Re: Resignation
 

But pay isn't.
I don't know about you but many people would be in serious financial trouble if they lost their job, especially when you think about the cost of emigration.

There is lots of evidence that discrimination in the workplace exists and constructive dismissal is a real situation that happens to people all the time and they cannot prove it.

Once you are no longer in control of this information, you are letting other potentially judge you negatively and risking your position.

I wouldn't do it and there are many others who wouldn't either, but then perhaps we have been unlucky and either experienced it ourselves or seen it happen to others.
Maybe you haven't.

I won't persuade you, clearly, but those of us who have been on the wrong end of a boss with a petty mindset and who holds a grudge against you for leaving their employ (all done properly and following all the rules) and who know the power they can wield very unfairly would keep their mouths firmly shut until emigration was all signed and sealed and the official resignation was in.

Re: Resignation
 

If I had a boss with a petty mindset I would be fishing around for another position anyway...

Im not disagreeing with you about keeping your cards close to your chest, but I dont know that the problem is epidemic either, and its certainly not solely related to emigrating.

Re: Resignation
 

I have to agree - 100%

In December I gave my notice in to my boss (I was her PA) to go to work for a friend who was paying me 3 x my current rate of pay (How could I refuse??)
I gave her my notice and from that day on she didn't speak to me. Very tricky when you're a PA!!!!!
Anyway my friend's company needed an employers reference from her and when asked the question "would you reemploy?" she said "no" without an explanation! If it hadn't been for my friend I would have been left up the proverbial creek without a paddle as the HR dept asked my friend if he still wanted to employ me in the circumstances!!!
Some employers get away with these things and there is nothing you can do as apparently saying she wouldn't reemploy me is not actually giving a bad reference according to the solicitor I approached!
So beware, especially if you work for a small company without a bespoke HR dept as they don't necessarily do you any favors when you leave and I dread to think how she would have reacted if I had told her I was planning to move to Canada!
Now if/when I need a reference from the UK, it will be my friend they approach and not her but if this had happened as I was leaving the country it might have been harder to deal with...
Just wanted to share...

Re: Resignation
 

I let my boss at the CHC know that I planned to emigrate. She was very supportive. She also had her own plans as to what to do with my position once I'd gone. She couldn't do it until I resigned, which I wasn't going to do until I received my PR visa. She knew this.

This was in the old days when applications for skilled workers took years. Mine didn't. A mate in the immigration section told me that it was close to record-breaking (a couple of months).

Re: Resignation
 

She wanted rid of you that quick, huh? :p

Re: Resignation
 

Nah. We got on fine. We stayed in touch after and I had open invites to visit her at whichever country she happened to be Canada's ambassor at the time.

What she wanted to do once she knew I was leaving was to convert my position into two new positions. She couldn't do it with me still in the chair. Sacking me would have been nigh-on impossible (there were no grounds for doing so). Redundancy would have been nice for me but pointless for her because it would have been the position that became redundant, and the funding with it. No public servant throws away budget.

I'm pretty sure she leant on the immigration guys, though.

Re: Resignation
 

When I interviewed for my last job in the UK, I explained that if I was in the process of applying for emigrating, and if I were offered the job, it would be a matter of maybe 12-18 months before I would be leaving (all being well).

I explained that I had been working in a very small niche area, and wanted some wider recent experience to help with my job-hunt when I got to Canada.

I was offered the job anyway, with all this being on the table, and yet my boss still seemed really surprised when I did hand in my notice. I only needed to give one month, but I think I told them as soon as we had the visas and were able to make definite plans to go.

It never crossed my mind that it would be detrimental to put my cards on the table, but I would have understood perfectly if they had decided not to hire me under those circumstances and I wanted to be fair to them! :p

Re: Resignation
 

I warned my company that I had been offered a job in Canada and that I have accepted their offer. Problem was I still don't have an exact date to go out (sub contractor for a year) was told end of September. Then got a phone call recently from the firm saying that it has been put back a month because of legal hold-ups with transportation of the "mega loads" through Idaho.

I've been with my company for close to 14years and felt I should show them some respect and atleast pre-warn them ... Biggest mistake I could have done ... I'm due close to 21 days holidays left for this year and was told as of monday (19th Sept) I was to take 3 weeks off as they didn't want to pay me for the holidays that I'm due.

Needless to say I'm actually hating every minute I have to endure in that place now. I just want a phonecall ASAP to say that I'm going to Alberta at the middle to late Oct.

Re: Resignation
 

Sorry about that but it illustrates what has been said.
Don't think honesty and loyalty will be reciprocated by a company.

