British Citizenship by Discretion (CBR post 1982)

Old Oct 20th 2023, 7:39 pm
  #196  
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Default Re: British Citizenship by Discretion (CBR post 1982)

Originally Posted by ChiTownViper
So it appears to me that individuals who apply with a UK born great-grandparent, and a "natural born British Subject" grandparent (born outside of the UK) would not qualify because they would not have attained the Right of Abode as defined by the Immigration Act of 1971 if their parent, and they themselves were also born in a foreign country. Assuming that the failure to acquire the ROA is the reason these applications for British Citizen status are denied, would there not be a claim for these individuals to be recognized as British Overseas Citizens? That was the status bestowed upon CUKCs without ROA by the BNA of 1981. If so, that should make them eligible to acquire a British Passport. They would still get the visa free access that a British passport provides, along with UK consular protection abroad while traveling. The only thing the would not have is the ability to travel to the UK without immigration controls, which doesn't seem like a big issue considering you can stay in the UK for up to 6 months without a visa. So unless you are looking to permanently move to the UK, seems like there is some value to being recognized as a BOC.
I am super curious to see how this all plays out. In my (100% non-lawyerly, or solicitorly) opinion, the BNA 1948 strongly suggests that registration of births in a foreign country's UK Consulate is as good as registration with the Secretary of State in the UK. If it is/was, then those who were (or could have been) registered were eligible for ROA as enacted. I am looking forward to hearing from those who have tried it!
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Old Oct 20th 2023, 10:05 pm
  #197  
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Default Re: British Citizenship by Discretion (CBR post 1982)

Originally Posted by carl_robson
I agree with you but also read parliamentary debates where they were very clear that Section 4L should not apply to those who would have become BOCs in 1983. The reason being that British Overseas Citizenship was always intended to be time limited in nature and cannot be passed to subsequent generations (save those who are stateless). Granting full British Citizenship to this group (and it would be huge if no generational limit/ROA requirement was applied) would also be a significant upgrade. While I hope they have a change of heart, it remains to be seen! The definition of historical legislative unfairness would suggest they could, but somebody very senior in the Home Office will need to take that call and there be the political will for it happen (my assumption). I shall report back when my friends hear on their applications (it’s been 14 months now).
Originally Posted by thepollyannasociety
I am super curious to see how this all plays out. In my (100% non-lawyerly, or solicitorly) opinion, the BNA 1948 strongly suggests that registration of births in a foreign country's UK Consulate is as good as registration with the Secretary of State in the UK. If it is/was, then those who were (or could have been) registered were eligible for ROA as enacted. I am looking forward to hearing from those who have tried it!
Indeed! I have navigated through two different citizenship procedures and currently hold three passports (US, Germany, and Poland) and I have never seen anything as complicated as British citizenship law! The entire concept of Right of Abode is one that I struggle with. One of my citizenship cases was very straight forward as I was born to a Polish parent in the United States. But Poland allows for indefinite transmission of citizenship by descent so I was able to easily acquire for myself and children. Then Germany took a stab a rectifying gender discrimination and after three years, I was able to be declared a German citizen because my grandmother could not pass to my father and therefore my father could not pass to me. Again, in their case, they truly addressed the issue (no limits on generations, all that mattered was that my father, myself and my children would have become citizens if women could pass it down). Now it looks like the UK is giving it a go, and if Right of Abode is the determining factor, they are off to a horrible start. Second class citizenship pure and simple. A certain subset of "citizens" can do something while others cannot? I am not impacted by this, it's moreso for my wife who has the UK lineage. I just think that it is funny they are trying to atone for historical legislative unfairness while basing the success of an application on a piece of legislation (Immigration Act of 1971) that was on it's face discriminatory! Based on what I've read, the main reason for that act was to prevent the immigration of "new" Commonwealth (read non-white)citizens! Truly laughable. I will take back everything I've said if those applications come back approved because that means that they truly understand what historical legislative unfairness means. But I also know, especially in today's world, things seem to be moving towards restricting access as opposed to opening it up.
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Old Oct 21st 2023, 8:53 am
  #198  
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Default Re: British Citizenship by Discretion (CBR post 1982)

Originally Posted by MOUK
My cousins attended their ceremony at the British embassy on Oct. 2nd, 40+ days from approval.

My sister and I are 8 months post application, and 6 months + 1 week post biometrics. Our enquiry was sent last week.
It has been 20 days since our enquiry was sent, and we haven't received anything yet. We're approaching 9 months since application, & 7 months since biometrics.

Everyone is anxiously waiting, even my mum and uncle, LOL.. All this started in May 2022 when we were notified that we are eligible.

The wait continues..
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Old Oct 21st 2023, 1:04 pm
  #199  
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Default Re: British Citizenship by Discretion (CBR post 1982)

Originally Posted by MOUK
It has been 20 days since our enquiry was sent, and we haven't received anything yet. We're approaching 9 months since application, & 7 months since biometrics.

Everyone is anxiously waiting, even my mum and uncle, LOL.. All this started in May 2022 when we were notified that we are eligible.

The wait continues..
I had the same timeline of 9/7 months as you when I was notified my app was successful. I emailed at the 6 month mark, a month later exactly I got a reply saying it was taking longer thank 6 months, blah blah, and then just over a week later I got the approval email. It's been about 6 weeks since and just waiting on the ceremony invite now.
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Old Oct 21st 2023, 1:24 pm
  #200  
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Default Re: British Citizenship by Discretion (CBR post 1982)

Originally Posted by Glassybell
I had the same timeline of 9/7 months as you when I was notified my app was successful. I emailed at the 6 month mark, a month later exactly I got a reply saying it was taking longer thank 6 months, blah blah, and then just over a week later I got the approval email. It's been about 6 weeks since and just waiting on the ceremony invite now.
Hi,

Yes I know. I paid close attention to your posts/timeline. I was thrilled when I read your good news.

