Time off

Old Dec 17th 2006, 7:51 pm
  #16  
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Default Re: Time off

Originally Posted by tableland
Is it really the *only* factor in anyone's mind when contemplating moving? I am sure it is not. Most rational people will simply consider it as one factor along with many others. I would imagine they consider weather, culture, holiday entitlement, financial standard of living, employment opportunities, long-term viability of location and so on.
Vacation entiltlement is only one factor but it is a major one.There would be many benefits for me and my family to move to Canada but the vacation issue is a huge drawback.It`s not exactly a positive career move!
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Old Dec 17th 2006, 7:58 pm
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Default Re: Time off

Originally Posted by ben123
Vacation entiltlement is only one factor but it is a major one.There would be many benefits for me and my family to move to Canada but the vacation issue is a huge drawback.It`s not exactly a positive career move!
I agree. Canada has many positive factors, but this ain't one of them. Personally, I would not call cutting in half the time I could spend with my family an improvement in my lifestyle.
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Old Dec 17th 2006, 8:04 pm
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Default Re: Time off

Originally Posted by ben123
Vacation entiltlement is only one factor but it is a major one.There would be many benefits for me and my family to move to Canada but the vacation issue is a huge drawback.It`s not exactly a positive career move!

I can understand that but i suppose it depends on what kind of job you are looking for and what prospects there will be in the future. The same i suppose goes for Australia, you might get more holidays but hate the people you work with and find there is no room for promotion.
It is all a bit of a lottery i guess and only you can decide what you want to do in the end.
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Old Dec 17th 2006, 8:09 pm
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Default Re: Time off

Originally Posted by printer
I can understand that but i suppose it depends on what kind of job you are looking for and what prospects there will be in the future. The same i suppose goes for Australia, you might get more holidays but hate the people you work with and find there is no room for promotion.
It is all a bit of a lottery i guess and only you can decide what you want to do in the end.
It is a lottery - yes. Also I believe an immigrant's happiness is largely down to his job. Big or small holiday entitlement - if you hate the job you wil probably start hating the country. Must get a good job.
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Old Dec 17th 2006, 9:25 pm
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Default Re: Time off

Originally Posted by ben123
Vacation entiltlement is only one factor but it is a major one.There would be many benefits for me and my family to move to Canada but the vacation issue is a huge drawback.It`s not exactly a positive career move!

For thirteen years I argued that I wouldn't move to Canada with my Canadian wife mainly due to the "barbaric" vacation allowance... Then I had kids and decided it may actually be better for them to grow up in Canada rather than England...

Anyway, I don't work at all but I can comment from my wife's (and our family's) perspective.

Obviously it depends on province and employer, but OH started work with a major Canadian company in Feb this year and has no holiday entitlement for twelve months. That said she has took two weeks in May and the whole of August off unpaid without a problem. She also works 8-4 every day and is at the dinner table at 5pm with the rest of the family which neither of us could manage in the UK.

Because I stay at home, every weekend/evening is unimpeded by shopping and other mundane tasks meaning we all of our evenings/weekends free for leisure. And as a previous poster said, even leisure activities are plentiful.

Bank Holiday weekends (and there are plenty of them!) are spent travelling (traffic jams are rather unusually in the country so you can plan with some certainty), in the last twelve months we've seen so many place it's in comparable to the UK.

My wife feels her options for leisure here are better than they were in the UK. I guess what I'm saying is it's not black and white...

Zig
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Old Dec 17th 2006, 9:42 pm
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Default Re: Time off

Originally Posted by ben123
Vacation entiltlement is only one factor but it is a major one.There would be many benefits for me and my family to move to Canada but the vacation issue is a huge drawback.It`s not exactly a positive career move!
Really? Frankly it amazes me that vacation entitlement would be the most important factor of the many faceted decision to move to a new country, be it Canada or anywhere. Hence my slightly glib response. If the time off thing is something you can't get to grips with then don't put your family through the trauma of moving over as you will never be truly happy here.

