not2old

As usual I get overwhelmed & confused at times with all of the documents & information available through FOI - UKVI immigration rules, the 'spouse of a settled person' visa, vs the 'Family Permit' visa, via the SS route, the EEA freedom of movement for EEA citizens with their spouse/partner allowed entry to the UK. Then the ever so encompassing (is it current & still used) 2009 edition of the 'UK border force operations manual', the book & guide for EO's?

I have learned lots from reading the input & others experience on the BE threads.

Coming full circle & getting near the end of my contributions on BE, I have unanswered questions which I trust someone can help with... as follows

For this it presumes a couple (British passport holder & non EU citizen) they are not normally resident in the UK. The couple in question have their centre of life together in one of the commonwealth countries or the USA. The non EU spouse does not need a visa to enter the UK to visit.

1. The British passport holder wants to bring their spouse to the UK to settle, has several options

- The 'Family of a settled person' visa - with it the requirement to meet the huge financial need, including and/or in combination the work in the UK to be earning 18,600, self employed or self-sufficient.

-or-

- The SS route, for several months in a member state - must prove 'centre of life' condition, to then be eligible for the no-cost 'Family Permit' visa

Is the above correct - did I miss anything?

Then there is

2. The British passport holder, who also holds a passport from one of the other EU countries - 'Malta' for this purpose

- Under the freedom of movement, the non EU citizen spouse with their Malta passport holder spouse can enter the UK together & at the border allowed entry. The spouse will be given a IA, EEA Dependent stamp is (it was formerly called 1A .

Both the spouse & the EU (Maltese citizen) are in the UK. Immediately on arrival in the UK, the non EU spouse applies for a residence card, good for 5 years at which time they will receive a permanent residence card.

The Maltese passport holder being an EU citizen will not have his/her passport stamped with any entry or visa. Once in the UK, the couple integrate into UK life. The dual passport holder (Malta & British) requires no further action, because the dual passport holder refers back to the British passport & citizenship?

Have I missed anything?

Is what I posted a legal entry for the non EU spouse?

rebeccajo

British citizens who also possess citizenship of another EU state cannot exercise free movement via the second passport.

The Home Office says 'if you are British, then you are only British'.

If one wishes to exercise this route, the only option is to relinquish British citizenship.

not2old

see, I didn't know that - thanks.

Although, I have read on BE it applied to those with Irish/British dual passport holders,, such as those born in Northern Ireland' that have that option of dual Irish & British passports & that's why I guess there was some reference or relation to the McCarthy case?

My understanding that for other EU countries (not Ireland/Northern Ireland & British passport holder), that one could apply using the non 'home country' EU passport to exercise 'freedom of movement'(FOM) , as an example 'France & Malta', using the other passport to exercise FOM?

Similar with the dual British & Malta passport holder living outside the UK bringing the non EU spouse (American) under the 'freedom of movement' to the UK on the Malta passport?

Rebeccajo, do you have a link to what you you posted with respect to the 'British' only & to have to relinquish 'British citizenship' to exercise the FOM' & the reference to if its British and another EU country, wouldn't be let in the UK as freedom of movement?

rebeccajo

Why would an Irish passport (which is what an Ulster dually might hold) be viewed any differently than a French passport? Not to be a wise guy, but that's your common sense answer.

I'm not able to dig for links at the moment. If you google it a bit though, the info is easy to find.

not2old

https://www.gov.uk/dual-citizenship

The Immigration (European Economic Area) Regulations 2006

The Immigration (European Economic Area) Regulations 2006

not2old

I dont have an answer to my questions, that's why I asked it

As for Northern Ireland (British citizen) is also allowed to hold Irish citizenship /passport & its only a guess, that folks have been trying to skirt the British by calling themselves Irish, thus, in some cases having to renounce British citizenship

No clear answer it seems

I guess, I still need to find out & a google doesnt help other than the UK allows dual nationality & Parliament allows an EEA passport holder to bring their non EU spouse to the UK. So, its use the EU passport to bring the spouse to the UK & tuck the British passport in your back pocket

Its almost like those with dual passports - a British one, and say a US or a commonwealth passport - that travel to the UK, entering the UK on the British passport, returning back to their home, entering on the passport of that country

Its all very confusing too me

All the same would like to get a definitive response or answer to my OP

tHANKS

rebeccajo

Skirt the British by calling themselves Irish?

