Ray51

IF you can ( not everyone manages this ! )...

Mitzyboy

Well, yes ... thats your opinion for sure, but thats not Brits in General .... thats the Brits that the media like to hype.
The majority of people I know in Spain make every effort to integrate as much as they can, and learn the language. They dont live in English ghettos, and they dont expect the world to speak English.

I could however direct you to many German & Dutch "areas", just as I could British. I doesnt always mean its the norm though

You could equally say that Germans are noisy brash people on holiday. I've seen it a lot, but thats just a miniscule number of Germans, and my opinion is not that they are brash noisy people. You could say that the Spanish are rude because they dont generally say please or thank you, and the older ladies push infornt of you in queues.. .... but they are not. They say their language is polite enough

So to say that British people are unfriendly beer swilling etc is not really very fair
I also seem to remember that the British people havent been given the chance for some time to decide on the Euro after the last disasterous attempt

Do you live in the London area by any chance?

imprtedvixen

ah no, i don't leave in London..I might have better luck with more open people if i leave there,LOL,, I'm in the North,,Manchester area....
ha ha i didn't mean that all Brits are "beer swilling unfriendly".. but here in the North many of them are,, you can see in them eyes they just don't like foreigners..(once in asda supermarket one woman push me very hard when she hear my accent, and another time the man walk into the shop where i work as a manager and tell me in my face that his daughter is looking for a job and that i take from her,, the daughter look like 18 years old)). but of course as i say before i meet many nice people as well..but i have to mention i met a lot of people who will not go ever abroad because they can't stand any other food then a bit blunt English unseasoned one..LOL
i mean we can talk about this all day and we will not have any conclusion...everything is happened for a reason, i understand why here in the north people don't like foreigners.. there is millions and millions polish people come here when they join EU to look for work, there is a lot of other nationalities who come here just to claim the benefits.. so i no wonder why Brits don't like foreign people..so I as a person who come to the UK, not only to work and exploit the country, but to live with my British husband have to have really bad and not really pleasant experience have to suffer.. so forgive me if I'm a bit protective but if I'm not i will not survive..

EU_Girl

Dear PCM1704,
Both countries (Croatia and Slovenia) bring back wonderful, wonderful memories and hope I will visit these countries soon again!
I would vote for Slovenia, though it is not cheap! As many people have said earlier; the country is an EU member from 2004 and was the first one who was able to introduce the Euro in 2006 among the Eastern European newcomers into the EU. I have been in Slovenia a couple of times and it is one of my favourite places. The country has everything (mountains, sea, good economy). People are skilled and speak good English. I like the fact that they are proud of themselves and they are nationalist in a good way... Although I have found to make friends there more difficult...I think they are not initiative regarding making friends, however they are friendly once you start a conversation with them They are very active and live a healthy life style. They consider themselves like Austrians/Swiss/Italian. So do not make a mistake to call them Balkanians
Croatia....what a beautiful country, love it more than Slovenia due to its scenery. However, they are not in the EU...as far as I know mainly due to its domestic politics.

Have you been considering Slovakia/Czech/Hungary? They are still close to W Europe and you can easily visit the Adriatic sea. Sure, weather is colder in these countries than in Slovenia or Croatia, however the infrastructure/living standard is just as good and I believe the cost of living is lower!

Hope you will find your dream country for yourself and your fam!

Regards.

fidobsa

Yes, when reading this thread I also wondered if Hungary has been considered as an alternative to Croatia? If you went for the Zala area you would be close to the Croatia border anyway but would probably find the property prices lower. I've never been so I don't know what it's like but it has its own forum here so you could find out more by asking there.

Ray51

In all Good Faith ( and EU_girl's post was so incredibly positive , cheers ! ) : many of the countries mentioned are going through very , very bad times , right now
- SLOvenia with terrible recession and consequent loss of employment ,
- CROatia with huge corruption , failure of ( unsustainable ) political system , theft , fraud , crime-scandals ( ex-prime minister Sanader presently jailed , in Salzburg ) ,
- Hungary with unexplainable yet sickly multi-syndroms ( presumably : from Soviet-age communism ? ) ;
if I had any real good money , I wouldn't rush to any of them , certainly they are not bargains enough ( although the grocery shopping really IS good in SLO ! ) .
Each to their own ?

EU_Girl

Hi Ray51,
thanks. No worries, I am not an arguer rather a debater. However you are absolutely right i.e. the former communist countries (and I am deliberately not using the terms of Central and Eastern blocks because opinions are divided which countries belong to Central and/or to Eastern Europe) go through bad times right now (recession and still carrying their past i.e. socialism). However, list a country which has not been hit by recession.

