American wanting to move to UK
May 13th 2008, 11:10 pm
#16
Retired
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 34,649
Re: American wanting to move to UK
Re the other EU state thing - I know that if you as an American go to live and work in The Netherlands, you will instantly be granted the same rights to live and work as your UK citizen husband. I don't know about other EU states as I have only worked there, but I know that it was a bone of contention for a lot of UKCs with USC spouses that they couldn't just walk into their 'own country' with their spouses but they could walk into another EU state and live and work freely. Of course that doesn't help with getting UK citizenship for yourself, but if you want to go over without all the hassle it's interesting.
And not only does it mean you cannot get British citizenship, in most EU states there is no simple way to become a citizen unless married to a citizen of that country.
Despite the fuss that many make over the U.K. Immigration Rules, it is rare for a genuine couple to be refused a visa.
May 14th 2008, 2:36 am
#17
Forum Regular
Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2007
Location: Arizona
Posts: 59
Re: American wanting to move to UK
You can't just "walk into" another EU state and live there freely. You still have to prove that your relationship is a genuine one and not one of convenience.
And not only does it mean you cannot get British citizenship, in most EU states there is no simple way to become a citizen unless married to a citizen of that country.
Despite the fuss that many make over the U.K. Immigration Rules, it is rare for a genuine couple to be refused a visa.
And not only does it mean you cannot get British citizenship, in most EU states there is no simple way to become a citizen unless married to a citizen of that country.
Despite the fuss that many make over the U.K. Immigration Rules, it is rare for a genuine couple to be refused a visa.
Married 8 years in Aug...and they will see that when I show our marriage cert lol!
May 14th 2008, 2:49 am
#18
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 6,848
Re: American wanting to move to UK
I forgot to add to my previous post, try an international recruitment agency. One very well known agency (with offices in the US and UK) is Michael Page:
http://www.michaelpage.co.uk/
Good Luck!
http://www.michaelpage.co.uk/
Good Luck!
May 14th 2008, 10:17 am
#19
Just Joined
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 6
Re: American wanting to move to UK
Hello,
My husband and i are graduates and we have twin sons (4 y) we have lived in London and moved from there to near to Edinburgh for a better quality of life.
Edinburgh recently came top of a British survey to find the best place to live in the UK. Lots of americans live here as it is very desirable. Wages are high, my husband earns £100k but property is very expensive in the good areas of Ed. but if you are prepared to live a bit out as we do it gets a lot more reasonable, but then you have to be prepared to do without the city type conveniences, like good coffee!
I know everyones goes on about it but the weather is an issue for many. The summer is short temps above 20 really only for 12 weeks. And the winter is long with very short days in midwinter (ie gets dark at 3.45 in the afternoon)! Which can be depressing.
But is quiet, safe, cultured, attractive place to live. Much less crowded, congested and frenetic than London. There are less jobs here but then there are less people than in London. In the summer it must be one of the best cities in the world. In the winter ....well its easy to fly to Europe or elsewhere for a holiday!!
Good luck.
My husband and i are graduates and we have twin sons (4 y) we have lived in London and moved from there to near to Edinburgh for a better quality of life.
Edinburgh recently came top of a British survey to find the best place to live in the UK. Lots of americans live here as it is very desirable. Wages are high, my husband earns £100k but property is very expensive in the good areas of Ed. but if you are prepared to live a bit out as we do it gets a lot more reasonable, but then you have to be prepared to do without the city type conveniences, like good coffee!
I know everyones goes on about it but the weather is an issue for many. The summer is short temps above 20 really only for 12 weeks. And the winter is long with very short days in midwinter (ie gets dark at 3.45 in the afternoon)! Which can be depressing.
But is quiet, safe, cultured, attractive place to live. Much less crowded, congested and frenetic than London. There are less jobs here but then there are less people than in London. In the summer it must be one of the best cities in the world. In the winter ....well its easy to fly to Europe or elsewhere for a holiday!!
Good luck.
May 14th 2008, 11:41 am
#20
Forum Regular
Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2007
Location: Arizona
Posts: 59
Re: American wanting to move to UK
[QUOTE=Englishmum;6347325]I forgot to add to my previous post, try an international recruitment agency. One very well known agency (with offices in the US and UK) is Michael Page:
http://www.michaelpage.co.uk/
Good Luck
Joined: Jan 2008
Location: Lake County IL
Posts: 1,953
Re: American wanting to move to UK
You can't just "walk into" another EU state and live there freely. You still have to prove that your relationship is a genuine one and not one of convenience.
And not only does it mean you cannot get British citizenship, in most EU states there is no simple way to become a citizen unless married to a citizen of that country.
Despite the fuss that many make over the U.K. Immigration Rules, it is rare for a genuine couple to be refused a visa.
And not only does it mean you cannot get British citizenship, in most EU states there is no simple way to become a citizen unless married to a citizen of that country.
