Transferring money limits
 

Hi everyone!
My partner and I moved to Vancouver in 2014 and got PR last summer. We're ready to buy our first apartment here but are confused by the rules for transferring money to our canadian bank accounts. His savings are sitting with his bank in the UK, mine are in my German bank account. I know there's this $10,000 limit when arriving in the country by air, but I haven't found any information as to what's allowed as a PR specifically.

I'm unable to find any information online besides the bank's responsibility to report any incoming or outgoing transactions over $10,000 to prevent fraud/crime/etc.

Does anyone have any experience with moving large chunks of money over here? We're hoping to use our savings for the down payment and want to cover our bases to make sure we're doing this all the legal way to avoid any questions later down the road.

Re: Transferring money limits
 

Hi

1. You can actually more than $10K when entering Canada, as long as you declare it to CBSA, there are no taxes or duties on money.
2. You can transfer as much as you want from overseas to Canada, the receiving institution does the reporting to FinTrac for you.
3. I assume that if you have more than $100K overseas, you have been reporting it on your Canadian income tax.

Re: Transferring money limits
 

I don't think there's any problem moving large chunks of money over. We shifted several hundred thousand without problem. Though I imagine CRA might ask if the money was generating income when it was in Germany and the UK, and if so, where was it reported on your previous tax returns...

Re: Transferring money limits
 

You have received good advice on this forum, to correct your misunderstanding. You have confused reporting of money movements with "limits" on moving money. You can move as much as you like - $millions if you have it, without restriction or taxes on the movement, but it will be reported to the government. If the money is yours and sourced from legitimate activity then you have nothing to worry about. In practice if you are moving money from the UK, Western Europe, Australia, or NZ then your money will be unlikely to have any shadow of suspicion over it.

The biggest mistake you can make at this stage is to start färting around with your money movements to try to evade the transfer reporting requirements because there is nothing more likely to provoke the customs and law enforcement agencies that monitor the proceeds of criminal activity than trying to avoid attracting their attention. To be bluntly clear: you will attract their attention, not avoid it, and the results may, at best, be a severe inconvenience to you - think "court hearings to get back control of your money". :eek:

Re: Transferring money limits
 

So it's better for us to move the money over in one big chunk rather than individual smaller transactions? Most if it is going straight into our TFSA anyway

Re: Transferring money limits
 

Yep!

Re: Transferring money limits
 

Yes, absolutely, without a shadow of a doubt.

I also recommend that you tell your bank ahead of the money arriving to expect it, the amount, where (country and bank) it is coming from, and where you got it e.g. sale of house, accumulated savings, etc.

That said, there is nothing wrong with breaking a transfer into a few large sums (larger than the reporting threshold) if you want to average out exchange rates over a few months.

Re: Transferring money limits
 

If i have a new account esp when its all handled using details i submitted, i often move some tiny sum first - proof of details/concept, then go for it.

Re: Transferring money limits
 

Strangely in some situations cash gets better rates, i once went from london to the caribbean with a large bundle of us dollars in cash to fund a house. Certainly added a frisson to the journey, but it was all declared and just a few simple forms had to be completed.

I needed us dollars, and the big fx brokers couldnt compete with the big cash fx providers [indians all] in london on rates. Amazing places, their vaults must be a real worry...

Re: Transferring money limits
 

:lol:
Chained to wrist accompanied by a couple of smart but burly chaps in shades?

Re: Transferring money limits
 

I would recommend against that these days, especially in the US and UK because of a law called "civil forfeiture" (I am not sure if there is a similar law in Canada, but it would surprise me if there isn't).

Basically, the customs or police can seize cash that they find and force you to go to court to prove that it is legally your money and that you got it by legal means. So you arrive in the country, you declare that you are carrying $100k, and get invited to discuss the money in a private office. The customs officers decide that you look shifty and relieve you of your $100k. :(

Another member of BE used to work as a police officer at Heathrow and confirms that such seizures actually took place. I know of cases in the US where money was seized under the US equivalent law.

Re: Transferring money limits
 

Hi


1. Yes CBSA can seize funds over $10K that are not declared on either entry or exit.

Re: Transferring money limits
 

No, 250k in their original us wrappings, in a carry on bag. I did get a few curious looks from passengers when it was examined but the airport staff seemed used to it.

However on other occasions i have carried bacon curing salt. Anonymous looking Plastic bags filled with white powder, i always expect x-ray or someone to ask me, but its never happened.

Re: Transferring money limits
 

Its easy and safe, just follow the rules and declare it, you just carry the proof, bank statements showing youve had the cash forever or sale notes on personal investments. HMRC will tell you what they would prefer to see. Its just money laundering compliance. NB if airport staff decide not to accept what is the command of HMRC they put themselves at risk of court action from you. Their actions take place in public or with colleagues. If you suffer financially by them depriving you when you have supplied the required proofs, or they make the mistake of talking about confiscation in public, they have defamed you, and they have acted beyond their lawful remit. Slander, if documented in public - libel, consequential losses, a few other things... My fx supplier kindly supplied a document on how to proceed and what evidence you need to cash in - in a number of countries... One gets the feeling theyve been there.

When the jobsworths lose which they will if you have been compliant, they will pay for your replacement flights, any fx losses, business losses, damages etc.

