lmartin999

Are you talking about White Rock? A real ethnic melting pot

My elderly parents always loved White Rock, it reminded them of England in the 1950s.

We could of course talk about being First Nation in Vancouver if we really want to get into racism

Almost Canadian

Didn't John Major come from a relatively shitty background.

In my experience, those that complain about their ability to "get on" on the basis that their accent, their colour, their height, the size of their arse, etc. are looking for reasons to justify the fact they are just not good enough. I was born in the early 1970s. I was taught at school not to be racist, sexist, fattist (failed that one, I simply hate morbidly obese fatties) etc.

I have never thought of anybody's competency to do anything other than on the basis of whether they can do it or not. I would imagine that most of my generation think likewise.

I have never felt that there was any form of ceiling on my ability to "get on" on the basis of my accent, lack of good background, etc. I have frequently asked those that post on this forum and complain about "class" in England to provide examples. To date, no one has been able to do. I invite them to do so now.

Again, in my experience, most of those that complain about the "class" issue in the UK are Volvo driving, Pringle sweater wearers, that feel aggrieved about the fact that their doctor, lawyer, head teacher of their kiddies' school, doesn't want to pop round to their house for Pimms and cucumber sandwiches. They are, usually, the most "classist" people you will ever meet.

dbd33

He genuinely ran away from a circus to join a bank.

Almost Canadian

OK, let's talk about it. Are you seriously suggesting that a First Nations doctor would have more difficulty in obtaining a position at the local hospital than a white "middle class" one? If so, why?

Or are you talking about the fact that some white "middle class" person may comment about having to remove another drunken First Nation from a seat on public transport. If so, why is the second one racist? Surely, it is simply a matter of someone commenting upon the rude behaviour of another person, or should First Nations be exempt from any criticism simply because they are First Nation?

JonboyE

It is rather nice but no, I was referring to the Lower Mainland in general.

We could, in fact we have at some length on this forum. It is not a very edifying subject.

JonboyE

There is more than a grain of truth in this.

I think not - but I have no proof other than what I have seen and heard around me so this is going to be a pointless discussion.

Have you really never been involved in recruitment, when one of the overriding requirement of a candidate is that they will "fit in" to the firm/organization?

Having said that I am quite prepared to accept that lack of achievement can come from within. There are things I did not achieve because I thought there was no point in trying. Maybe I could if I had sufficient determination. And, maybe these things get done in Canada because I don't perceive these barriers - whether they were real or not.

Almost Canadian

Jon, my post wasn't particularly aimed at you and I apologise if you feel that it was, that wasn't the intention.

The "fit" thing, though, IMHO, is a relevant consideration. I am sure that it would apply to a white male wishing to obtain employment as a waiter in an Indian restaurant in the UK.

I wouldn't want a tatooed (facial, for example), shaven headed women as a receptionist in a law firm, just as I am sure that a tatooist, wouldn't want a conservative, suited women as a receptionist. We all seem to accept that those with strangely coloured hair will work in Government.

JonboyE

In my street there are people born in England, Germany, Denmark, Czech Republic (now), Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Japan, Korea, Taiwan, Israel, Algeria and Quebec. There are a few Canadians as well.

JonboyE

I didn't take it as overly personal and no apology is necessary.

brizzle

- Diversity is about having a significant number of people from different backgrounds, cultures, ethnic backgrounds. If you have a town of 10,000 ethnically homogenous people and one person moves in, who is of a different background, does that make it a diverse place?

Diversity isn't necessarily about numbers, but it is a factor. Conversely, Vancouver's ethnic minorities are probably 90% S or SE Asian, who make up nearly 50% of the local population. Is that really diversity when 3 ethnic groups make up the vast majority? There certainly seem to be more Russians etc around now, but the ethnic minorities here remain firmly asian.

- We'll never agree on that point. The US I could agree on, but not here.

lmartin999

No, I wasn't suggesting this, and my comment was a little flippant and intended to be a little tongue in cheek. Perhaps not appropriate here. I am not an expert in this field - either in terms of history - or in terms of current research into equity, inclusion and racism (though I work with people who are). Broadly though I was referring to what might be labelled 'institutional racism'. There are some serious issues that still remain around poverty, exclusion, opportunity etc within aboriginal/First Nation communities. Some of these undoubtedly play out later in life in ways that might be seen as anti-social. Exempt from criticism - no? Some understanding of the context - yes.
In terms of personal examples - I recall hearing a lot of very 'racist' comments from white Canadians in Vancouver about First Nations people when I lived there. I think unfortunately it exists everywhere, but would like to think it is not widespread nor general in either the UK or Canada.

Interestingly, my own encounter with racism came in the UK (though I will of course not generalise from this). A drunk guy shouted some racist abuse at some teenagers riding past on bikes. For a number of obvious reasons it was a pretty nasty situation. I called the police and followed the guy until he was arrested. Follow-up was that my wife and I had to give evidence in court, where the guy was found guilty and fined. Before the event I thought it would feel rather satisfying to see justice be done - and doubtless it was the right thing. However, it came out that the guy had a serious alcohol problem that wasn't being well managed or treated, together with various other problems (all to do with substance abuse and poverty). He didn't even remember what he had done. Of course this doesn't excuse it in any way, but it just ended up being all a rather sad situation for a wider range of reasons than I first thought.

SambaDeAmigo

It is my experience, my opinion and my decision. If you are happy in the UK and I'm happy here in Canada, then that's all that matters. I don't need to convince anyone to move here. The OP asked for our opinions and I gave mine. I don't need analysis to show me reality.

SambaDeAmigo

So you are acknowledging that the UK is plagued with bad parents? If Jade Goody, Kerry Katona or Jordan are considered examples to many parents in the country, then yes I'd agree with that. I certainly don't see chavs around here.

JonboyE

But you can't simply lump everyone from South Asia into one ethnic group and everyone from East Asia into another. That is about as useful and accurate as categorizing everyone from Europe and the Middle East as an Ayrian/Arab ethnic group.

All I was trying to get across is that Vancouver is a very diverse place if you consider the number of nations and cultures represented here. It is not less diverse because many of the people look vaguely like each other. Nor does the fact that there are relatively few black people around mean that it cannot be a diverse place.

Almost Canadian

I am not suggesting anything. You were the one that said that the country is full of chavs. I asked who the parents of such chavs are. If they are everywhere, surely, the parents must be your neighbours?

Or do such chavs live elsewhere but, miraculously, descend into "respectable" neighbourhoods each evening, to return to their chavvie neighbourhoods at a later time?