Re: Resignation
 

I'm not suggesting you should say daft things on the internet, all I'm saying is it's not as big of a deal as is often made out. Certainly in my job I have come across fake profiles, or even more common are people with the same name. Lots of people for example think I'm dead because two people with the exact same name as me and birthdays within a couple of months have died and their obituaries are on the web and one of them did the same job as me.

As for your reference, the reference has to be factually based otherwise that can land you in legal trouble also. So if you confront someone and they deny it, without any evidence to prove otherwise giving a bad reference on that basis would be on very dodgy ground also. Giving bad references is always very dubious unless the person was actually dismissed for cause, and I've got to say you're a galactic idiot to put someone down as a referee who you think might give you a bad one anyway.

Re: Resignation
 

a) Since references for work are confidential you do not necessarily get to see your reference before the damage is done.
b) Factual it may be, but it isn't necessarily saying bad things about you that scuppers your chances of a job, but omitting all the good things. No-one can force an employer to mention those things if they choose not to even though they are true.
c) Not everyone has had a string of jobs from which to choose their referees. Any employer will probably think it is a bit odd if you do not give your most recent employer as a referee.

I think it is galactically naive to think that bosses are always fair or follow the rules.

Re: Resignation
 

Well thankfully I received great recommendations from my current employer and to be honest I should. I have never messed them around and have always gave them a full days hard work.

They however have started this funny business since I informed them of my plans which really has begun to annoy me now.

Re: Resignation
 

It depends on who gives the reference and if they're going to be a pratt and infer something from the web they can't prove then they're a pratt and it's as simple as that. Whenever I give references all I do is say they worked here from date x to y, their job responsibilities were x and they were never subject to disciplinary procedures (unless they were). With all the litigation that can happen around it you have to be careful what you put down.

At the end of the day this is a discussion about how stupid people are, and you can't stop people from being stupid, trust me I've tried. If you're stupid enough to go around saying to stupid people that your employer is stupid then by definition you are stupid.

Re: Resignation
 

Different businesses require different things from a reference.

In some a simple report such as you have indicated is all that is ever given, but in my business that is far from the case.
It is expected for a previous employer to wax lyrical about you and actually state that they are making a positive recommendation.
Anything else is considered a negative by omission.

I'm not sure I get what you are trying to say in your last sentence.:confused:

This isn't about people being stupid.
We were discussing whether it is sensible to reveal that you plan to emigrate before you are ready to resign.

Some people seem to treat their employer as if they are a friend and that is a mistake.
An employer is not a mate or close friend, they are a business and their decisions should be made on business principles, not personal ones.

In such a situation, it is best to keep your own counsel until you are in a position to resign formally.

Remember, the notice period is set by the company and therefore has been considered by them as sufficient time to find a suitable replacement for you.
An employee need not feel they are being in any way mean or disloyal to their company by doing this.
If you were looking for another job in the UK you wouldn't tell your employer until you had it in the bag, so why do it in the emigration plan scenario?

I think that fact that some people have thought that they are on safe ground nd that they are doing their employer a favour by telling them sooner than strictly necessary but then discovered that they have been disadvantaged in some way after this has been revealed shows that even if you think you would be alright to do so, you may be proved wrong.

Why risk it?

Re: Resignation
 

I agree.

In my case I took 6 months unpaid leave. They knew I was going out to Canada but I had the option to return within the 6 months to take up my position again.

Needless to say, I sent a resignation letter from Canada a few days before my 6 months were up.

Re: Resignation
 

It's easy to be cynical, but sometimes it's worth taking a punt on your employer if you've got a good relationship with them and you are moderately competent at what you do. This is my employment story:-

Late 2004 -
Me: I'm emigrating to Canada, I need a reference.
Boss: When's this gonna happen?
Me: God knows, a few years maybe [visas where taking min 2.5 years at the time].
Boss: Speak to HR, they'll sort you one out.

Early 2005 -
Me: We've just outsourced some work to Bangkok. I fancy a few years there - can I go too?
Boss: Sure.

Mid 2007 -
Me: (In Bangkok) My Visa has arrived, I'm off to Vancouver next year when my assignment here runs out.
Boss: Ok.

Early 2008 -
Boss: We've just acquired an office in Vancouver - you want to work for us, but from there?
Me: Ok.

I now realize how much this honesty paid off, and how much of a massive favour my employer actually did for me when they offered the transfer. Without the transfer I would have had to find work and I consider work in my field very poorly paid here (as an aside, private sector wages in BC seem generally shit for mere minions like me - I'm surprised anybody wants to come here unless they are going into the public sector).

Re: Resignation
 

Well we were discussing whether it's a good idea to go yapping about your employer on the internet and thereby pissing them off, which I agree is stupid, but my experience is that it's not as big of a deal as some people make out.