grpd

Oh dear I had no idea people would take this personally! If a French lady was living and working in London and wanted to return to France to give birth close to her family on the French national health coverage I would think that entirely normal. But that's my opinion, I realise others may have a different opinion.

To clear a few things up the sole motive I have for wanting to come to the UK for the birth is to be near family. Citizenship is a non-issue. If you are a British citizen who was born in the UK, your children have the right to British citizenship no matter where they are born. My first baby is British though not born in the UK. Compulsory military service no longer exists in France, in fact it's been years now.

I am, as one said, currently staying in Lebanon. We are coming to Europe in May. I tried to keep my post simple and restrict it to the relevant details. I have medical coverage in France and have done for over ten years. French coverage is good, because French taxes are even higher than in Britain.

I'm not trying to avoid or escape anything, I just want to be near my parents.

Just for clarity and for the sake of other readers, the Dept of Health guidance doc I referenced says under regulation 23b that some coverage is available for former UK residents now living in EEA countries:

3.101 People who have lawfully lived for ten continuous years in the UK at some point but who are now living in an EEA state or Switzerland, or a non-EEA country with which we have a reciprocal healthcare agreement (see regulation 10) are exempt from charges for treatment the need for which arises during the visit. This does not apply to those living in Israel.
Examples of evidence:
- (a) proof of ten years continuous residence e.g. previous job, schools attended, previous address(es); and
- (b) proof living in EEA member state/Switzerland or non-EEA reciprocal country – e.g. address details.

This doesn't apply to me, but might help others.

Thanks to those who contributed sensible advice and information. If others have any useful advice to add please do.

grpd

I should also add that we are seriously considering the option of relocating to the UK hence my other threads on the spouse visa, family permit and S Singh route. But I'm realistic enough to know that it could take longer than I have before the birth as I won't be allowed to fly late in pregnancy.

holly_1948

I hope it goes well for your child. Children are our future.
Just so long as you are aware that if you are resident for benefits you almost certainly can't be non-resident for taxes.

scot47

You have decided to come back and live in UK. No need to elaborate on that. I cannot say that I am 100% sympathetic to freeloaders, although some might accuse me of the same !

holly_1948

Is that different frae bein' a canny Scot?
Hoots, nae stushie.

roaringmouse

France doesn't have national service any more - this stopped over 10 years ago.

grpd

It's odd, I responded to the misinformation in the other posts, but it seems moderation is slow. Obviously there was nothing objectionable or rude in my post, and the only link I included was the same as the one I put in the initial post. Only it's confusing to not keep comments in the order they were written.

nun

On page 36 of this

https://www.wp.dh.gov.uk/publication...2012-FINAL.pdf

It says that if you have lived in the UK for 10 years and are a resident of an EEA country you get reciprocal benefits and don't have to pay for healthcare in the UK.

I find the initial responses to the OP to be shocking, it saddens me how mean spirited some in the UK have become.

dunroving

The question in this thread is fraught with misinformation. Although, like you and others, I think the level of "benefits abuse" is far greater in other areas than NHS tourism, it is important that people get the right information. Delivery of a baby is a potentially very expensive bit of health care, so knowing whether you are likely to have to pay is critical.

Page 36 states that ex-UK residents who are living in an EEA country "are exempt from charges for treatment the need for which arises during the visit."

The latter expression is ambiguous. If the visitor became pregnant before the visit, then is delivery of a child something "the need for which arises during the visit."? I think the question of intent plays a part - a person with diabetes who has a diabetic episode while visiting didn't plan to come here for treatment, or know ahead of time that they would need treatment. Planning to travel to another country and be there past the 9th month of pregnancy is a different situation.

I don't know - like tax law and documentation, the Devil is in the details, and the terminology is often ambiguous or open to interpretation. Ultimately you are at the mercy of whoever is making the decisions on the spot. Many NHS staff are ignorant of the rules, leading to problems in both directions.

From what the OP has described, her best bet is to assume she is returning permanently - if after having the baby she subsequently realises she wants to leave the UK, fair enough.

Regardless of the above, she should be entitled to reciprocal treatment - so if delivery of a baby is free in France, then she would be entitled to free treatment here. If there is a specific charge (a sort of co-pay, if you will) in France, then she is entitled to treatment for the same charge here.

This topic always gets people's hackles up. There are many aspects of cheating tax-funded programs that bug me, including intentional NHS tourism, and for that reason I won't willingly give advice on how to cheat the system (threads about cheating the immigration system get hounded from these Forums pretty sharpish).

But in the big scheme of things, it's a relatively small issue so although I think it's fair enough to speak plainly (cheating a system is cheating a system, I see no reason to dress it up), there's no need to be deliberately rude or make assumptions about the type of person the OP is.

iaink

We have to sleep sometimes

englishguygoinghome

From personal experience (of returning to the UK less than 3 months before having a child) some hospitals and doctors will not require any evidence of residency. Others will need proof of address - although this may have been because we were moving from one NHS trust to another and the place we were moving to was a lot better and therefore subject to a lot of "internal tourism" so to speak. No one asked to see a visa.

Englishmum

There is something else the O/P could do: perhaps her parents go and visit her for a few weeks or longer when the baby is due?

Going slightly off topic I remember watching the Michael Moore documentary movie 'Sicko', where he compared the US healthcare system to that of Canada, the UK and France. He interviewed some French mothers, including American expats resident in France and they were all fantastically happy about their birth experiences there and follow up when they returned home....it certainly sounded better than the NHS to be honest....

quoll

Yeah, I was about to suggest what Englishmum suggested - if you need them, can your family not visit you when the baby is due then you avoid all this and you get the continuity of care throughout your pregnancy etc. Seems like much the easiest option to me.

grpd

Thanks iaink for completing the moderating.

Thanks for your comments, I have as you can imagine, considered having my parents over for the birth. I mean who really needs the hassle of going away to give birth, changing doctors etc, it's enough fuss as it is. But they both work and aren't able to leave their work for long, so I was thinking it would be better to have a little help regularly (a cooked meal, bit of babysitting etc) over four months or so, than full-time help for just a fortnight. Plus my toddler doesn't get to see them often. Thanks for taking an interest in my situation anyway. If it can't be done then it can't be done.

WEBlue

I gave birth to a baby in France many years ago when we were resident there for my husband's employment, and we had to pay a small portion of the hospital cost. This may be totally irrelevant now as things may have changed completely, but if you are covered under the French national health insurance scheme, the details of the reciprocal health agreements might be something to look into (...if you haven't already). The amount we paid was very reasonable, but the birth was not free by any means.

Good luck with your planning! I hope it works out positively for you--giving birth as an expat is never simple....