Wells and water filters
Feb 29th 2008, 4:22 pm
#16
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Re: Wells and water filters
Filters are something like this..this one has two particulate filters and the silver UV at the end too; Generally they go on the house side of the pump/ pressure tank system, before any other treatment like UV or Water softener. They can be a bit smaller than these housings too..ours is about half the size and clear so you can see the filter element inside.
We initially tested every three months, then 6 monthly, but now we have the UV and a bit of a track record we feel secure in testing once a year or less.
Bottled watter is one of those envirnmental crimes nowadays isnt it?
AFAIK if you are boiling water to kill bacteria you have to have a rolling boil for a minute or so, just boiling it in the kettle is in-effective.
We initially tested every three months, then 6 monthly, but now we have the UV and a bit of a track record we feel secure in testing once a year or less.
Bottled watter is one of those envirnmental crimes nowadays isnt it?
AFAIK if you are boiling water to kill bacteria you have to have a rolling boil for a minute or so, just boiling it in the kettle is in-effective.
Last edited by iaink; Feb 29th 2008 at 4:31 pm.
Feb 29th 2008, 4:28 pm
#17
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Re: Wells and water filters
We have "safe" well water but to be honest we probably should have some sort of in-line treatment fitted as we do have iron bacteria problems, that supposedly don't do you any harm, but certainly add an offensive "rotton egg" odour to the water. We just don't have the spare cash to change anything yet.
Feb 29th 2008, 4:29 pm
#18
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Re: Wells and water filters
Doh - thanks very much Iain 
- now I feel like an idiot though
!!! I think I would have noticed one of those. So obviously have no filters then 
Oh well - less to worry about I guess.
- now I feel like an idiot though!!! I think I would have noticed one of those. So obviously have no filters then Oh well - less to worry about I guess.
Feb 29th 2008, 4:40 pm
#19
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Re: Wells and water filters
Most of the plumbing is relatively new, the tank (well-x-troll) and UV only being a couple of years old. Pressure switch is a Pumptrol Square D (also doesn't look all that old).
The water flows from the well is:
Well->pressure switch->tank->pressure gauge->UV
From what I can tell, when the pressure drops under 20psi, the switch trips off (I put the bath and sink taps on, flushed the toilet and that tripped it off). When I held the pressure switch contact/reset lever up, the pressure gauge showed about around 18 psi - but releasing the level wouldn't keep the contact.
I can't see a flow rating on the UV unit but do you think I can fix this by calibrating the switch (and what's the worst that can happen if I go too far one way or the other)?
The water flows from the well is:
Well->pressure switch->tank->pressure gauge->UV
From what I can tell, when the pressure drops under 20psi, the switch trips off (I put the bath and sink taps on, flushed the toilet and that tripped it off). When I held the pressure switch contact/reset lever up, the pressure gauge showed about around 18 psi - but releasing the level wouldn't keep the contact.
I can't see a flow rating on the UV unit but do you think I can fix this by calibrating the switch (and what's the worst that can happen if I go too far one way or the other)?
My pressure switch for the well pump basically has a high and low cut off screw. By trial and error we have it set to cut off when the tank pressure is ~80PSI, and to start to pump once its below ~20PSI. If you are running a lot of taps at once, then the pump will cycle a lot more frequently, but I dont see why it would cut out unless you are running the tank dry and the pump is one of those older non self priming unsubmerged ones that would need priming if that happened?
Feb 29th 2008, 4:54 pm
#20
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Re: Wells and water filters
So the pump is tripping OFF when the presure drops below a certain point?
That doesnt sound right. Sounds like it could be a duff switch, or perhaps the pump itself is creating a problem to cause it to trip out as it starts up?
You cant really do any harm by fiddling with the switch setting, just don't electrocute yourself...more often than not water pumps are 240V with two 120V phases and a common ground...check its dead before fiddling with it, and mark or measure the current positions before fiddling so you can reset them at the original level if necessary.
