Question on volunteering while in visitor status
 

Hi everyone,

I am a new member but have been lurking for quite some time, and finding lots of good info. And now I might just have a question I haven't found an answer to :)

My British fiance and I have decided that he will make the move here in December, just before the New Year, entering as a visitor, until we can get married and then go through the spousal sponsorship (I am a canadian citizen and currently live in Canada). If all goes according to plan, we get married shortly after his arrival, then we go the outland application way while he remains here in Canada.

During this time, he obviously will not be able to work. That is great, because he is completing his master's and can then concentrate on writing his thesis. He also plans on volunteering for the professional association in his field, doing some unpaid work to build some of that canadian experience that seems so important when trying to secure employment. It will be something to put on his resume when he gets his PR and start looking for work.

BUT :huh: on one of my hunts for info, I came upon a thread explaining that he would need a work permit to volunteer, as he would be acquiring work experience (it was an excerpt from a CIC bulletin, no link provided :(). I have been searching the CIC website but can't find anything. Can anyone point me in the right direction? Obviously if this isn't allowed, he would still volunteer for the association, but keep his involvement to the admin stuff, writing for the newsletter etc. No one ever wants to do that stuff anyway.:lol: something to do, plus a great way of building a network of contacts for when he's ready to apply for a job.

Thanks all for any info you can provide. I'll have other questions to post re. moving his stuff here but i will open a new thread for that when the time comes :)

Re: Question on volunteering while in visitor status
 

Yes, sorry, but he cannot do that. Unpaid work experience requires a work permit.

Here is the CIC Operating Manual you need, and it's page 23 that probably has the bit you read on here - http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resourc...w/fw01-eng.pdf

Note that he can't do unpaid volunteer work experience at all (including the admin or newsletter writing you mentioned) without a work permit. The only kind he can do is 'true' volunteer work i.e. something that nobody ever gets paid for such as helping in a soup kitchen.

HTH.

Re: Question on volunteering while in visitor status
 

If he is under 31 then he could apply for an IEC visa when the new ones become available in Jan/Feb - that would give him an open work permit for a year - he can apply even if he is in Canada at the time, he would just need to go to the border to activate it.

He can register his interest in applying for one here

:)

If he is intending on applying for an IEC visa and also for the spousal application, I would suggest getting his ACPO certificates ordered before he leaves - and get a couple of copies as he will need one for both. :)

http://www.acpo.police.uk/NationalPo...tificates.aspx

Re: Question on volunteering while in visitor status
 

Can he use the skills he has in a non for profit organization?

Re: Question on volunteering while in visitor status
 

No, sadly we are too old for that. We will do the police checks though and get extra copies just in case they get misplaced. i was surprised to see how fast they can turn them around :) one of the things we won't have to wait forever for :lol:

Re: Question on volunteering while in visitor status
 

Well the society he wants to volunteer for is a non-profit org. of professionals. They hold monthly meetings, networking events, publish a newletter, offer training (given by volunteer instructors), etc. He'll have time to do all that, has the skills and experience to contribute (we're not so young anymore :lol:) and will meet a lot of people who may hire him once he has PR status. He was hoping to do some work-related stuff in Canada to keep current and not have a possible one-year gap on his resume. Plus he is really work focus, to him sitting at home doing nothing is really difficult to imagine. We had many discussions about people being able to have a meaningful life and contributing to society without the contribution being remunerated. Now if he can't even volunteer that would be very disappointing :(

Re: Question on volunteering while in visitor status
 

OK but following that logic, if someone volunteered as a cook in a soup kitchen in order to gain experience so they can apply for employment as a chef, then wouldn't that also be considered "unpaid work experience"? :confused:

The manual your provided a link for (thanks so much!!! :)) says:

" What kind of activities are not considered to be “work”?
• An activity which does not really ‘take away’ from opportunities for Canadians or permanent residents to gain employment or experience in the workplace is not “work” for the purposes of the definition.