I was born and lived most of my time in one of the post communist countries...(to be honest I do not have any bad memories with that period maybe because I was born in the 80s and was still a kiddo..idk)and I lived on and off in two western EU countries and now I am in the US. I have come to the conclusion that each country has pros and cons. (Unfortunately I have not received any Nobel for this awesome realization Joking)
The question is what one is looking for. What PCM, the original poster is looking for?
The reason I have mentioned these countries for PCM because of good infrastruction, low property price, good weather, close access to Western Europe, being an EU and NATO member. (Pretty much he/she has asked for) In addition PCM mentioned that he/she is not planning to work! That is important...I believe these countries are not the best places for work...salary level is low...however here comes the huge advantage: health insurance is not expensive at all with or without employment. Yes the health care system is still like back in the socialism (low cost) Who beats that?

Oh I am homesick a little bit too...glad holidays are soon over.

Thanks for reading.

Ray51

Well, for starters , France and Belgium beat this , easily !
Also Germany , Austria , Sweden , the Netherlands and any number of other civilised places ; why , you might ask ?
Because in the countries I mention above you have many more medical practitioners per head of population and also more clinics and more hospital beds ; and the access to medical services is much easier , overall ;
- in ex-socialist countries , doctors think ( and behave/act ) as if they were gods , do you a favour to hear you out , usually spending much more time on paperwork , than on the patient ; they talk at you , not to you - as you were demented or thick as a brick and 2 planks ! ) ; also the practice of "gifts" ( bribes ) is widely enshrined , so much so that many people don't expect a medical service without a bribe , in cash or otherwise !
- the cost of participation is now actually more affordable in the above European countries , then in Croatia or Hungary ( when you take the relative personal incomes into the equation ) ;
- and , many a modern prescription medicine is not on the approved list in places like Croatia - meaning , if you know it works for you and so you want access to it , then you have to talk your dr. into such a prescription ( he/she might not be familiar with the substance ! ) , then your pharmacist has to apply to the correct ministry to import the stuff , there's a zillion forms to be filled and costs to be borne...if you're lucky , months later you maybe get your medicine , at the final cost ( after customs/import duties , taxes etc. ) 300-400% higher than e.g. in BeNeLux !
I know which system I'd prefer .

fidobsa

That's interesting. I was all set to buy a property in France but was put off by the experience of an expat on another forum. He had a stroke and woke up in a hospital bed. He later found the French hospital would be charging him over 1000 Euros a day for the bed plus treatment costs. He could claim 75% of this back from NHS in UK but it still left him with a very big bill.
As I say, I've not been to Hungary but I have been to Bulgaria a few times. I know of people who go there just to get dental treatment. They obviously have to pay privately but the savings compared to UK private dentists are enough to pay the air fare.

Mitzyboy

Highlights the importance of having adequate travel insurance when you are away from your own country I guess, and addressing and researching health care properly in the country you are moving to.

Ray51

Agree !
Much depends of the type of cover one currently holds , as well as inter-country arrangements .
In my family we had ( emergency ) treatment in Graz and Klagenfurt ( Austria ) , a scare consultation plus a few fancy scans in Zuerich , Switzerland and a recent , extremely advanced gastro-procedure , administered by a world-renowned prof-expert , at University teaching hospital in Mannheim , Germany ;
in each of the instances , noone at any of the hospitals/clinics ever asked for any cash up-front ; once they noted the Passport details and the address ( as on I.D. card ) they duly proceeded with the treatment/s ;
the bills arrived months later and they were not astronomical , considering...
( in any case , our local insurance , "mutuelle" , settled between 75% and 90% of each one ) .

Coming back to our Croatia thread : I know a few Brit-expats , who now ( think that they ) live there , "permanently" ( well , how permanent can it be , when you need to renew your residence permit , on an annual basis , even after you have bought your own expensive property outright and share this with a Croatian spouse and her family ? ) ;
- going to the doctors/hospitals ?
With the NHS card/ European Insurance Card ( EHIC ) ?
Usually , noone knows a thing about such stuff there , so it's : pay up front , claim back , from your own country systems later ( if you can/are entitled to ? ) .
I do note , however , that some of them still think : it's worth it , though !

EU_Girl

Here is a good point and it is true.
E.g. A foreigner - in the countries mentioned above - pays a monthly health insurance fee (I do not know this for sure about Croatia!) and pretty much that is it...same as being a citizen. Of course the waiting for the sevice can be long, quicker check up, not as nice atmosphere (buildings, furnitures are being older) as in e.g. US or UK (based on experience). If someone is not a resident of the specific country, then unfortunately the hospital contacts your country...


