Robbo55

Hello,

I am a British Citizen living in Australia. I understood that I could apply for British passports for my Australian born children by descent.

However, I was born in Saudi Arabia as my British parents were temporarily working there and the passport examiner is saying that my children are unable to get British passports because they are 2nd generation.

My birth certificate states 'Birth Within The District of the British Consul in Jeddah' and furthermore being British I have no right or never had any right to Arabic nationality.

I would be very grateful if anyone could kindly advise where I might be able to seek a second opinion or if anyone has experienced the same difficulty.

Pollyana

I'll move your post into our UK forum as we have several posters in there who are knowledgable about this type of query

roaringmouse

Normally British citizenship only passes on 1 generation outside the UK, although there are some exemptions to this. It sounds like you are British by descent, and so British citizenship does not automatically pass on to any children born outside the UK (unless the other parent is British otherwise than by descent).

If you have lived in the UK for 3 continuous years any time before your child was born, then it is possible to register the child as British by descent under section 3(2).

BritInParis

What were your parents doing in Saudi Arabia? If they were in Crown, European Community or designated service then your children would be eligible to receive British citizenship automatically by descent.

Otherwise there's no automatic right to British citizenship for a second generation born outside the UK. roaringmouse has outlined a registration option that may be open to you. If that does not apply then your children, as Commonwealth citizens, would be eligible for ancestry visas once they are adults which would enable them to live and work in the UK and naturalise as British citizens in due course if they choose.

Robbo55

Thank you roaringmouse and BritInParis. I can't thank you enough.

I will investigate Section 3(2) as I lived practically all my life in the UK.

In answer to your question BritInParis, my father was employed by a University out there. I understand that he was employed directly by them rather being transferred from the UK.

What I can't quite get to grips with is if I had been born in the USA, for example, I would have received American nationality but in the case of being born in Saudi, Arabian nationality was not an option and therefore I could only be 'naturalised' as British. I just wonder if there is some sort of exemption for this scenario.

roaringmouse

You're talking about 3 different countries, and therefore 3 different sets of laws.

You weren't naturalised British, you were British from birth - albeit British by descent. The term naturalised relates to applying for citizenship (but not via registration)

For the US, anyone born in the USA is a US citizen no matter what their parents nationality may be - which is not the case for the UK since 1983.

BritInParis

If your children, for example, had also been born in Saudi Arabia and they had no entitlement to any other citizenship (i.e. through their mother) then it would be possible to register them as British citizens, as the UK is party to the Convention on the Reduction of Statelessness, although this scenario is rare.

It depends whether a country operates a jus soli or jus sanguinis system. The US has a 'pure' jus soli as birthright citizenship is enshrined in its Constitution. It is now rare to find this outside the Americas. The UK has a modified jus soli system which was introduced in 1983. Only those born to a British citizen or someone who is 'permanently settled' in the UK will receive British citizenship at birth automatically. Saudi Arabia operates a jus sanguinis system whereby only children of Saudi citizens can also be Saudi and then usually only through the paternal line.

Having the cut-off point beyond the first or second generation born overseas however is a normal component of most countries' citizenship laws; Ireland being the notable exception.

JAJ

You weren't naturalised as British, you were British by descent when you were born. The law doesn't make you British otherwise than by descent just because you didn't get the nationality of your birthplace (or anywhere else) when you were born.

You've not told us if your children are also Australian citizens, or if they have any other nationality. Although even if they're also Australians, they appear to be eligible for British citizenship under section 3(2) of the British Nationality Act. Age limit for application is normally 18th birthday.

Robbo55

Hi JAJ, my children have Australian nationality. I have just emailed the Passport Examiner to understand if I can indeed take advantage of the section 3(2) and what might she require from me to demonstrate continuous living in the UK etc. I will be sure to let you know her response asap.

JAJ

Passport examiner won't be able to do anything to help. He or she has no authority to register children as British citizens, and since the children aren't British, the passport application has to be refused.

Children need to be registered as British citizens with the Home Office, application on form MN1. Once they have a Certificate of Registration as a British citizen, they can then apply for British passports.

Probably the best you could hope for from passport examiner would be to put passport applications on hold pending their registration as British citizens, however that may not happen - I've not heard of it being done before. But you could ask.

BritInParis

Not sure about Wellington specifically but it has been done elsewhere in the past albeit unofficially. Given Wellington's imminent closure they may not be able to do so anymore however as the process can take up to six months. Worst case scenario is the applications will be refused, the children are then registered under S.3(2) and reapply with their Certificates of Registration.

Robbo55

Thank you all once again for your expertise. As you can tell this is all very new territory for me. And as suggested the Passport Examiner is unable to assist me any further at this stage.

Among the few possible options available to me, one which I haven't really considered is whether or not I would be able to apply for a 'naturalisation certificate' especially considering I am currently living overseas.

I lived in the UK continuously from the age of 4 until about 24.

Does anyone know if this is possible?

If not I will go down the path of Section 3(2).

roaringmouse

Not sure what you're asking exactly. Are you asking if you can get proof of your British citizenship?

JAJ

You cannot be naturalised if you are already a British citizen by descent. Assuming you plan to remain in Australia, the standard option is section 3(2) registration which makes your children British citizens by descent.

If you were going to move to the United Kingdom, you could get them settlement visas and after 3 years (if still under 18) they could be registered as British citizens under section 3(5) of the Act. This gives British citizenship otherwise than by descent.

Once you're British by descent, either automatically or by registration, you can't "switch" to being British otherwise than by descent.