The only other thing I can think of is that maybe somehow you are able to drain the tank faster than the pump is able to fill it. Our submerged pump is rated at something like 20 gal / min, so it can fill the tank faster than we can empty it, if your pump cant keep up then there is probably something wrong with it?
We had a problem last year that vibration had worked one of the wires loose from its connection to the pressure switch and it has started to arc and eat away at its contact post in the switch...the pump would cut off abruptly as a result, but since I found and fixed that its been trouble free.
The pressure sensor on the UV thing is a red herring I think....Ive never heard of anything like that. They rate the UV units for the max flow rate anyway, so only a fool would install one not capable of dealing with the max expected usage. All that would happen if you somehow managed to exceed that is that your water would not be effectively treated (just like if you dont check and clean the lime buildup on the UV light element from time to time I guess..they dont last for ever and are about $100 to replace every year or two
)
That doesnt sound right. Sounds like it could be a duff switch, or perhaps the pump itself is creating a problem to cause it to trip out as it starts up?
You cant really do any harm by fiddling with the switch setting, just don't electrocute yourself...more often than not water pumps are 240V with two 120V phases and a common ground...check its dead before fiddling with it, and mark or measure the current positions before fiddling so you can reset them at the original level if necessary.
The only other thing I can think of is that maybe somehow you are able to drain the tank faster than the pump is able to fill it. Our submerged pump is rated at something like 20 gal / min, so it can fill the tank faster than we can empty it, if your pump cant keep up then there is probably something wrong with it?
We had a problem last year that vibration had worked one of the wires loose from its connection to the pressure switch and it has started to arc and eat away at its contact post in the switch...the pump would cut off abruptly as a result, but since I found and fixed that its been trouble free.
The pressure sensor on the UV thing is a red herring I think....Ive never heard of anything like that. They rate the UV units for the max flow rate anyway, so only a fool would install one not capable of dealing with the max expected usage. All that would happen if you somehow managed to exceed that is that your water would not be effectively treated (just like if you dont check and clean the lime buildup on the UV light element from time to time I guess..they dont last for ever and are about $100 to replace every year or two
)
Last edited by iaink; Feb 29th 2008 at 4:59 pm.
Feb 29th 2008, 5:02 pm
#21
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Re: Wells and water filters
Rather than test all the time, we get water from the supermarket for drinking fresh (have a cooler so can buy big bottles), but as we use the well water for hot (boiled) drinks and cooking, I guess I should be testing more. How frequently is good? Every 6 months? Yearly? We have no problem with rural contamination - no livestock close by. If we boil the water, does that kill any contaminents.
What a minefield
Survived for 3 years by being an ostrich - felt that shouldn't continue. Any comments, greatfully received...
What a minefield
Survived for 3 years by being an ostrich - felt that shouldn't continue. Any comments, greatfully received... 
Also there was much more bacteria in the water cooler dispensers. Having said that I do keep small bottles of water in for those visitors who turn their noses up at well water and for daughter who wont drink the water and I dont want her getting dehydrated.
Feb 29th 2008, 5:12 pm
#22
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Re: Wells and water filters
Maybe that's it - not enough pressure from the pump. I had the well rewired last year so, I suppose, out of all the components involved, the pump is the only part I don't know the history of. My neighbours tell me the well is deep, they said 250ft but no clue about the accuracy of that.
Still trying to get my head around all this but it seems when the demand exceeds the supply, instead of feeding what water is available to the system, the switch just cuts out (where's the logic in that?)
Still trying to get my head around all this but it seems when the demand exceeds the supply, instead of feeding what water is available to the system, the switch just cuts out (where's the logic in that?)
Feb 29th 2008, 5:19 pm
#23
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Re: Wells and water filters
Thought I read somewhere that the water in these bottles could be anything up to and over a year old Also there was much more bacteria in the water cooler dispensers.
Having said that I do keep small bottles of water in for those visitors who turn their noses up at well water and for daughter who wont drink the water and I dont want her getting dehydrated.
