British Expats - So is this guy a Canadian or not.

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Re: So is this guy a Canadian or not.

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Originally Posted by Oakvillian (Post 11310163)

Not sure how you reach this conclusion. Surely if that's the way the law is drafted, and the constitutionality of that law has not been successfully challenged, then it cannot be said to be wrong in law.

The way it is being portrayed is what I was getting at, is wrong in law. Look at the comments made in these cases by the Crown. A criminal conviction may then make you deportable in an entirely separate civil proceeding - but the point is that it is an entirely separate civil proceeding and one does not automatically mean the other. The way they go on about it is wrong in law, they are two separate laws, the Criminal Code and the IRPA.

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It might be morally indefensible, and repugnant from a humanitarian perspective, but that's what the law says. If you do not take citizenship, you cannot currently expect to be treated the same under the law as a citizen. How long you have been in Canada is not relevant.

It is relevant because it is a circumstance, it's not entirely automatic, the judges do have some discretion, but not much because the law was changed to lower the bar.

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I think, therefore, that my position is this: it is not unreasonable for the Government to reserve the right to deport PRs for reasons of criminality. What is unreasonable here is the Government's timeline in rescinding citizenship from an individual (to whom it had been conferred in good faith) only when his criminal inadmissability came to light.

I don't disagree with the general principle either, say so and so comes in as and is granted permanent residency and becomes a criminal - but you have to look at all the circumstances and if the person was a minor when they immigrated for example I think is an exception that should be generally made.

What is annoying me is that more so in Canada even than the US (if you can believe it) deportation is being used as a punishment without regard to the circumstances. Removal is a civil proceeding.

Re: So is this guy a Canadian or not.

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Originally Posted by JAJ (Post 11310331)

Not true.
Bill C-24 does not allow deprivation of Canadian citizenship based on criminal convictions. Except a particular schedule of offences that are terrorism or treason related.

In that case, I hadn't read the Act as it was enacted at the time. But you could have a similar situation where someone had been convicted abroad of something described as terrorism - the Act uses the sentence they got to figure that out. Which is somewhat similar to the US "aggravated felony" nonsense where a one-year suspended sentence for assault can meet that definition.

Say you're in, mmm, Yemen. Is a five year sentence going to meet the same sort of judicial standard that it would in Canada?

Re: So is this guy a Canadian or not.

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Originally Posted by FlyingDutchman6666 (Post 11310741)

So, what constitutes "due diligence" ? The Act does not say.

Have a look at Exhibit 5 in this audit: ARCHIVED - CBSA Criminal Investigations Program (IRPA)

Don't think too many people would care too much based on those stats.

Anyway, what "due diligence" can you perform? I've made this point on here loads of times. You cannot legally demand anything other than the SIN, because of the privacy laws. And all you can do with the SIN is call up Service Canada and ask if it's valid, unless it starts with a "9" then I think you can demand more information on their status I think.

On their website it goes on about "requesting" information, but the problem with that one is that anything systematic that could be construed as giving a hint of discrimination is going to get you in trouble, I read up on the case law. Look what happened to the car dealers who were asking to make copies of DLs for example before a test drive.

Okay, you might get away with asking for more info, but why would you risk it? Any sensible person is going to the absolute minimum required by law.

Re: So is this guy a Canadian or not.

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Originally Posted by JAJ (Post 11310966)

It appears that the parents remained in Canada, and subsequently became permanent residents and later on, Canadian citizens, they should have a CIC file. Which may contain information that is relevant to this situation.

Unless of course the privacy commissioner forced them to get rid of it, which given that they're citizens and have been for a long time, might be the case, not sure what their record retention period is. But the privacy commissioner has just forced CBSA to backpedal on their record retention from 75 to 15 years under the "Beyond the Border Initiative" (which was a Canadian idea!!!)

So I wouldn't be surprised if that CIC file has long since been shredded.

I'm all for privacy but it does seem to me that they're getting a bit too carried away.