Despite the fuss that many make over the U.K. Immigration Rules, it is rare for a genuine couple to be refused a visa.
In NL you can get citizenship after 5 years of lawful residence. The only reason I didn't get it before leaving was the cost.
I am excited to say the least and just want to see outside the US for a change...
May 14th 2008, 10:13 pm
#24
Retired
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 34,649
Re: American wanting to move to UK
I didn't mean literally 'walk in' but as the spouse of an EU citizen you aren't required to show the same level of assets/sponsorship etc to live together in The Netherlands as you would as a UKC returning to the UK with your non-EU spouse. A non-EU spouse is treated the same as the EU spouse for purposes of work and residence.
In the latter case, where the couple is living outside the EEA, the U.K. is imposing the full asset/sponsorship test.
Some states are going further, eg Ireland is refusing residence applications outright, where one partner is an EEA citizen, and they are not living in another EEA state.
In NL you can get citizenship after 5 years of lawful residence. The only reason I didn't get it before leaving was the cost.
There are also language tests etc for becoming Dutch.
Some EEA states, such as Denmark and Germany, are even harder to get citizenship in.
In the U.K. if you sponsor under the EEA rules (if the option is there), there is a delay in getting Permanent Residence, which in turn pushes back eligibility for naturalisation by 2 years, compared to the timescale on the normal U.K. immigration rules.
May 16th 2008, 9:35 pm
#25
Forum Regular
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 93
Re: American wanting to move to UK
No....you aren't insane......but you really, really need to think things through before making the leap.
Have you ever visited the UK? If not, I would first plan at least a 2 week trip here to check things out. Also, don't plan to just move here and find a job right off, no matter your education level. Either line a job up before you make the move or have enough savings to support yourselves for at least 6 months and preferably for a year.
Things that are different here than in the US:
Privacy.....in the States you often seem to have more of it. Here in the UK most houses are attached to one another, your back gardens are tiny and your front room sits right on the street.
You say you love rain and clouds, but will you love it for weeks and even months on end? Damp is a huge problem here. It creeps into your walls and sets up shop. It's a constant battle fighting it. It get's dark here at 3:30 or 4 o'clock in the winter. SAD is serious over here. ....last year summer lasted one week. It was from the lst week in April until about the 2nd of May. It was early and then it was gone. Luckily this year things seem a bit better and we have had lovely weather for about 2 weeks now. It damn sure took long enough getting here.
Grocery stores......they are different than the US ones. They aren't bad........just different.
Clothes............more expensive over here and not usually the quality you will find at Macy's in the States.
Don't take my post the wrong way......I concetrated on some negatives.....there's loads of positive things about living here. The people are wonderful. I love walking to the village to shop. I love the views of the hills and valleys of Wales where I now live......the pubs are great and the beer is even better.
I say if you're young enough and can swing it financially and not have too many expectations already formed about what it's going to be like then go for it. It's the chance of the lifetime.
Have you ever visited the UK? If not, I would first plan at least a 2 week trip here to check things out. Also, don't plan to just move here and find a job right off, no matter your education level. Either line a job up before you make the move or have enough savings to support yourselves for at least 6 months and preferably for a year.
Things that are different here than in the US:
Privacy.....in the States you often seem to have more of it. Here in the UK most houses are attached to one another, your back gardens are tiny and your front room sits right on the street.
You say you love rain and clouds, but will you love it for weeks and even months on end? Damp is a huge problem here. It creeps into your walls and sets up shop. It's a constant battle fighting it. It get's dark here at 3:30 or 4 o'clock in the winter. SAD is serious over here. ....last year summer lasted one week. It was from the lst week in April until about the 2nd of May. It was early and then it was gone. Luckily this year things seem a bit better and we have had lovely weather for about 2 weeks now. It damn sure took long enough getting here.
Grocery stores......they are different than the US ones. They aren't bad........just different.
Clothes............more expensive over here and not usually the quality you will find at Macy's in the States.
Don't take my post the wrong way......I concetrated on some negatives.....there's loads of positive things about living here. The people are wonderful. I love walking to the village to shop. I love the views of the hills and valleys of Wales where I now live......the pubs are great and the beer is even better.
I say if you're young enough and can swing it financially and not have too many expectations already formed about what it's going to be like then go for it. It's the chance of the lifetime.
I'm American myself (from California) and wanting a change, like you, I moved here to Northern England 3 years ago to live with and marry my wife. Since taking that huge leap and grabbing the bull by the horns (which is very much unlike me), I've observed life here in general, and I've found that after 3 years I miss the US so much, that I literally can't wait to move back and am driving my wife crazy.
You really need to take some time to think over such a decision. If it helps, I'll list some of my personal observations that have affected me the most about moving from the US to the UK.
