TheD4

Does the type of work in which ever EU country you go to matter? Does the income have to be a certain amount?

englishguygoinghome

No and no. But again, I'd recommend anyone who thinks there is even the small chance that the UKBA won't play ball with their Singh plans to run them past this agency, follow their advice and include their reply in the application. http://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/help/index_en.htm

WEBlue

As Englishmangoinghome says, the answer to these questions are "no and no".

However. ... be aware that there is UKBA Guidance for the Surinder Singh Route says that for the SS Route to succeed the UK citizen's work in the EEA country was "NOT transient or casual". See Section 2.5.1 "Familiy Members of a British National (Surinder Singh)"

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/si...df?view=Binary

englishguygoinghome

Which is yet another example of the UKBA stretching the boundaries and breaking the rules in my opinion. But thanks for pointing that out - It's always worth remembering that the goal is to get into the UK as quickly and easily as possible so complying with the UKBA's requirements, even if they are illegal, is usually the path of least resistance. It's interesting to note that the UKBA's own guidance also clearly states that it is irrelevant why someone went to the other country, and specifically says even if it is clear this was done to use the Singh route a visa must be given.
That's also why I suggest contacting the your Europe team, which is a formal EU body set up to assist citizens in ensuring they are given their rights. A letter from them, included with the application, staing that the process followed is valid under EU rules must help. And if you still get rejected, a followup contact to the same poeple is probably going to give you a far quicker resolution than contacting them for the first time once rejected

WEBlue

I completely agree! And the fact that they buried this rather explosive bit of wording -- "other than on a casual or transient basis" --is inside parentheses in an obscure part of the Internal Guidance that is not easy for the public to find is IMO very sneaky and completely wrong.

How does one interperet "casual or transient" work anyway?? It's totally subjective!

Exactly. Even if someone who was denied on the grounds that their worrk in the EEA country was too "casual & transient" possibly could win a subsequent court case (and also get that parethetical phrase removed from the Guidance?) no one trying to move back home to the UK with a non-EEA spouse wants to have to go through all that.

Yes, agreed. I think anyone going the SS Route should print out that next-to-last paragraph of EUN2.14 on that link
( http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/po...eun2/#header14 ) in bold lettering to make sure they can show it to an IO if necessary.

englishguygoinghome

At least they still allow "Established him/herself there as a self-employed person;". Which, let's be honest, in a lot countries is a simple case of filling out a form and paying a registration fee. Probably even easier than actually finding a job.

WEBlue

Yes, that occurred to me too when I was reading the guidance. No parenthetical nit-picking about the nature of the self-employment; all you have to do is "establish" yourself.

The self-employed UK citizen must go on to actually earn some money, I assume, but the Singh Route imposes no required income amount, and s/he would surely be able to pull in some kind of earnings in +/- 6 months.

holly_1948

I doubt there is a requirement to earn money. But there is a requirement to have activity. A bona fide business could invest in advertising, office space, equipment makes sales proposals to prospective customers and so on but fail to actually close any deals or issue any invoices. Thus economically active but never earn any money.

What you can't do is to be "self-employed doing nothing".
They won't let you get away with that.
I seem to recall long ago a TV comedy about someone who did that, and then could not pay the class 2 NI stamps when they came due.
Anyone recall it?
[edit] Ah, I think it came to me. Harry Worth.

englishguygoinghome

Some countries on the continent will require you to formally register as self-employed and provide a certificate that you have done so. That's the evidence the UKBA used to ask for when getting a visa.

ldollard

Do you think living in say dublin, but working for a company overseas would be allowed and if so would this then be seen as self employed for the surinder singh route?

Furthermore, where do you apply/register for this self-employed certificate?

And lastly how do you go about paying self-employed taxes on that work in the country in question?

holly_1948

Every country is different.
It's no use asking in this UK forum about foreign laws and rules.

WEBlue

True, it's likely somewhat different for each EEA country.

I've noticed BE posters asking Surinder Singh questions on the Ireland sub-forum. Maybe choose your country, do some research, & ask questions on the sub-forum for that country....

ldollard

You do realize some people have more knowledge regarding laws than just local laws. If i came across a question I didn't know the answer to on these forums, I generally research and help the best I can.

Cool thanks WEBlue, i did just that.

kisuma

Many thanks everyone on the site for being so informative and patient. I am very impressed. Just keep on doing what you are doing ....very well!!
As i have mentioned before i am a 69 year old pensioner married to a 59 year old Russian woman, we have been married for two years having known each other for getting on for five years. We are about to embark on the Surrinder Singh route to the uk. I am a british citizen have been all of my life she is a Russian citizen has been all of her life. I live in mid-wales so Ireland via Holyhead makes the most sense regarding my three months or so working outside the uk.I am unsure about some of the things that i have read perhaps there is someone on these pages who can put my mind at rest.

(1) Is an Irish Resident Permit a" must have" to present to the uk border agency.....

(2) She will be coming to the uk on a Family visitor visa (a) is this the correct visa to obtain. (b) Is the duration of the visa ( six months) enough time to obtain the paperwork needed.

(3) I understand that we will have to present to the border agency my proof of employment in Ireland.....Our passports with our marriage certificate (which is translated into english and notorised) ....... Are there any other documents that they will require i.e bank statements, proof of income etc.

(4) Does she have to live with me in Ireland?.......

(5) If all goes well what can i expect the border agency to give us ....Temporary leave to remain?..... Indefinate leave to remain.......etc.

Once again many thanks for your attention it certainly is appreciated...Kisuma

WEBlue

Hi Kisuma, many if not all of your questions are answered on the "Surinder Singh Route" FAQ thread on the EEA Route board of the immigration forum immigrationboards.com:

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewtopic.php?t=114867

The thread covers all kinds of info for the EEA Route in general. Scroll down to the sixth post for info specific to the Surinder Singh route to settlement in the UK.

Several immigration advisors who are very familiar with the ins & outs of Surinder Singh post on that board.