It's not really a Canadian thing IMHO but a North American one. Typical vacation allowance is much lower than we are used to in UK. One either accepts this and adapts to it or don't move here. Do note however that 'typical' is an important word. There are many people who have more than the standard 10 days. I'm one of them.

Oh, and whilst I'm about it, the belief that North Americans have a stronger work culture or work harder than Brits is a massive generalisation. I worked for a US company in UK for 11 years and it seemed that for every Brit there were at least 4 Americans doing essentially the same thing. Here I work with some hard working individuals who generally work every bit as hard if not harder than those colleagues I left in the UK.

I do deal with US companies where the employees are not tied to the desks 48 wks a year. For example one organisation works a 9 days out of every 10 cycle so they all get the second Friday off plus their 10 days plus stat. holidays. Not a bad position to be in. Another large US based organisation I deal with gives all employees 10 weeks paid vacation after 7 years service. I've not heard of a UK firm doing the same!
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Old Dec 17th 2006, 9:55 pm
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Default Re: Time off

Originally Posted by ben123
Hi,

I have a opportunity to immigrate to BC via the PNP process.
I have just one problem and that is time off from work.
To me it is a big part of my life, having time with your family and being able to see the world.
Being in BC their are opportunities for skiing and the wilderness.
How do people do this?How do people see sporting events during the week if they are at work?
Also being in the private sector are you being treated as a 2nd class citizen as if you are working in the public sector i.e Nurses you start of with 4 weeks vacation.
Is it all work?
This is important to me so much that I am very tempted to opt for Australia.
In general, if you want lots of time off and access to a range of interesting places and activities then Europe is better than Canada. On that basis Canada would only make sense if the difference in income and expenses was such that, in the UK you couldn't afford a boat across the channel whereas in Canada you could afford a plane across the ocean.

All that said, you mention nursing. One of my daughters is a first year, no seniority, nurse in Toronto. She also works as a lifeguard and is taking courses to upgrade from her nursing degree. Nonetheless, since she started work, in late June, she's been to Vancouver for a few days, Greece for a week and is planning a week in Ireland in January (no, I cannot imagine why). Nursing, or any shift job, is good for travel because, you can always trade for Christmas or Diwali or Ramadam or whenever it is no one else wants to work. At least you can if you have no partner or one who has very flexible hours.

The problem, of course, is that anywhere culturally different is a long way away, America looks beautiful but the people there are the same as the people here (except they don't all wear plaid) but that problem would be even worse in Australia.
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Old Dec 17th 2006, 10:24 pm
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Default Re: Time off

Sorry not read through all the replies in this thread (only original post really) but just wanted to throw you a link that may help in your decision.

I lived in Montreal, Quebec 16 years before moving here to the UK almost 3 years ago. When I lived/worked there I consulted the government regulatory body on laws/entitlments with respect to employement through what is/was called the "Normes Du Travail".

Did a quick google search for the pages I used to refer to and found this:

http://www.fls-ntf.gc.ca/fr/sub_let_10.asp

There are certain "minimum" laws that employers need to adhere to in Canada, the Normes is a govt body that deals with enforcing these laws and providing information to employees and employers as to their rights/obligations, sort of like the "Regis du rentes de Quebec" does for landlord/renters issues.

Here is another link to the Quebec provincial government website link on types of leave entitlements paid and unpaid etc laws for Quebec, I am assuming that the other provinces in Canada have their own equivalent websites:

http://www.cnt.gouv.qc.ca/en/normes/familiaux.asp

EDIT: Just went through some more of the google search results and there is another relevant site that might help.