Also there was much more bacteria in the water cooler dispensers. Having said that I do keep small bottles of water in for those visitors who turn their noses up at well water and for daughter who wont drink the water and I dont want her getting dehydrated.
We pay a bit more for the water in the hopes that we've found a decent brand (I know this logic doesn't necessary work, but it does say its UV treated) - and keep the dispenser as clean as possible. It's only for family use so its not like all that bacteria you find around a school water fountain! If we didn't do this, I would only be happy to drink the unboiled well water if we tested it regularly. We don't - they've closed down the testing centre near us so would have to go into the city for the service - which means I would have to go into the city as hubby does't believe in worrying about anything remotely to do with bacteria. So this is our compromise... 
Feb 29th 2008, 5:19 pm
#24
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Re: Wells and water filters
I feel so lucky to have two properties with gorgeous healthy water coming out of the wells and not having to do anything to it. I had the water tested at one property because the previous owner was using large bottles of water. They found nothing wrong with it. It looks and tastes great. I personally do not like to use water from plastic bottles and prefer my children not to drink juices from plastic bottles. The water here contributes a lot to us being more healthy than we were in the UK.
There has been more Cryptosporidium found in mains water than in well water. UV only kills surface bacteria so not good for liquids. Most well water problems are caused by the well cap needing maintenance, rather than the water itself.
There has been more Cryptosporidium found in mains water than in well water. UV only kills surface bacteria so not good for liquids. Most well water problems are caused by the well cap needing maintenance, rather than the water itself.
Last edited by Paradisefound; Feb 29th 2008 at 6:13 pm.
Feb 29th 2008, 5:42 pm
#25
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Re: Wells and water filters
One 0:0 test in isolation proves nothing about a wells safety. Ours ran 0:0 for three years, then after a heavy rainfall started to fail for coliform.
If you have a well and no UV, then its in your own interest to test it periodically, or install a UV for peace of mind. It wont alter the water in anyway, other than irradiating anything living in it, and occasionally you will notice the cold water is warm if its been static for a while and you dont run the tap long enough.
If you have a well and no UV, then its in your own interest to test it periodically, or install a UV for peace of mind. It wont alter the water in anyway, other than irradiating anything living in it, and occasionally you will notice the cold water is warm if its been static for a while and you dont run the tap long enough.
Feb 29th 2008, 5:54 pm
#26
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Re: Wells and water filters
One 0:0 test in isolation proves nothing about a wells safety. Ours ran 0:0 for three years, then after a heavy rainfall started to fail for coliform.
If you have a well and no UV, then its in your own interest to test it periodically, or install a UV for peace of mind. It wont alter the water in anyway, other than irradiating anything living in it, and occasionally you will notice the cold water is warm if its been static for a while and you dont run the tap long enough.
If you have a well and no UV, then its in your own interest to test it periodically, or install a UV for peace of mind. It wont alter the water in anyway, other than irradiating anything living in it, and occasionally you will notice the cold water is warm if its been static for a while and you dont run the tap long enough.
Feb 29th 2008, 6:06 pm
#27
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Re: Wells and water filters
If your well is consistently testing 0/0 then UV is unnecessary, although I suppose its insurance against contamination / run off. We live with a cow pasture behind our house and have had run off problems occasionaly, the UV fixed that. Hopefully you are testing your water regularly through the health unit..its a free service and provides peace of mind. Having said that we dont do it all that often now that we have a level of confidence in our system.
Our water softener is a regular Sears / Kenmore type. I dont know if its significant on not but we actually have a dual septic system, with a live tank for the nasty stuff that needs digesting, and another system altogether for the grey water from the laundry, bath and the regeneration water from the softener. The effect on the septic isnt something that ever occured to me, but I would think a healthy septic system should be able to cope with the salt water discharge if you only have the one tank, but I dont really know. I suppose the danger is in flushing it completely with that relatively large volume of water.