Weather: If you're used to the wide open, windows rolled down, sunny spaces of Arizona, it will be a massive shock to your system when you land in the sunless lands of Northern England and Scotland. I'm not using alliteration either when I say "sunless". It's not unusual to go months (even 6 months some years) without a break in the cloud cover. You really can't fathom either the affect it has on you and your mood when you literally don't see a ray of sunshine for 60, 90, or even more days in a row. Especially if you're used to the opposite.
As Scout said, last year we had about a week of sunshine in the summer (it was still fairly cold though if I remember correctly) and then another long string of clouds and rain. Everything looks grey all the time, it's always damp, and always cold.
Privacy: Unless you luck out and find a nice rural property, your house will be overlooked and you will overlook others. So much so that, and I'm not a very nosey person, you find yourself getting into the habit of looking at the window into other people's windows or gardens; and them into yours. Again, that'd be quite a shock to the wide spaces of Arizona. On a related note, because it's so dense, even in small villages, you're always hearing people noise from outside (in our case, as they walk past our house as well as noisy neighbours on all sides). Our village (which is a fairly middle-class one) also has a problem with vandalism from local kids who are either bored or neglected, but I guess you could get that anywhere.
Cost and convenience of living: Compared to the US (and even California as in my case, but especially Arizona), the cost of living in the UK will throw you for a loop. Everything, and I mean everything, here is at least 2, and sometimes 3, times the cost it would be in the US, even gasoline. Also, compared to what I'm used to from California (24 hour grocery stores and gas stations on every corner), it can be hard shopping because some shops close up fairly early and, especially if you live in a village or town, you will have to travel in pretty horrendous traffic most of the time. It's not like in the US suburbs where you can pick up some fast food or do some emergency shopping at the grocery store right around the corner at odd hours of the day/night.
My wife and I have resorted to having a grocery store deliver our weekly groceries because it's such a mission going there and getting out in a timely fashion without stress. Of course, with deliveries, they often get part of the order wrong, but it's worth it to us.
Housing quality: This gripe of mine really isn't any fault of the country, but it still needs to be kept in mind. Having lived in a planned housing development my whole life in a quiet suburb, it was quite a shock moving into a 300 year old amalgalm of 3 different houses stuck together. It's a trip when you think about how old some of these houses are, and being made of stone, they are sturdy. But the interiors of such old houses always need updating and work done to them. I don't mind DIY and have been doing it for the last couple years to improve our home for sale, but if you or your husband are shy about getting your hands dirty, I'd think twice. Just yesterday for example, we had a pipe leak upstairs that flooded a downstairs room and having called a plumber, we found it was a radiator pipe that leaked from a lead patch that was put on God knows when. So now we have to replace the floor that was torn up to get to the pipe, and maybe the ceiling of the room that flooded. Most houses here are basically money pits in that once you fix one part of them, another one breaks.
Another thing to note is that gardens and yards here are small (such that my son can't realistically play in it unattended) and you're lucky if you have a driveway to put your car into, let alone a garage. I've never been a fan of parking cars on the street and that's been proven to me by how many times my wife's side mirrors have been broken off.
Britain herself: It's no secret that many people feel as if the land of Britain is losing her identity due to mass immigration and mass emigration. More and more foreigners are moving in and taking over cities as more and more British people are moving out. It's sad to see that the very fabric and identity of what it means to be British is being lost, and other people have mentioned on these boards that it just isn't the same Britain as it was in the 90s.
Anyway, those are the negatives and big differences from the states that I have noticed. Of course there are positives. The people are generally very nice, and mind their own business. The landscape is really beautiful with hills full of sheep and farms everywhere you look. The pubs that you can find on every street corner are a unique experience to Britain and great to hang out in once in a while. The TV and chocolate here is better (even though they lack a lot of the snack foods we love in the US).
All in all, I'm glad I took the chance to move here and experience it firsthand, but I can't wait until I get back to California and don't think I'll ever come back to the UK, at least not for any great length of time. To me, it is inferior in just too many important ways to the US and the standard of living we enjoy there.
So naturally my advice would be to stay where you are if you're happy, but if you do have that itch to experience life here, by all means, take a few months and live here. If you like it stay, if not, you can always go back and be satisfied that you experienced it here. I wouldn't make any radical life changes though or permanent immigration plans.
May 16th 2008, 10:23 pm
#26
Forum Regular
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 39
Re: American wanting to move to UK
What a great post from the guy from California that moved to the UK. I am the opposite. I am originally from the UK and now live in California, San Jose to be exact. I moved about 15 years ago, have a large house, pool, flexible job, kids and am happy as can be. My family are not here, but I wouldn't trade this for a life back there for the reasons mentioned and more. The everyday living is what counts, and here I don't feel trapped. In the UK, I recollect just doing what I needed to do to get from day to day. Here I have a life and I enjoy living it.
May 16th 2008, 10:40 pm
#27
Forum Regular
Joined: Feb 2008
Location: Winchelsea, Victoria
Posts: 70
Re: American wanting to move to UK
This is a great post and I agree with all of it, but will add my personal experience.