About employee rights etc good place to read up about employment laws in Quebec: http://www.educaloi.qc.ca/en/loi/employees/92/

Last edited by Daedra; Dec 17th 2006 at 10:27 pm.
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Old Dec 17th 2006, 11:21 pm
  #24  
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Default Re: Time off

Originally Posted by ben123
I have just one problem and that is time off from work.
To me it is a big part of my life, having time with your family and being able to see the world.
Being in BC their are opportunities for skiing and the wilderness.
How do people do this?How do people see sporting events during the week if they are at work?
Also being in the private sector are you being treated as a 2nd class citizen as if you are working in the public sector i.e Nurses you start of with 4 weeks vacation.
Is it all work?
Hi Ben,

I have skipped the minutae of this thread due to time constraints (busy living the BC life). Vacations 2-3 weeks for private sector, public sector, close to UK as gets, nursing a little less (MOH is a nurse) but decent enough. Year #1 gets pro rated in public sector. Private, you may have to work 12 months before getting any paid vacation but may get to take unpaid.

BC is mostly about living the life. Ski, boat, cycle, hike, walk, gold, whatever. Do most combinations on the same day at times. Often work gets in the way, often people can wangle their thing to fit some work into the week, it depends. BC is the plcce to be if you want to fulfil dreams of the great outdoors, but there are two things.

a) hard to find decent well paid work and
b) expensive to live.

What is amazing is that all this stuff is right on the doorstep, you live next to hiking, biking trails, have a ski hill 20-50 minutes from your house.

Work is full on, longer hours, but people here are full on for the leisure things, weekends and evenings are packed full of activities, buy a truck, load her up and off you go doing crazy shit. You can catch a hockey game after work, ride your bike down a mountain after work, ski on a flood lit slope or jog or whatever. Hell, people jog past my house at 4am just to fit everything in, plenty people at the gym at 5am here.

BC is the province of mentalism. It's infectious. But - you need money to fund this menatlist lifestyle.

Got $ = enjoy it / max out on the big hit sports
Not got % = not enjoy it / do more low cost sports

So you can acrry on with 4 weeks vacation in the (Y)UK being a slob/lounge lizard or make a life changing move to a more positive energentic West-Coast lifestyle/environment. Can't advise you re comparisons Oz, never had an interest in that deal.

Rich.
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Old Dec 18th 2006, 12:01 am
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Default Re: Time off

Originally Posted by Rich_007
So you can acrry on with 4 weeks vacation in the (Y)UK being a slob/lounge lizard or make a life changing move to a more positive energentic West-Coast lifestyle/environment.

Rich.
I dunno but this is the second time I've noticed in this thread the idea that no one in Britain is active and I feel like I've got to stand up for all of the Brits that are very active back in the UK along with there being plenty to do. As much as I appreciate the wonderful life that can be had out here lets get a bit of balance. Not every Canadian is a sporty, outward bound individual just like not every Brit is a slob. It really does come down to the individual outlook and there's enough of a concern about obesity here to suggest that more people should be active.
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Old Dec 18th 2006, 12:14 am
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Default Re: Time off

Originally Posted by stepnek
I dunno but this is the second time I've noticed in this thread the idea that no one in Britain is active and I feel like I've got to stand up for all of the Brits that are very active back in the UK along with there being plenty to do.
The sheer accessibility to outdoor pursuits is in a different league here, generally in the (Y)UK people see winter as a time to hibernate, get fat, eat lardy food, lie about and close the curtains to the went dank misery of the world outside their cold draughty terraced house.

Anyways, one has to drive a few hundred miles to find anything remotely of interest in the Y(UK). Ski-ing, sure, in Europe, a drive and a flight and hotel and tourist priced food, and cost of ski hire away. Not exactly for the poor, is it ? Even poor or 'normal' folks can afford to ski in Canada, and they do. Ever likely, in the (Y)UK people prefer to go to the pub, go shopping or drink themselves stupid til they puke/pass out. It's pure escapism from a life of misery.

In Canada (BC specific as per where I live) the outdoor mentality is full on. Can ride a bike down a mountain, play golf in the warm sun and ski all on the same day ? Oh sure, I could do that in the (Y)UK every weekend

Maybe as you're not exposed to BC life, the difference (to you) is less pronounced, however the OP was asking about BC life so I was telling of BC life versus the lethargy of (Y)UK.

