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Quarantine for COVID 19 discussions.

Quarantine for COVID 19 discussions.

Old Feb 5th 2021, 7:12 am
  #826  
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Default Re: Quarantine for COVID 19 discussions.

Originally Posted by ChrisBan
t
  • arrived at LHR 3 and a half hours before flight expecting a long line at bag drop while they checked paperwork. There was no line; agent asked to see negative COVID test results and PR card - I had my test done 48 hours earlier at the drive through site by LHR run by expresstest.co.uk, they have a few sites around the UK (had test done at 10am, had results by 4pm on same day which was much better than their service promise of by 10pm next day). Was reminded to download/complete ArriveCan, as well as registering in advance for COVID testing
  • Security was normal
  • Post security was a little busier than expected in some places, probably because there was basically nothing open so people just congregated around seating. WHSmiths and Pret were open and a burger place. Didn’t look around much, but aside from the seating areas it was kind of eerie how quiet the rest of the terminal was
  • At the gate - they checked my passport and boarding pass, nothing else; I’ve heard some people have been asked again to show ArriveCan receipt, negative COVID test and proof of being allowed to enter
  • Flight was pretty quiet, I had a row of 4 to myself, as did the row in front. I imagine this was the same throughout the rest of the plane, but didn’t really look. Not sure what the situation is with other airlines, but Air Canada has reduced their inflight service. No beer, and no choice on meals. Lunch was a mushroom something vegetarian - obviously in flight meals aren’t great at the best of times, but knowing there would be no choice in food I grabbed something to eat before boarding. Other than that, nothing really different other than the PPE.
  • There was a short customs hold when the plane got to the gate, probably no more than 5 minutes. Again I’ve heard instances when CBSA have deplaned in groups, but once hold was released we could leave as normal. Leaving the plane, you could see just how quiet departures terminal was, ghost town!
  • Primary inspection was quiet, and quick. From entering my customs dec into the machine, to getting through primary it was no more than 10 mins (T1 at Pearson). CBSA agent asked reason for my travel back to the UK, and asked whether I was aware about the 14 day quarantine. Was asked for ArriveCan receipt and negative COVID test. She gave me an information leaflet and emphasised the penalties for breaking the quarantine.
  • Baggage collection no different
  • COVID test on arrival. This is where the fun started. They filter you through two lines, one for those who had pre-registered and those who had not. The lines end at perhaps 8 booths where you pickup your swab kit to then join a second line to have the swab taken. This was a disaster. The line for the swab taking crossed the end of the line for the pre-registered. So the pre-registered travellers were at a disadvantage to the non registered travellers because the employee on that line just kept feeding people from that line through faster meaning the pre-registered line had a much slower flow through. This part was dreadful because essentially all the physical distancing measures they’d taken for the initial line, meant nothing because everyone was crowding together at this point and to pick up your swab kit you had to cross through the line of people waiting to have their swabs taken. Needless to say there were some pretty agitated people. Whole process took about 45 minutes. Obviously some teething issues here because they’re dealing with significantly higher volumes than when it was voluntary. Hopefully they figure this out over the next couple of days and perhaps it’s smoother in T3. Test itself was administered by an employee of the testing company, so not self administered per their website
  • Got an email this morning from ArriveCan to complete my daily self assessment
Think that covers most of it, can’t think of anything else to add

Just wondering, was this experience before or after the new regulation took effect?

By reading through all the comments, it would seem that I am right to understand that "non essential travel" and that enforced "$2000 punishment fine" for the hotel only really applies for "real leisure travel" such as holidays and sun and beach, - not for Canadian citizens returning after a longer absence from Canada due to job/profession, or a business trip closely connected and unavoidable to the well being of the job the company like a key / major client visit, etc...?

Also, I would like to know whether that "Alberta option" with only 48 hours quarantine is still an option?
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Old Feb 5th 2021, 7:22 am
  #827  
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Default Re: Quarantine for COVID 19 discussions.

Originally Posted by OrangeMango
Just wondering, was this experience before or after the new regulation took effect?

By reading through all the comments, it would seem that I am right to understand that "non essential travel" and that enforced "$2000 punishment fine" for the hotel only really applies for "real leisure travel" such as holidays and sun and beach, - not for Canadian citizens returning after a longer absence from Canada due to job/profession, or a business trip closely connected and unavoidable to the well being of the job the company like a key / major client visit, etc...?