I'm American myself (from California) and wanting a change, like you, I moved here to Northern England 3 years ago to live with and marry my wife. Since taking that huge leap and grabbing the bull by the horns (which is very much unlike me), I've observed life here in general, and I've found that after 3 years I miss the US so much, that I literally can't wait to move back and am driving my wife crazy.
You really need to take some time to think over such a decision. If it helps, I'll list some of my personal observations that have affected me the most about moving from the US to the UK.
Weather: If you're used to the wide open, windows rolled down, sunny spaces of Arizona, it will be a massive shock to your system when you land in the sunless lands of Northern England and Scotland. I'm not using alliteration either when I say "sunless". It's not unusual to go months (even 6 months some years) without a break in the cloud cover. You really can't fathom either the affect it has on you and your mood when you literally don't see a ray of sunshine for 60, 90, or even more days in a row. Especially if you're used to the opposite.
As Scout said, last year we had about a week of sunshine in the summer (it was still fairly cold though if I remember correctly) and then another long string of clouds and rain. Everything looks grey all the time, it's always damp, and always cold.
Privacy: Unless you luck out and find a nice rural property, your house will be overlooked and you will overlook others. So much so that, and I'm not a very nosey person, you find yourself getting into the habit of looking at the window into other people's windows or gardens; and them into yours. Again, that'd be quite a shock to the wide spaces of Arizona. On a related note, because it's so dense, even in small villages, you're always hearing people noise from outside (in our case, as they walk past our house as well as noisy neighbours on all sides). Our village (which is a fairly middle-class one) also has a problem with vandalism from local kids who are either bored or neglected, but I guess you could get that anywhere.
Cost and convenience of living: Compared to the US (and even California as in my case, but especially Arizona), the cost of living in the UK will throw you for a loop. Everything, and I mean everything, here is at least 2, and sometimes 3, times the cost it would be in the US, even gasoline. Also, compared to what I'm used to from California (24 hour grocery stores and gas stations on every corner), it can be hard shopping because some shops close up fairly early and, especially if you live in a village or town, you will have to travel in pretty horrendous traffic most of the time. It's not like in the US suburbs where you can pick up some fast food or do some emergency shopping at the grocery store right around the corner at odd hours of the day/night.
My wife and I have resorted to having a grocery store deliver our weekly groceries because it's such a mission going there and getting out in a timely fashion without stress. Of course, with deliveries, they often get part of the order wrong, but it's worth it to us.
Housing quality: This gripe of mine really isn't any fault of the country, but it still needs to be kept in mind. Having lived in a planned housing development my whole life in a quiet suburb, it was quite a shock moving into a 300 year old amalgalm of 3 different houses stuck together. It's a trip when you think about how old some of these houses are, and being made of stone, they are sturdy. But the interiors of such old houses always need updating and work done to them. I don't mind DIY and have been doing it for the last couple years to improve our home for sale, but if you or your husband are shy about getting your hands dirty, I'd think twice. Just yesterday for example, we had a pipe leak upstairs that flooded a downstairs room and having called a plumber, we found it was a radiator pipe that leaked from a lead patch that was put on God knows when. So now we have to replace the floor that was torn up to get to the pipe, and maybe the ceiling of the room that flooded. Most houses here are basically money pits in that once you fix one part of them, another one breaks.
Another thing to note is that gardens and yards here are small (such that my son can't realistically play in it unattended) and you're lucky if you have a driveway to put your car into, let alone a garage. I've never been a fan of parking cars on the street and that's been proven to me by how many times my wife's side mirrors have been broken off.
Britain herself: It's no secret that many people feel as if the land of Britain is losing her identity due to mass immigration and mass emigration. More and more foreigners are moving in and taking over cities as more and more British people are moving out. It's sad to see that the very fabric and identity of what it means to be British is being lost, and other people have mentioned on these boards that it just isn't the same Britain as it was in the 90s.
Anyway, those are the negatives and big differences from the states that I have noticed. Of course there are positives. The people are generally very nice, and mind their own business. The landscape is really beautiful with hills full of sheep and farms everywhere you look. The pubs that you can find on every street corner are a unique experience to Britain and great to hang out in once in a while. The TV and chocolate here is better (even though they lack a lot of the snack foods we love in the US).
All in all, I'm glad I took the chance to move here and experience it firsthand, but I can't wait until I get back to California and don't think I'll ever come back to the UK, at least not for any great length of time. To me, it is inferior in just too many important ways to the US and the standard of living we enjoy there.
So naturally my advice would be to stay where you are if you're happy, but if you do have that itch to experience life here, by all means, take a few months and live here. If you like it stay, if not, you can always go back and be satisfied that you experienced it here. I wouldn't make any radical life changes though or permanent immigration plans.