Anyways for me (BC) is a case of world class mentalism versus apathetic misery of drizzly overcast lounge-lizardry ? Hmm. Tough call.

Choose life.
Choose a sport.
Choose an outdoor sports.
Choose more sports than you can shake a stick at.
Choose a cheap or expensive sport.
Choose a house with a garage big enough to house all your sports shit.
Choose a job that pays for all your leisure pursuits.
///etc


Rich.

Last edited by Rich_007; Dec 18th 2006 at 12:18 am.
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Old Dec 18th 2006, 1:08 am
  #27  
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Default Re: Time off

Originally Posted by Rich_007
Anyways for me (BC) is a case of world class mentalism versus apathetic misery of drizzly overcast lounge-lizardry ? Hmm. Tough call.

Rich.
LOL, you do have a way with words Rich.
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Old Dec 18th 2006, 1:56 am
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Default Re: Time off

you also have to remember that in most cases these are protected minimums. So say in Ontario you are entitled to 10 days paid vacation as a minimum. That doesn't mean that is all you will ever get. I've been at my current job now for just over 3 1/2 years and after three my vacation allowance went up to three weeks, or rather the vacation pay did, they now pay 6% into a vacation pay allowance rather than 4% where 4% gets you 10 days and 6% gets you 15 and then you factor in your regular days off like weekends taking you to three weeks. So that means if I work a full year the vacation balance is enough to pay for the equivilant of three weeks of regular work. I could take off 4 weeks but I'd only get paid for 3. So there are usually allowances for taking extra or unpaid vacation if you budget for it. So then you can see if it's really time with your family you value or more the money.

Even in this situation my position isn't paticularly senior and that's the same allowance that applies to all employees. The guy I work with negotiated an extra week before he took the job so that he started with three and that is something to bear in mind. If you are negotiating for compensation, don't just think about the salary but other benefits as well such as negotiating vacation tim eif it's important to you. I know a lot of people though who have never taken a vacation in the three years I've been working here.

Personally I don't notice that much as the weekends and evenings and stat holidays etc. provide a reasonably good amount of free time. If you really want lot sof vacation time though, why not be a teacher, they always say they need more, then you get the whole summer.

A lot of jobs have options for sabbaticals etc. as well. For example my wife's Aunt & Uncle and 2 kids have taken this year off to go sailing down to the caribbean and back. One is a teacher and one worked for a bank. For the teacher they were allowed to choose reduced pay for a determined period that then allowed them to in effect save up a years salary and get paid while taking the year off, and the bank, while not paying held the job for the term of the sabbatical. So while that requires certain financial sacrafices and a lot of careful budgeting and planning, you can't argue that there are no ways to spend time with your family. Admittedly it's not as easy as just booking off three weeks paid in the summer to go to the Med but it's not like everyone is a prisoner in an office and never allowed to leave. Most people here seem to live a more varied liesure life than most people I know or knew in the UK, certainly not as much time spent binge drinking within my age group (25-30).

I can see how the contrast could be an initial shock if you have been used to large vacation allowances for years and have to get used to living without it but it can easily be overcome and it is just another adjustment to living in another country. If everything was the same then there would be little point in moving.
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Old Dec 18th 2006, 3:35 am
  #29  
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Default Re: Time off

Originally Posted by ben123
Is it all work?
This is important to me so much that I am very tempted to opt for Australia.
Is it all work? Apparently not for the Aussies who appear to be rather more laid back than most.
Attached Thumbnails Time off-kangaroo9.jpg   Time off-kangaroo3.jpg  
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Old Dec 18th 2006, 3:49 am
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Default Re: Time off

Originally Posted by Rich_007
Anyways, one has to drive a few hundred miles to find anything remotely of interest in the Y(UK).
That rather depends on what your interests are, no?

And people might be inclined to take your rather tiresome opinions a little more seriously (eg "UK a life of misery" ) if you dropped that seriously childish habit of referring to the "(Y)UK".
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