In which country have you experienced that? Funny, I have experienced much more time on paperwork and talking than examining in the UK which cost me a fortune years ago. But this is just one experience...would not draw a conclusion from my own experience that UK health care sucks...it would be a very biased statement.
Since health care service is busy in my home country, doctors usually stick to the point and try to be quick. If you are not satisfied with your family doctor, you can select someone else. Not as bad as you are describing.
Yes, bribes exist, I do not deny it but it is not mandatory! However, I see it as a tip (like when you are satisfied with someone`s work or want a better service). Unfortunately doctors are not paid well in these countries. So it is your decision whether you tip or not. On the one hand I know bribe should not be exist and it is not legal either on the other hand do not forget, health care are not privatized in these countries. Being a non profit organization pretty much, doctors are not paid well.
Who knows when will health care be privatized? Though it will be a big battle as people are used to the almost "free" health service. These changes are hard to adapt in countries we are talking about.

Ray51

[QUOTE=EU_Girl;9069546]
In which country have you experienced that? QUOTE]

As a polite & gentle reminder : the thread is " Croatia " !
( Although I'm lead to understand that Bulgaria , Roumania and Hungary are equally bad , if not worse still . )

How do you propose to initially offer a ( cash or goods ) " tip " ( as you call it ) , when you don't know if the eventual service you receive will be good , bad or indifferent ?
Nonsense , IMHO :
in drastic reality , you only just offer a BRIBE so that you will be seen to a.s.a.p. ( well , or badly ? who knows ) and the other poor suffering buggers can wait longer still , for theirs' is the bad luck for not being willing or able to offer such bribes ...
Some EU-progress , indeed !!!

TheRusvaj

Hi everyone, I'm new to the forum and found some good info over here and would like to send some back. To introduce myself briefly, I'm university educated deck officer from Croatia in early thirties, was working previously on merchant marine ships as navigational watch officer and for past four years I have been on megayachts (which is actualy very anglo industry ) first as mate and then skipper/captain, traveled a lot through Mediterranean countries both for bussines and pleasure. Now I'm considering shore based employment other than my home country. I came here primarily in search of info on expat experiences in various countries but got also interested by this topic as it is always interesting to see things about own country through a foreigners perspective. Until some real British expatriate in Croatia shares his/her experience I cant help myself but to post few things myself on this topic, hopefully it might be useful to someone... First thing I would definitely like to comment is this „issue“ about language and some kind of anti British sentiment over here, well, in mild terms, not entirely the way Ray described it... English language has been taught as mandatory subject in primary and secondary schools and on colleges/universities since Yugoslavian times, and almost everyone except for the eldest or most far away rural people speaks it at least at basic level (meaning being able to communicate) and median of population speaks it at least at good level. Other than education large contributor to the widespread konwledge of language (at any level) is a simple fact that movies and TV series over here arent dubed but subtitled, unlike some European countries (Italy, Germany, Poland, etc.) English is first language after Croatian over here, German being second and spoken mainly in continental Croatia and Italian third, which is spoken mainly in Istra and Dalmatia coastal regions. There are some historical reasons for usage of these other languages, one being centuries of Austrian and Italian rule over Croatian regions and general geographical closenes of these countries, others being close economical ties and trade, also really many people from over here work in these countries, that being a tradition from Tito's times (early 60's). But to underline the important thing, people over here don't refuse to speak English, just the opposite, for most of jobs, and especially for good jobs knowledge of English is mandatory, other languages being sought only after it.
Second thing that caught my eye is mention of some kind of general anti British sentiment over here, not true, there is no such thing, well, at least not more than in any other country... first of all, people over here know the difference between UK and England, and if there is any (sad) negative sentiment by anyone than it is specifically Anglo oriented, Irish, Scottish and Welsh generaly being perceived extremely positively. Second of all, reasons for possible anti anglo sentiment in certain social groups are various, surely that recently established football rivarly didn't help much... about colonialism that Ray mentions it's something seen as seriously negative thing over here, but it is your legacy from not so long time ago, personally I don't see a bad thing for judging that. Another thing is the English historical domination over other British nations which is not seen very positively here in a country that was historicaly governed by much powerful neighbours. Again, Tito's legacy about anticolonialism and anitimperialism is still strong over here, former Yugoslavia was after all a leader of Non-aligned movement and heavily influential and present in former colonies, including some British ones. But on the other hand, sir Fitzroy Maclean for example, a first Brit non-diplomatic (semi)expat here was the only foreigner allowed to own a real estate in Yugoslavia, and that was a house in Korcula in Croatia and his family still owns it. He was the forerunner and nowadays there are many other, mostly in Istra region,city of Dubrovnik area and on Dalmatian islands Korcula, Brac, Vis and Hvar. Most of them are not real expats but property owners who come to rest occasionaly (like neighbour of mine in Kastela who fancies all-day-long espresso drinking with locals), but I hope that real expats shall come eventually to the forum to share their experience.

gipsy

The majority of English that I know here in Spain do not make an effort, do not learn the language and do expect the world to speak English....I am Sorry !
They go to the English shop, eat/drink in English bars, ....
I, on the other hand, learned Spanish before I went to live there and no, English is not my mothertongue either...