I'm American myself (from California) and wanting a change, like you, I moved here to Northern England 3 years ago to live with and marry my wife. Since taking that huge leap and grabbing the bull by the horns (which is very much unlike me), I've observed life here in general, and I've found that after 3 years I miss the US so much, that I literally can't wait to move back and am driving my wife crazy.
You really need to take some time to think over such a decision. If it helps, I'll list some of my personal observations that have affected me the most about moving from the US to the UK.
Weather: If you're used to the wide open, windows rolled down, sunny spaces of Arizona, it will be a massive shock to your system when you land in the sunless lands of Northern England and Scotland. I'm not using alliteration either when I say "sunless". It's not unusual to go months (even 6 months some years) without a break in the cloud cover. You really can't fathom either the affect it has on you and your mood when you literally don't see a ray of sunshine for 60, 90, or even more days in a row. Especially if you're used to the opposite.
As Scout said, last year we had about a week of sunshine in the summer (it was still fairly cold though if I remember correctly) and then another long string of clouds and rain. Everything looks grey all the time, it's always damp, and always cold.
Privacy: Unless you luck out and find a nice rural property, your house will be overlooked and you will overlook others. So much so that, and I'm not a very nosey person, you find yourself getting into the habit of looking at the window into other people's windows or gardens; and them into yours. Again, that'd be quite a shock to the wide spaces of Arizona. On a related note, because it's so dense, even in small villages, you're always hearing people noise from outside (in our case, as they walk past our house as well as noisy neighbours on all sides). Our village (which is a fairly middle-class one) also has a problem with vandalism from local kids who are either bored or neglected, but I guess you could get that anywhere.
Cost and convenience of living: Compared to the US (and even California as in my case, but especially Arizona), the cost of living in the UK will throw you for a loop. Everything, and I mean everything, here is at least 2, and sometimes 3, times the cost it would be in the US, even gasoline. Also, compared to what I'm used to from California (24 hour grocery stores and gas stations on every corner), it can be hard shopping because some shops close up fairly early and, especially if you live in a village or town, you will have to travel in pretty horrendous traffic most of the time. It's not like in the US suburbs where you can pick up some fast food or do some emergency shopping at the grocery store right around the corner at odd hours of the day/night.
My wife and I have resorted to having a grocery store deliver our weekly groceries because it's such a mission going there and getting out in a timely fashion without stress. Of course, with deliveries, they often get part of the order wrong, but it's worth it to us.
Housing quality: This gripe of mine really isn't any fault of the country, but it still needs to be kept in mind. Having lived in a planned housing development my whole life in a quiet suburb, it was quite a shock moving into a 300 year old amalgalm of 3 different houses stuck together. It's a trip when you think about how old some of these houses are, and being made of stone, they are sturdy. But the interiors of such old houses always need updating and work done to them. I don't mind DIY and have been doing it for the last couple years to improve our home for sale, but if you or your husband are shy about getting your hands dirty, I'd think twice. Just yesterday for example, we had a pipe leak upstairs that flooded a downstairs room and having called a plumber, we found it was a radiator pipe that leaked from a lead patch that was put on God knows when. So now we have to replace the floor that was torn up to get to the pipe, and maybe the ceiling of the room that flooded. Most houses here are basically money pits in that once you fix one part of them, another one breaks.
Another thing to note is that gardens and yards here are small (such that my son can't realistically play in it unattended) and you're lucky if you have a driveway to put your car into, let alone a garage. I've never been a fan of parking cars on the street and that's been proven to me by how many times my wife's side mirrors have been broken off.
Britain herself: It's no secret that many people feel as if the land of Britain is losing her identity due to mass immigration and mass emigration. More and more foreigners are moving in and taking over cities as more and more British people are moving out. It's sad to see that the very fabric and identity of what it means to be British is being lost, and other people have mentioned on these boards that it just isn't the same Britain as it was in the 90s.
Anyway, those are the negatives and big differences from the states that I have noticed. Of course there are positives. The people are generally very nice, and mind their own business. The landscape is really beautiful with hills full of sheep and farms everywhere you look. The pubs that you can find on every street corner are a unique experience to Britain and great to hang out in once in a while. The TV and chocolate here is better (even though they lack a lot of the snack foods we love in the US).
All in all, I'm glad I took the chance to move here and experience it firsthand, but I can't wait until I get back to California and don't think I'll ever come back to the UK, at least not for any great length of time. To me, it is inferior in just too many important ways to the US and the standard of living we enjoy there.
So naturally my advice would be to stay where you are if you're happy, but if you do have that itch to experience life here, by all means, take a few months and live here. If you like it stay, if not, you can always go back and be satisfied that you experienced it here. I wouldn't make any radical life changes though or permanent immigration plans.
So in the 3 years since I left the north of England, climate change has had such a massive effect that the area doesn't get any sunshine for at least 3 months. Certainly not the north of England I can remember. Currently, where I live in Victoria, it's pissing down with rain, and quite cold and cloudy. Doesn't make me feel unhappy.