Also, I would like to know whether that "Alberta option" with only 48 hours quarantine is still an option?
Hotel quarantine hasn't been introduced yet and the details haven't been confirmed. It takes time to set up.

There is no mandatory testing on arrival in Toronto though.
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Old Feb 5th 2021, 7:59 am
  #828  
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Default Re: Quarantine for COVID 19 discussions.

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost
Hotel quarantine hasn't been introduced yet and the details haven't been confirmed. It takes time to set up.

There is no mandatory testing on arrival in Toronto though.
I just want to jump in and say...DG if you can delay your move, I would and get the vaccine in the UK. It’s just a huge mess here as far as vaccinations are concerned.



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Old Feb 5th 2021, 8:17 am
  #829  
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Default Re: Quarantine for COVID 19 discussions.

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost
Hotel quarantine hasn't been introduced yet and the details haven't been confirmed. It takes time to set up.
Maybe if we're in luck it never will be, if this link is to be believed, it could possibly be:

https://www.jccf.ca/federal-governme...g_HWJ9CgV3U1qg


“There is no rational reason to incarcerate Canadians simply because they exercised their constitutional right to leave the country as protected by section 6 of the Charter,” stated Justice Centre President John Carpay. “It is not rational to impose a 14-day quarantine upon asymptomatic individuals who are able to provide negative test results confirming their lack of infection. Moreover, the federal government has admitted it is well-aware that international air travel results in a negligible number of active cases.”

And also:The letter states the government’s arrest and detention of Canadians in this fashion is unlawful and unconstitutional, and demands the immediate release of any Canadian currently being so detained, permitting them to continue any necessary isolation protocols in their personal residences.

The legal warning letter notes, “This is not China or Cuba, or Chile under Pinochet, or Spain under Franco, or theocratic Iran. We are not prepared to permit you and your government to turn Canada into a repressive replica of countries that have no respect for human rights and civil liberties.”


Originally Posted by DigitalGhost

There is no mandatory testing on arrival in Toronto though.
I thought there already was until the recent announcement, or at least the way and the publicity or populism it was announced - before that it was voluntary as I recall.
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Old Feb 5th 2021, 10:49 am
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Default Re: Quarantine for COVID 19 discussions.

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost
Hotel quarantine hasn't been introduced yet and the details haven't been confirmed. It takes time to set up.

There is no mandatory testing on arrival in Toronto though.
There is in Toronto
https://www.torontopearson.com/en/he...oronto-pearson

Effective February 1, 2021 at 12:00 pm (Toronto time) the Government of Ontario requires all international travellers to take a COVID-19 test upon arrival.


Ontario’s mandatory testing of international arriving passengers is in addition to the new Government of Canada pre-departure test requirement for travellers bound to Canada.
Travellers required to test:
  • International arriving passengers, remaining in Ontario
  • International travellers connecting to other destinations within Ontario
https://news.ontario.ca/en/release/6...-19-variants-1
Mandatory Testing of Travelers:To address the risks associated with variants of concern to the health of Ontarians, the Chief Medical Officer of Health is issuing a Section 22 order under Section 77.1 of the Health Protection and Promotion Act, mandating on-arrival testing for international travellers at Toronto Pearson International Airport effective at 12:01 p.m. on February 1, 2021 and exploring additional testing measures at Pearson International Airport and land border crossings in the coming weeks.

Last edited by Siouxie; Feb 5th 2021 at 10:55 am.
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Old Feb 5th 2021, 11:37 am
  #831  
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Default Re: Quarantine for COVID 19 discussions.

Travellers required to test:
  • International arriving passengers, remaining in Ontario
  • International travellers connecting to other destinations within Ontario

I'd say this shows how badly formulated this statement is: Anybody going anywhere within Ontario is effectively remaining in Ontario.

Also, it's pretty inefficient: Anybody arriving at Pearson and connecting to provinces other than Ontario is not legally required to take this test? Why? And even worse, in the apparently rare event if one is contagious and hasn't taken the test, one could still infect other travellers from within canada at the airport as well as during the domestic flight.

I honestly don't see the logic on this.

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Old Feb 5th 2021, 1:56 pm
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Default Re: Quarantine for COVID 19 discussions.