My pressure switch for the well pump basically has a high and low cut off screw. By trial and error we have it set to cut off when the tank pressure is ~80PSI, and to start to pump once its below ~20PSI. If you are running a lot of taps at once, then the pump will cycle a lot more frequently, but I dont see why it would cut out unless you are running the tank dry and the pump is one of those older non self priming unsubmerged ones that would need priming if that happened?
Water logged pressure tanks are not uncommon and can lead to problems with excessive cycling. The tank works by filling against an air filled rubber bladder. As the bladder can lose air, which is then dissolved in the water, you end up with a tank full of water alone with little or no air to push against to provide the pressure for the system (what with liquids being uncompressable) There is usually a schrader valve (like a car valve) somewhere on the tank you can pump air through to refill the bladder and get a more normal cycle rate going again.
Some older cheaper tanks dont even have the bladder, the air is contained by the tank alone. These tend to be worse still as the air can dissolve in the water and they will need more frequent air fills...and also air + water + tank = rust
Our water softener is a regular Sears / Kenmore type. I dont know if its significant on not but we actually have a dual septic system, with a live tank for the nasty stuff that needs digesting, and another system altogether for the grey water from the laundry, bath and the regeneration water from the softener. The effect on the septic isnt something that ever occured to me, but I would think a healthy septic system should be able to cope with the salt water discharge if you only have the one tank, but I dont really know. I suppose the danger is in flushing it completely with that relatively large volume of water.
My pressure switch for the well pump basically has a high and low cut off screw. By trial and error we have it set to cut off when the tank pressure is ~80PSI, and to start to pump once its below ~20PSI. If you are running a lot of taps at once, then the pump will cycle a lot more frequently, but I dont see why it would cut out unless you are running the tank dry and the pump is one of those older non self priming unsubmerged ones that would need priming if that happened?
Water logged pressure tanks are not uncommon and can lead to problems with excessive cycling. The tank works by filling against an air filled rubber bladder. As the bladder can lose air, which is then dissolved in the water, you end up with a tank full of water alone with little or no air to push against to provide the pressure for the system (what with liquids being uncompressable) There is usually a schrader valve (like a car valve) somewhere on the tank you can pump air through to refill the bladder and get a more normal cycle rate going again.
Some older cheaper tanks dont even have the bladder, the air is contained by the tank alone. These tend to be worse still as the air can dissolve in the water and they will need more frequent air fills...and also air + water + tank = rust
Feb 29th 2008, 6:18 pm
#28
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Re: Wells and water filters
The filtration is there to protect the water softener really, and although the softener helps prevent mineral build up on the UV light, its really not all that necessary just for that...you would just have to clean the bulb more often. The UV wasnt why we got the softener...we just have hard water here.
Feb 29th 2008, 6:19 pm
#29
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Re: Wells and water filters
While on wells and filters and given you are in the Quinte region I am wondering if the information we have been given is correct and wonder if you would be kind enough to comment on that. That is to take care when purchasing a house with a well because "wells are drying up and that is why people are selling their houses". We are interested in purchasing a house in Prince Edward Country, thus the comments. Is there any way of knowing whether a well on any given property is 'good' or 'bad" i.e. could dry up. Do people have wells because of the impossibility of obtaining mains water or do they choose to go with a well for economy in some cases?
Feb 29th 2008, 6:21 pm
#30
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Re: Wells and water filters
The offer I put in on this house had a condition of "must pass water test". The water did not pass the first test (which was expected as the property had been vacant for some time), so the owner had a bottle of javex chucked down the well and fitted the UV filter for me (free of charge ).
).While on wells and filters and given you are in the Quinte region I am wondering if the information we have been given is correct and wonder if you would be kind enough to comment on that. That is to take care when purchasing a house with a well because "wells are drying up and that is why people are selling their houses". We are interested in purchasing a house in Prince Edward Country, thus the comments. Is there any way of knowing whether a well on any given property is 'good' or 'bad" i.e. could dry up. Do people have wells because of the impossibility of obtaining mains water or do they choose to go with a well for economy in some cases?