So all those 24 hour supermarkets that I remember have started to shut earlier. Same for the little Spar shops that stayed open till about 10 pm. Things have changed since I lived there. Traffic horrendous after shops have shut after 6 pm. Are you sure about that?
As regards immigration, it's a bit funny to hear a comment on British immigration changing the fabric of society from someone who comes from California. Correct me if i'm wrong, but hasn't recent Hispanic immigration into California not had an effect there. Isn't Spanish as widely spoken there as English? Again correct me if I'm wrong.
May 16th 2008, 10:49 pm
#28
SUPER MODERATOR
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 88,016
Re: American wanting to move to UK
This is a great post and I agree with all of it, but will add my personal experience.
I'm American myself (from California) and wanting a change, like you, I moved here to Northern England 3 years ago to live with and marry my wife. Since taking that huge leap and grabbing the bull by the horns (which is very much unlike me), I've observed life here in general, and I've found that after 3 years I miss the US so much, that I literally can't wait to move back and am driving my wife crazy.
You really need to take some time to think over such a decision. If it helps, I'll list some of my personal observations that have affected me the most about moving from the US to the UK.
Weather: If you're used to the wide open, windows rolled down, sunny spaces of Arizona, it will be a massive shock to your system when you land in the sunless lands of Northern England and Scotland. I'm not using alliteration either when I say "sunless". It's not unusual to go months (even 6 months some years) without a break in the cloud cover. You really can't fathom either the affect it has on you and your mood when you literally don't see a ray of sunshine for 60, 90, or even more days in a row. Especially if you're used to the opposite.
As Scout said, last year we had about a week of sunshine in the summer (it was still fairly cold though if I remember correctly) and then another long string of clouds and rain. Everything looks grey all the time, it's always damp, and always cold.
Privacy: Unless you luck out and find a nice rural property, your house will be overlooked and you will overlook others. So much so that, and I'm not a very nosey person, you find yourself getting into the habit of looking at the window into other people's windows or gardens; and them into yours. Again, that'd be quite a shock to the wide spaces of Arizona. On a related note, because it's so dense, even in small villages, you're always hearing people noise from outside (in our case, as they walk past our house as well as noisy neighbours on all sides). Our village (which is a fairly middle-class one) also has a problem with vandalism from local kids who are either bored or neglected, but I guess you could get that anywhere.
Cost and convenience of living: Compared to the US (and even California as in my case, but especially Arizona), the cost of living in the UK will throw you for a loop. Everything, and I mean everything, here is at least 2, and sometimes 3, times the cost it would be in the US, even gasoline. Also, compared to what I'm used to from California (24 hour grocery stores and gas stations on every corner), it can be hard shopping because some shops close up fairly early and, especially if you live in a village or town, you will have to travel in pretty horrendous traffic most of the time. It's not like in the US suburbs where you can pick up some fast food or do some emergency shopping at the grocery store right around the corner at odd hours of the day/night.
My wife and I have resorted to having a grocery store deliver our weekly groceries because it's such a mission going there and getting out in a timely fashion without stress. Of course, with deliveries, they often get part of the order wrong, but it's worth it to us.
Housing quality: This gripe of mine really isn't any fault of the country, but it still needs to be kept in mind. Having lived in a planned housing development my whole life in a quiet suburb, it was quite a shock moving into a 300 year old amalgalm of 3 different houses stuck together. It's a trip when you think about how old some of these houses are, and being made of stone, they are sturdy. But the interiors of such old houses always need updating and work done to them. I don't mind DIY and have been doing it for the last couple years to improve our home for sale, but if you or your husband are shy about getting your hands dirty, I'd think twice. Just yesterday for example, we had a pipe leak upstairs that flooded a downstairs room and having called a plumber, we found it was a radiator pipe that leaked from a lead patch that was put on God knows when. So now we have to replace the floor that was torn up to get to the pipe, and maybe the ceiling of the room that flooded. Most houses here are basically money pits in that once you fix one part of them, another one breaks.
Another thing to note is that gardens and yards here are small (such that my son can't realistically play in it unattended) and you're lucky if you have a driveway to put your car into, let alone a garage. I've never been a fan of parking cars on the street and that's been proven to me by how many times my wife's side mirrors have been broken off.
Britain herself: It's no secret that many people feel as if the land of Britain is losing her identity due to mass immigration and mass emigration. More and more foreigners are moving in and taking over cities as more and more British people are moving out. It's sad to see that the very fabric and identity of what it means to be British is being lost, and other people have mentioned on these boards that it just isn't the same Britain as it was in the 90s.
Anyway, those are the negatives and big differences from the states that I have noticed. Of course there are positives. The people are generally very nice, and mind their own business. The landscape is really beautiful with hills full of sheep and farms everywhere you look. The pubs that you can find on every street corner are a unique experience to Britain and great to hang out in once in a while. The TV and chocolate here is better (even though they lack a lot of the snack foods we love in the US).