If you are born in Great Britain or in Northern Ireland, you are automatically a British citizen. If you are born in Northern Ireland, you are also a citizen of Eire. There's no 'skirting' going on and it's patently clear.

The UK does NOT allow persons with a British passport and a second passport to call themselves anything other than British as far as immigration is concerned. There is no tucking British passports into back pockets allowed.

I'm sorry I'm not able to immediately give you a link. There use to be an easily found link on the UKBA website before the website was redesigned into the current confusing mess.

37100

https://www.gov.uk/government/public...y-permit-eun02

Maybe this will help.

not2old

Post #8, thanks

what if a dual EU citizen can, was my question in the OP, which too me it appears they are able to do since the UK recognizes 'dual citizenship (post 5) as well as under UK legislation EEA nationals and their spouses can enter the UK without a family permit.

There are folks on BE (members) who are dual EU passport holders, under EU freedom of movement that they can use that other EU (not British) passport to enter the UK with their non EU spouse & take up residence without a family permit or FM visa?

expanding on the case point of my OP

Person ‘P’ and Spouse ‘S’ are both born & bred citizens of country ‘A’ which is not part of the EU. They are married & live together in a smallville town in country ‘A’. ‘P’ is fortunate to also have citizenship by descent of EU country ‘B’ as well as EU country ‘C’.

Citizens of country ‘A’ can travel visa free to visit any EU country.

Both ‘P’ & ‘S’ decide they want to move to & live in EU country ‘B’

Since ‘B’ is an EU country, under EC ‘freedom of movement’ rules ‘P’ together with ‘S’ can enter country ‘B’. ‘P’ and ‘S’ arrive together in country ‘B’. At border control, ‘P’ presents country ‘C’ passport. ‘S’ enters as a family member of EEA national ’S’ produces similar evidence which is required for the EEA FP namely, passport from country ‘A’ and their marriage certificate.

‘Since ‘P’ is a citizen of an EU, ‘P’ passport is not stamped. ‘S’ passport is endorsed with an ‘EEA Dependent stamp’ (formerly the 1A stamp UK). ‘S’ can now proceed to apply for the 5 year residence card (EEA2).

For the UK

Border force operations manual

See sections 4, 5.5.2 & 6

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/reque...Dependents.pdf

additional information

https://www.gov.uk/government/public...ationals-eun01

links in post#5 above

37100

Except, the non-EU can't apply for registration. You cannot pick and chose passports at will.

https://www.gov.uk/apply-for-a-uk-re...-card/overview

N.B There are people on here far more knowlegable than me.

Tr1boy

My cat's name is Mittens.

rebeccajo

Ah. I'm on to the scenario now.

I think the answer you are looking for can be found by looking at the application for 5 year card. It asks if the EU holds other citizenships. If it did not then you could tuck the British passport.

*edited because I did my legwork later*

rebeccajo

I should add that I am becoming very confused about the ability of a citizen of descent of a country being able to exercise free movement with a non EU. Perhaps BritInParis could clarify. That is not my area of expertise. I am not wishing to float alarm as it may be perfectly fine. It is simply something I don't know about.

not2old

An EU citizen living & working in the UK does not need a residence card

from that link in your post....

"You can apply for a residence card if you’re from outside the European Economic Area (EEA) and living with a European partner or family member who’s not British.

You don’t need a residence card to live in the UK, but it can:

help you re-enter the country more quickly and easily if you travel abroad
show employers you’re allowed to work in the UK
help prove you qualify for certain benefits and services"

37100

not2old;11579266]An EU citizen living & working in the UK does not need a residence card

from that link in your post....

"You can apply for a residence card if you’re from outside the European Economic Area (EEA) and living with a European partner or family member who’s not British.

You don’t need a residence card to live in the UK, but it can:

help you re-enter the country more quickly and easily if you travel abroad
show employers you’re allowed to work in the UK
help prove you qualify for certain benefits and services"[/QUOTE]

I said that that the non- EU can't apply for registration. Read point 2 Eligibity.