Originally Posted by OrangeMango
Travellers required to test:
  • International arriving passengers, remaining in Ontario
  • International travellers connecting to other destinations within Ontario

I'd say this shows how badly formulated this statement is: Anybody going anywhere within Ontario is effectively remaining in Ontario.

Also, it's pretty inefficient: Anybody arriving at Pearson and connecting to provinces other than Ontario is not legally required to take this test? Why? And even worse, in the apparently rare event if one is contagious and hasn't taken the test, one could still infect other travellers from within canada at the airport as well as during the domestic flight.

I honestly don't see the logic on this.
Presumably worded that way as they only have jurisdiction over Ontario..
This program is being implemented by the Government of Ontario.

Last edited by Siouxie; Feb 5th 2021 at 1:58 pm.
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Old Feb 5th 2021, 2:39 pm
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Default Re: Quarantine for COVID 19 discussions.

Ah well, BC's Provincial Health Officer has extended the Emergency Pandemic Restrictions for the "foreseeable future" or "indefinitely", depending on which news report read/seen/heard.

They were put in existence last November and were due to expire at midnight Feb 5th.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...2020-1.5902427

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Old Feb 5th 2021, 8:35 pm
  #834  
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Default Re: Quarantine for COVID 19 discussions.

Originally Posted by Siouxie
Sorry, that was a typo on my part. I meant to write "there is mandatory testing on arrival in Toronto". I think I must have been tired when I wrote that.

​​​​​

Last edited by DigitalGhost; Feb 5th 2021 at 8:37 pm.
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Old Feb 5th 2021, 8:45 pm
  #835  
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Default Re: Quarantine for COVID 19 discussions.

Originally Posted by Jerseygirl
I just want to jump in and say...DG if you can delay your move, I would and get the vaccine in the UK. It’s just a huge mess here as far as vaccinations are concerned.
I ideally would but unfortunately I don't think it's possible at this point. I have a job to start, my PRTD expires next month and I need to pick up my PR card when I get back. Plus the lease on my flat in the UK expires in a couple of weeks and I'm getting close on falling short of RO although not dangerously close atm.

It is amazing how a country that has spent more on vaccines per capita than any other country on Earth has managed to make such a dog's dinner out of its deployment. The UK and US get a partial pass because they invented the three main vaccines used in Western medicine right now but it is fair to compare Canada's numbers with the likes of Israel and the UAE. When you do that, Canada does not come off well.
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Old Feb 6th 2021, 12:11 am
  #836  
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Default Re: Quarantine for COVID 19 discussions.

Originally Posted by Siouxie


Hopefully what it says on the website is true, that it will be restricted to 'non essential travel' Fingers crossed!
https://www.canada.ca/en/public-heal...ravellers.html
thought i'd ask your opinion on if you think my travel is 'essential'.

Im travelling in march. My work does not change, my job is as a freelance illustrator, i can do my job anywhere in the world as long as there is internet. I will remain self employed free lance in canada initially at least. But technically no, i dont have to be there to work, or anywhere really.

But one reason i do need to go is the time limit on my PR card. You have to be in canada for 3 years out of the 5 the PR card gives you to apply for citizenship. 2 years of the 5 run out in august, meaning i have to be there by august if i want to stay and live in canada for the rest of my life. The first year i didnt go cause i was taking my time, getting everything ready for an optimum move...then the next year covid happened, and ive been waiting patiently for a year now for the right time to go. There isnt going to be one till 2022 at this rate. to make matters worse i had moved home to my Mothers so i could store my stuff, it just made logistical sense. Now ive been stuck here almost a year, without my usual independance, basically dying to get out of here! My mental health isn't great, and thats been turning into physical health problems that i know would clear up the minute i got out of here....

I dont want to wait till the last possible moment to make sure i hit that 3yr target, and i dont see the rules that are in effect or the covid situation being much different in august to what they are right now. They could be worse. there could be no travel. there could be a weeks isolation in a hotel before going to quarantine.

so, is that essential travel?
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Old Feb 6th 2021, 1:01 am
  #837  
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Default Re: Quarantine for COVID 19 discussions.

Originally Posted by darkneal
thought i'd ask your opinion on if you think my travel is 'essential'.

Im travelling in march. My work does not change, my job is as a freelance illustrator, i can do my job anywhere in the world as long as there is internet. I will remain self employed free lance in canada initially at least. But technically no, i dont have to be there to work, or anywhere really.

