make.

Peabrain

Hi,
I don't think you'll be crippled, just a bit of collateral damage.
As an auto-entrepreneur your turn-over is limited to something in the region of €35,000 per annum. You can't claim back expenses, and the flat rate healthcare and retirement contributions take out a massive 25-26% chunk of all your earnings. Even if you already have health care and a pension, you still have to pay it. The A-E regime was set up as an easy way to encourage private entreprise. It isn't really. As dmu says, even some French people are flummoxed by it as it isn't that easy to get one's head round.

Good luck
PB

cyrian

It wasn't my intention to infer that it wasn't possible - just very difficult.
The suggestion to rent for 6 months and not burn your bridges in the UK was to give you a chance to confirm that France is good for you.
Yes there are lots of Brits who have lived in France for many years and don't speak french well, but the french are not the best at responding in english unlike in the Costas. That includes dealing with government officials.
There are lots of threads on this forum where someone has stated that they will be moving to France. However, once they see the potential problems for their situation they change their mind and we never hear from them again.
I also think that those who make a success of moving to France are those who have a real commitment to France and have a determination to make it work. I hope that this explains the thrust of my previous response.
I hope that your plan works out for you.

EuroTrash

Just to add, the turnover limit is dependent on your activity. For sales activities, which yours sounds as if it might be, I believe the limit is slightly over 80 000€.

It is perfectly possible to make a living as an AE, I have been doing for several years. It is a fact that had I operated exactly the same business, same amount of work etc, in the UK, I would have been left with far more cash in the bank, but once you've decided you want to live in France there is no point in keeping comparing with the UK - there are different advantages and different disadvantages, you take it as a package.

Also, keep an eye on the news because Hollande is thinking up all kinds of ways to hamstring the regime, and it is possible that changes might happen soon.

Shewolf48

Thanks Cyrian

I understand what you are saying and fully appreciate the honest help and advice We are truly committed to coming over to France and hope to make the transition as smooth as possible. I think that we understand most of the buying procedure, but now need to decide on if to rent first, then buy. Renting seems the most logical, even if we have to move our furniture into storage. Some long rental property owners have even said we can store it in their barns (once mouse proofed into plastic boxes).

At the moment we are going to take another two week holiday to Pontivy in Brittany during July and bombard the English owners there with lots of questions (they have already agreed to offer their advice) about the area (have been many times here). We then plan to tour around the Loire and Charente region in our caravan for a month during September. Hopefully by then, we may have decided the exact region to live in.

In the meantime, it would probably be a good idea to keep an eye on Hollande, as he could make any changes to small business a real challenge. At the end of the day; we would still want to live in France, even if Mike's only source of income was from the UK.

ouam

Hello

About the AEs, the limits for turnover are:
- 32600 Euros for services
- 81500 Euros for trading

It is the only solution to avoid french bureaucracy.

If you live more than 6 month per year in France, you will be a french fiscal resident. You just have to declare your income in the UK and pay UK taxes for them, then declare your French incomes and to the french gov + tell the french gov the taxes and incomes you had from england.
They will consider your UK income to calculate your tax rate but you will not pay twice.

You'd better find an "expert comptable" (independant accountant) speaking enough english in a range of 1000 - 1500 Euros / year not to bother with it.
It is easy.


Welcome to france

Shewolf48

I think that is great advice and get the Accountant to do it thanks

Ecosteve

Hi, I live not too far from pontivy and have a natural products business. Only have one bit of advice which has already been covered but thought i need to stress if you want to do markets - speak and understand french at a very good level otherwise it will be extreemly dificult!
You will also have to deal with the french system regarding getting your cosmetic safety assessments recognised - all this is done in French unless you are lucky to find someone who speaks english
Good luck with your move!