All in all, I'm glad I took the chance to move here and experience it firsthand, but I can't wait until I get back to California and don't think I'll ever come back to the UK, at least not for any great length of time. To me, it is inferior in just too many important ways to the US and the standard of living we enjoy there.
So naturally my advice would be to stay where you are if you're happy, but if you do have that itch to experience life here, by all means, take a few months and live here. If you like it stay, if not, you can always go back and be satisfied that you experienced it here. I wouldn't make any radical life changes though or permanent immigration plans.
I'm American myself (from California) and wanting a change, like you, I moved here to Northern England 3 years ago to live with and marry my wife. Since taking that huge leap and grabbing the bull by the horns (which is very much unlike me), I've observed life here in general, and I've found that after 3 years I miss the US so much, that I literally can't wait to move back and am driving my wife crazy.
You really need to take some time to think over such a decision. If it helps, I'll list some of my personal observations that have affected me the most about moving from the US to the UK.
Weather: If you're used to the wide open, windows rolled down, sunny spaces of Arizona, it will be a massive shock to your system when you land in the sunless lands of Northern England and Scotland. I'm not using alliteration either when I say "sunless". It's not unusual to go months (even 6 months some years) without a break in the cloud cover. You really can't fathom either the affect it has on you and your mood when you literally don't see a ray of sunshine for 60, 90, or even more days in a row. Especially if you're used to the opposite.
As Scout said, last year we had about a week of sunshine in the summer (it was still fairly cold though if I remember correctly) and then another long string of clouds and rain. Everything looks grey all the time, it's always damp, and always cold.
Privacy: Unless you luck out and find a nice rural property, your house will be overlooked and you will overlook others. So much so that, and I'm not a very nosey person, you find yourself getting into the habit of looking at the window into other people's windows or gardens; and them into yours. Again, that'd be quite a shock to the wide spaces of Arizona. On a related note, because it's so dense, even in small villages, you're always hearing people noise from outside (in our case, as they walk past our house as well as noisy neighbours on all sides). Our village (which is a fairly middle-class one) also has a problem with vandalism from local kids who are either bored or neglected, but I guess you could get that anywhere.
Cost and convenience of living: Compared to the US (and even California as in my case, but especially Arizona), the cost of living in the UK will throw you for a loop. Everything, and I mean everything, here is at least 2, and sometimes 3, times the cost it would be in the US, even gasoline. Also, compared to what I'm used to from California (24 hour grocery stores and gas stations on every corner), it can be hard shopping because some shops close up fairly early and, especially if you live in a village or town, you will have to travel in pretty horrendous traffic most of the time. It's not like in the US suburbs where you can pick up some fast food or do some emergency shopping at the grocery store right around the corner at odd hours of the day/night.
My wife and I have resorted to having a grocery store deliver our weekly groceries because it's such a mission going there and getting out in a timely fashion without stress. Of course, with deliveries, they often get part of the order wrong, but it's worth it to us.
Housing quality: This gripe of mine really isn't any fault of the country, but it still needs to be kept in mind. Having lived in a planned housing development my whole life in a quiet suburb, it was quite a shock moving into a 300 year old amalgalm of 3 different houses stuck together. It's a trip when you think about how old some of these houses are, and being made of stone, they are sturdy. But the interiors of such old houses always need updating and work done to them. I don't mind DIY and have been doing it for the last couple years to improve our home for sale, but if you or your husband are shy about getting your hands dirty, I'd think twice. Just yesterday for example, we had a pipe leak upstairs that flooded a downstairs room and having called a plumber, we found it was a radiator pipe that leaked from a lead patch that was put on God knows when. So now we have to replace the floor that was torn up to get to the pipe, and maybe the ceiling of the room that flooded. Most houses here are basically money pits in that once you fix one part of them, another one breaks.
Another thing to note is that gardens and yards here are small (such that my son can't realistically play in it unattended) and you're lucky if you have a driveway to put your car into, let alone a garage. I've never been a fan of parking cars on the street and that's been proven to me by how many times my wife's side mirrors have been broken off.
Britain herself: It's no secret that many people feel as if the land of Britain is losing her identity due to mass immigration and mass emigration. More and more foreigners are moving in and taking over cities as more and more British people are moving out. It's sad to see that the very fabric and identity of what it means to be British is being lost, and other people have mentioned on these boards that it just isn't the same Britain as it was in the 90s.
Anyway, those are the negatives and big differences from the states that I have noticed. Of course there are positives. The people are generally very nice, and mind their own business. The landscape is really beautiful with hills full of sheep and farms everywhere you look. The pubs that you can find on every street corner are a unique experience to Britain and great to hang out in once in a while. The TV and chocolate here is better (even though they lack a lot of the snack foods we love in the US).
All in all, I'm glad I took the chance to move here and experience it firsthand, but I can't wait until I get back to California and don't think I'll ever come back to the UK, at least not for any great length of time. To me, it is inferior in just too many important ways to the US and the standard of living we enjoy there.