Examples of activities for which a person would not normally be remunerated or which would not compete directly with Canadian citizens or Permanent Residents in the Canadian labour market and which would normally be part-time or incidental to the reason that the person is in Canada include, but are not limited to:

• volunteer work for which a person would not normally be remunerated, such as sitting on the board of a charity or religious institution; being a ‘big brother’ or ‘big sister’ to a child; being on the telephone line at a rape crisis centre. (Normally this activity would be part time and incidental to the main reason that a person is in Canada);
• unremunerated help by a friend or family member during a visit, such as a mother assisting a daughter with childcare, or an uncle helping his nephew build his own cottage;
• long distance (by telephone or internet) work done by a temporary resident whose employer is outside Canada and who is remunerated from outside Canada;
• self-employment where the work to be done would have no real impact on the labour market, nor really provide an opportunity for Canadians. Examples include a U.S. farmer crossing the border to work on fields that he owns, or a miner coming to work on his own claim.

There may be other types of unpaid short-term work where the work is really incidental to the main reason that a person is visiting Canada and is not a competitive activity, even though nonmonetary valuable consideration is received. For instance, if a tourist wishes to stay on a family farm and work part time just for room and board for a short period (i.e., 1-4 weeks), this person would not be considered a worker.

We recognize that there may be overlap in activities that we do not consider to be work and those activities which are defined as work not requiring a work permit in R186. However, the net effect (no work permit required) is the same."

So, his volunteering being part-time and incidental to his main reason for being here (being with his wife, waiting for PR) and the volunteer position being for a non-profit organization (is that the same as charitable? i don't think it is?) for which no other canadian is being deprived of work (everyone is a volunteer in that society), it shouldn't cause any problems, right? Even if he gets non-monetary valuable consideration (networking opportunities for future job prospects). And he wouldn't have to declare that upon entering Canada since his main reason for being here is to visit, right? :confused:

Re: Question on volunteering while in visitor status
 

A charity is a non-profit (sometimes called not for profit) organization, but then so is a trade union and so is the local historical society. A non-profit is an organization where any surplus of receipts over expenses is not distributed (or distributable) to owners.

I am not an expert on immigration matters but the way I read the bit you have quoted is that your OH can not volunteer to do anything that a Canadian (or PR) might otherwise be paid to do.

I take your point about the soup kitchen and yes, someone could use this to gain Canadian experience. The motive for doing the work is not important. The thing is that nobody ever expects to get paid, or ever is paid, for doing it so if a visitor works in a soup kitchen they are not depriving a Canadian of a work opportunity.

In contrast, someone doing an unpaid internship is doing work which is valuable to their employer and for which their employer would otherwise need to pay for. They are depriving a Canadian of the opportunity to earn an income and so have effectively entered the workforce. Therefore they need a work permit.

From your description your situation sounds more like the soup kitchen than the intern, but please don't rely on my interpretation.

Re: Question on volunteering while in visitor status
 

Is it really worth trying to get around the system and risk being refused PR and getting a 3+ year ban from entering Canada?

He could volunteer but if discovered that is what could happen.

If you start the preparations for your application now - gather all the documentary evidence of your relationship, photo's, letters of support etc., fill out the application forms, get the police certificate and everything you need for the application ready to go then as soon as you are married you can send it all off. Outland processing is much quicker as you know and provided everything is done correctly and you supply all the supporting evidence then he could get PR in around 8 months from application time.

I really recommend not trying to buck the system.. it may come back to bite you.

Re: Question on volunteering while in visitor status
 

Why not join a service group, such as Lions, networking opportunity as well as volunteering ops for their fundraisers.

Re: Question on volunteering while in visitor status
 

Reading the guide it shows he can volunteer, that's pretty clear, but I guess the problem you may have is that he wants to volunter in the profession he will work in, which is probably the difficult bit.

I was thinking that he could use his skills and gain experience in a non for profit org (charity), that would put some experience on his resume. I would suggest that the non for profit isn't the society that's connected to the profession he hopes to work in.

I guess I'm saying use his transferable skills somewhere else to gain experience.

Non for profits have volunteer trainers, vol recruiters that network and attend events, etc so there are volunteer roles out there that match his skills.