Re: Transferring money limits
 

On a related note - anyone hear about the ford explorer door handles?

American detectives found the kit to cast metal door handles in a drug bust. It appears one route for money laundering was to cast gold door handles and trins and export them on cars, when they arrested the villains, they admitted that some had got lost. All over columbia, there are now ford explorers with scratched door handles :-)

Re: Transferring money limits
 

No, no, and no. That is not how civil forfeiture works, and the very reason it is so unfair, that the police can cause you gross inconvenience, and potentially some costs too, for legal representation, is why some people are campaigning to change the law.

And to be clear, the law doesn't just apply at airports and sea ports. If the police find you walking down the street with a hold all full of cash they can take it under civil forfeiture. And customs can take it even if you are carrying documentation to "prove" it's source.

Re: Transferring money limits
 

you are discussing the 3rd world country of murica where i would not tread by choice, in more civilised countries, you win big time when the jobsworths screw up, but i see in murica things are improving? it is now not allowed without criminal convictions in several areas.

I always thought that the law in murica was about money, if you have it you can win, i guess if they take it off you they are improving their chances.

Re: Transferring money limits
 

Er, as I said above, the same law exists in the UK. And civil forfeiture does NOT require a conviction, the police, sheriff's deputies, US customs can more or less relieve anyone of cash they find them carrying.

But I don't think you understand what "civil forfeiture" means - it is NOT confiscation, removing the money permanently, which, yes, does require a conviction.

Civil forfeiture is only the "temporary" removal of the money - you just have to show up in court and provide a plausible explanation, with sufficient evidence, as to where the money came from and what you were doing with it. The argument being that an honest person will be able to provide such evidence, and a drug dealer or money launderer will scamper away into the shadows.

Re: Transferring money limits
 

Nope, its different, in the uk, i dont think civil collections relevant, its under POCA. There could be no civil collection unless its subsequent to collect say compensation for a victim , its a criminal matter, the police claiming your cash is a proceed of crime, which they have to have at least circumstantial evidence of for the holder. If they havent - they are in trouble themselves and they will be compensating you. Interestingly failure to disclose is itself an offence, so always do

Proceeds of Crime Act Money Laundering Offences: Legal Guidance: The Crown Prosecution Service

Re: Transferring money limits
 

You're still barking up the wrong tree. Proceeds of crime and civil forfeiture are entirely separate things.

Re: Transferring money limits
 

Nope - youre wrong - nothing civil about it, its poca

Woman Wins Appeal Over Seized Cash - Heart Sussex News

https://www.accountingweb.co.uk/busi...leaving-the-uk

Border Agency forced to hand back £700,000 seized from the luggage of billionaire who said the cash was 'peanuts' to him | Daily Mail Online

Re: Transferring money limits
 

So long as you don't transfer multiple amounts below the reporting limit there's really no reason to avoid multiple transactions. Now, if you send 50 payments of 9999 CAD each, then expect trouble for sure.

Re: Transferring money limits
 

Correct, more or less .... So long as the bank is aware that you will be transferring, say, C$500,000 there is likely no harm in breaking into whatever amount you like of C$10,000 (or equivalent in another currency), or more. But if you start sending say C$25,000 every week for several months at a stretch and haven't pre-informed your bank, the consequences might not be quite what you expected.

Re: Transferring money limits
 

Yes, I was wrong. :o Civil forfeiture appears to be largely a US phenomenon, and I can't see anything about pre-emptive seizures of cash, i.e. prior to a conviction (or in anticipation of a conviction) in the UK, other than at a port of entry.

Re: Transferring money limits
 

Really not true - I know about this as I've recently worked for one of the big 5 and have been involved with AML quite extensively. For payments of 10K or more, so long as there isn't some specific trigger - e.g. government agency request to monitor, politically exposed person, country of origin, no good explanation of source in the case the bank asks the client about it, large withdrawals in cash following the deposit, onward payments to other jurisdictions etc - your bank is very unlikely to do anything and, if they do, it will be limited to calling you up and asking what the source of the funds is. On the other hand, multiple payments over any period of just under 10K will make them much more interested as it will look like you're trying to avoid the 10K limit that causes the transaction to be logged with Fintrac.

On the government agency side, multiple payments of 10K or more over a period might trigger some activity but, so long as it tallies with what you've reported on your tax return (and T1135 if relevant) you'd be unlikely to ever hear about it - same applies to one off large transfers.

A few years ago this may all have been a bit different but, with the changes in the FX transfers market, it's now extremely common for people to make multiple smaller transfers (e.g. because of online transfer limits) rather than one large one. Albeit it's a small sample set, but I moved my UK assets to Canada two years back in multiple 25K GBP chunks, partly because that was the online transfer limit from by bank there but, also, because I wanted to average out the exchange rate, and have not heard a peep from the CRA, RCMP, CSIS or whoever. Having said that, all the assets involved had been carefully declared on my T1135 over multiple years so, if you've been less than scrupulous in that respect, your mileage may vary (but that would apply to a single large payment too).

Re: Transferring money limits
 

The problem is that the bank may or may not ask, and considering the amount of effort required to tell your bank that you will be sending them approximately $200,000 over the next three months, say from the sale of your home, I can't see any good reason not to tell them.

Otherwise your post is pretty good, just spoiled by three words.