So naturally my advice would be to stay where you are if you're happy, but if you do have that itch to experience life here, by all means, take a few months and live here. If you like it stay, if not, you can always go back and be satisfied that you experienced it here. I wouldn't make any radical life changes though or permanent immigration plans.
I have never lived in an old house in the UK...the ones I've lived in certainly don't need constant maintenance...unlike the flimsy tinderboxes here in the US. I don't know where you lived but I've not had privacy problems you describe.
As for traffic and the time it takes to get from A to B...depending where you live in the US there may not be as much traffic congestion but you will most probably have much further to drive.
Like the above poster said...it's so funny when an immigrant complains about immigrants in their 'adopted' country.
Last edited by Jerseygirl; May 16th 2008 at 11:09 pm.
May 16th 2008, 11:07 pm
#29
Forum Regular
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 93
Re: American wanting to move to UK
This has got to be the funniest post I've read since being on British Expats.
So in the 3 years since I left the north of England, climate change has had such a massive effect that the area doesn't get any sunshine for at least 3 months. Certainly not the north of England I can remember. Currently, where I live in Victoria, it's pissing down with rain, and quite cold and cloudy. Doesn't make me feel unhappy.
So all those 24 hour supermarkets that I remember have started to shut earlier. Same for the little Spar shops that stayed open till about 10 pm. Things have changed since I lived there. Traffic horrendous after shops have shut after 6 pm. Are you sure about that?
As regards immigration, it's a bit funny to hear a comment on British immigration changing the fabric of society from someone who comes from California. Correct me if i'm wrong, but hasn't recent Hispanic immigration into California not had an effect there. Isn't Spanish as widely spoken there as English? Again correct me if I'm wrong.
So in the 3 years since I left the north of England, climate change has had such a massive effect that the area doesn't get any sunshine for at least 3 months. Certainly not the north of England I can remember. Currently, where I live in Victoria, it's pissing down with rain, and quite cold and cloudy. Doesn't make me feel unhappy.
So all those 24 hour supermarkets that I remember have started to shut earlier. Same for the little Spar shops that stayed open till about 10 pm. Things have changed since I lived there. Traffic horrendous after shops have shut after 6 pm. Are you sure about that?
As regards immigration, it's a bit funny to hear a comment on British immigration changing the fabric of society from someone who comes from California. Correct me if i'm wrong, but hasn't recent Hispanic immigration into California not had an effect there. Isn't Spanish as widely spoken there as English? Again correct me if I'm wrong.
Being a native of Northen England as you are, you'd be used to and maybe even prefer the dismal weather that is such a mainstay here, so don't mind it when you have the same in Victoria. For someone who is used to 300+ days of sunshine as I am, and as the OP is being from Arizona, the months of constant gray are very depressing. I'm sorry you can't remember the constant cloud cover, but I'm living here now and I don't think I'd react like a superstitious Aztec native praising the sun god every time the sun peeks out from behind a black cloud if it hasn't been almost constantly cloudy from December of '07 to the end of April of this year.
The only 24 hour supermarket here anywhere near my village (near Leeds) is Asda, but even then, they close at 4pm on Sundays. I didn't say there were no such thing as 24 hour supermarkets here, but I did say there wasn't one on every corner. Also, the only little village shop in walking distance here shuts at 7pm every night (sometimes earlier if the shopkeeper feels like it). From the drives my wife and I have taken to Leeds (about 15 miles from our village) to find a clothing store or to hit Ikea for furniture, at any time of day, the traffic is terrible. It's the effect you get when lots of people are all trying to go to the same, single shopping complex. No matter what time of day it is, since it's the only real shopping center for many miles of where we live, it's always a clusterF.
Additionally, I can comment on British immigration because I am an unbiased eye, and I am from California where I have seen first hand groups of immigrants taking over towns and cities. You're right that Southern California has a large hispanic community and it has had an effect. But again, I don't remember saying that Britain is the only place that has ever happened to. I just said it's something the OP should be aware of that cities like Bradford are almost completely populated by immigrants now. Such a thing is unravelling the thread of what it means to be "British". The difference between that and the hispanic population of California is that America has always been a melting pot like that. The US doesn't have it's own culture, but is rather a combination of every culture on the planet, therefore there is nothing really to dilute. Britain, and being British is definitely a unique culture that has lasted centuries but is now being diluted and spread all over the world.
May 16th 2008, 11:12 pm
#30
Forum Regular
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 93
Re: American wanting to move to UK
I suggest you read over that and the fact that "Some 58 per cent think the nation's cultural fabric is being "damaged and diluted" by immigration."
I'm not the only one who thinks that, clearly. And I want it known that I wasn't complaining about it, just making the OP aware that the Britain we fantasize about in the US isn't the Britain that exists today and is rapidly diminishing as 500 British citizens emigrate per day.