I hope you get your invite very soon
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Old Oct 21st 2023, 4:09 pm
  #201  
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Default Re: British Citizenship by Discretion (CBR post 1982)

Originally Posted by MOUK
Hi,

Yes I know. I paid close attention to your posts/timeline. I was thrilled when I read your good news.

I hope you get your invite very soon
I will update when I do get it!
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Old Oct 23rd 2023, 12:46 pm
  #202  
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Default Re: British Citizenship by Discretion (CBR post 1982)

Hello,

We've received our approval letters earlier today in an email from Sable International.

It's been an emotional afternoon, we're so grateful.

To those of you waiting, hope you get your good news soon.
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Old Oct 27th 2023, 8:00 pm
  #203  
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Default Re: British Citizenship by Discretion (CBR post 1982)

My friends received their responses today - a definite no for applications tied to great grandmothers unfortunately (all born before 1983 and would have become BOCs if they’d descended from a male). At least we tried and their mother and uncle were successful in theirs!
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Old Oct 31st 2023, 4:30 pm
  #204  
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Default Re: British Citizenship by Discretion (CBR post 1982)

Originally Posted by carl_robson
My friends received their responses today - a definite no for applications tied to great grandmothers unfortunately (all born before 1983 and would have become BOCs if they’d descended from a male). At least we tried and their mother and uncle were successful in theirs!
Thank you for the update, sorry to hear it did not work out for your friends. I am curious, do you happen to know if the Right of Abode was the underlying issue? This would absolutely suggest that consular registration is not the same as registration in the UK.
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Old Oct 31st 2023, 4:45 pm
  #205  
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Default Re: British Citizenship by Discretion (CBR post 1982)

Yes, as they would have been BOCs, no right of abode was the issue. A shame as they were discriminated against but it seems the Home Office are content with that.
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Old Oct 31st 2023, 5:29 pm
  #206  
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Default Re: British Citizenship by Discretion (CBR post 1982)

Originally Posted by carl_robson
Yes, as they would have been BOCs, no right of abode was the issue. A shame as they were discriminated against but it seems the Home Office are content with that.
Just out of curiosity, do you know whether the Home Office accepted their payment? I am sorry to hear about their non-acceptance.
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Old Oct 31st 2023, 7:18 pm
  #207  
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Default Re: British Citizenship by Discretion (CBR post 1982)

Originally Posted by carl_robson
Yes, as they would have been BOCs, no right of abode was the issue. A shame as they were discriminated against but it seems the Home Office are content with that.
Very unfortunate. As for the omission in section 4L of a pathway to become a BOC, it looks like this has been picked up on by the ILPA and may ultimately be tested in the courts. After all, it seems the omission of such a clause was the result of a close vote in a sub-committee (I believe it was 9 (no) vs 7 (yes). As a result it wasn't included in the final bill. If tested, I don't see how it would stand up.
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Old Oct 31st 2023, 9:40 pm
  #208  
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Default Re: British Citizenship by Discretion (CBR post 1982)

thepollyannasociety their £80 was refunded.

ChiTownViper yes, there is hope, but I suspect there won’t be much demand to contest this in the courts due to the cost involved and the limited value of a BOC passport for many. We shall see!
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Old Nov 4th 2023, 5:41 am
  #209  
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Default Re: British Citizenship by Discretion (CBR post 1982)

If you renew a passport what's the best way of letting UK Visa & Immigration know? Do I just send a colour photocopy of the new passport in the snail mail to Liverpool together with the original document checklist and an explanatory cover letter?

My son has just successfully had his biometrics done on Thursday using a state government issued photo ID card instead of his passport as it's in the UK. UKVI also said on Thursday they will be putting his current passport back in the post in "at least 10 working days" + transit time on top of that.

The reason I am considering renewing my son's passport next week is because I don't trust the original passport to arrive back in time for his holiday on 9th December, whereas 95% of new Australian passports are being turned around in 10 business days from application. I called them and they said I need to complete a declaration form to explain the location of the current passport in the UK. But it didn't sound a big deal.
And besides, his current passport will expire next year anyway, so I am doing it a few months earlier.

I just want to do it in a way that it doesn't cause my son's UK citizenship application to get unexpectedly cancelled. Thanks.
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Old Nov 10th 2023, 10:21 am
  #210  
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Default Re: British Citizenship by Discretion (CBR post 1982)

Hello,

I've been reading through the posts, the examples in the Home Office publications (Registration as a British citizen in special circumstances) and I'm fairly confident I may have a claim to Citizenship following the change in the law. I'd really appreciate the opinion of anyone who knows anything about my scenario, please. Currently I'm living in the UK on an Ancestry visa (going into year 3 shortly). I have no dependents on my ancestry visa as my children (both adults now) are both already British & living in England (their father is British, he was born in Northern Ireland). This is all probably less relevant in any case.

I was born in South Africa on 22nd January 1983.
My mother is a British Citizen, born in Umtali, Rhodesia on 1st March 1962 (I'm not sure what regulation applies but she's a British Citizen),
My maternal grandmother was born in Brighton, England on 13th August 1934 to British parents (both born in England),
My maternal grandfather was born in Birmingham, England on 7th July 1933 to British parents (both born in England),
My maternal grandparents were married in Southern Rhodesia on the 8th December 1959.

My father is South African, born in South Africa in 1957 to parents who were also both born in South Africa.

Is anyone able to provide further guidance (I think I have a rough idea from previous posts, just looking for absolute confirmation before I start the application process).

Thank you so much!
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