But one reason i do need to go is the time limit on my PR card. You have to be in canada for 3 years out of the 5 the PR card gives you to apply for citizenship. 2 years of the 5 run out in august, meaning i have to be there by august if i want to stay and live in canada for the rest of my life. The first year i didnt go cause i was taking my time, getting everything ready for an optimum move...then the next year covid happened, and ive been waiting patiently for a year now for the right time to go. There isnt going to be one till 2022 at this rate. to make matters worse i had moved home to my Mothers so i could store my stuff, it just made logistical sense. Now ive been stuck here almost a year, without my usual independance, basically dying to get out of here! My mental health isn't great, and thats been turning into physical health problems that i know would clear up the minute i got out of here....

I dont want to wait till the last possible moment to make sure i hit that 3yr target, and i dont see the rules that are in effect or the covid situation being much different in august to what they are right now. They could be worse. there could be no travel. there could be a weeks isolation in a hotel before going to quarantine.

so, is that essential travel?
It's say it's essential travel and you would be exempt, if there is actually such an option of being exempt on this

The statement reads that "new measures" are announced for "non essential travel" like holidays.

You're not on holidays, you're working, whether that's freelance or not, it doesn't matter.

On top of that there are residency obligations to fulfil as a PR to keep your status in Canada.

An obligation can legally never be seen as "non essential" as one is obliged to do something specific under certain conditions.

It's also unclear how exact this text has been written? There is no definition what is deemed "essential" or "non essential". One can only guess that anything leisurely is non essential, business, immigration, returning citizens after work oversees are essential. The "new measures" were "announced" but it was apparently not said, from what date they would be effective?
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Old Feb 6th 2021, 11:13 am
  #838  
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Default Re: Quarantine for COVID 19 discussions.

Originally Posted by darkneal
thought i'd ask your opinion on if you think my travel is 'essential'.

Im travelling in march. My work does not change, my job is as a freelance illustrator, i can do my job anywhere in the world as long as there is internet. I will remain self employed free lance in canada initially at least. But technically no, i dont have to be there to work, or anywhere really.

But one reason i do need to go is the time limit on my PR card. You have to be in canada for 3 years out of the 5 the PR card gives you to apply for citizenship. 2 years of the 5 run out in august, meaning i have to be there by august if i want to stay and live in canada for the rest of my life. The first year i didnt go cause i was taking my time, getting everything ready for an optimum move...then the next year covid happened, and ive been waiting patiently for a year now for the right time to go. There isnt going to be one till 2022 at this rate. to make matters worse i had moved home to my Mothers so i could store my stuff, it just made logistical sense. Now ive been stuck here almost a year, without my usual independance, basically dying to get out of here! My mental health isn't great, and thats been turning into physical health problems that i know would clear up the minute i got out of here....

I dont want to wait till the last possible moment to make sure i hit that 3yr target, and i dont see the rules that are in effect or the covid situation being much different in august to what they are right now. They could be worse. there could be no travel. there could be a weeks isolation in a hotel before going to quarantine.

so, is that essential travel?
I would say yes because no official statement has been made regarding waivers for residency obligation.

For what little it matters, IMHO this was a huge mistake on the part of the Canadian government. There are a lot of PR's who would have been out of the country when the travel restrictions were introduced 11 months ago. Adding a waiver at that point for those PR's who were in safe in another country would have offered those people some assurance as well as the Canadian public. Instead people are either returning during the quarantine and travel restrictions or are going to roll the dice with the H&C process. It doesn't make any sense and just seems like a classic case of bureaucracy for the sake of bureaucracy.
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Old Feb 6th 2021, 10:38 pm
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Default Re: Quarantine for COVID 19 discussions.

Thanks for the replies...but I've cancelled the trip. My anxiety was going at warp speed and i just can't function when this happens, I get little to no sleep. It also is a good indication that i really should be listening to my gut. Its just such a bad time to go, whatever way I looked at it, so i'll keep my options open and more than likely go on a whim during the summer if things have calmed down. Or even wait till the autumn and get the vaccination here first. I'll see if i can find a short-term let here for a bit.

I wonder if the Canadian government will give special dispensation to those of us who have lost years from their PR period because of the pandemic and maybe give those years back? (or at least make re-applying a helluva lot easier for us this time around)
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Old Feb 6th 2021, 11:39 pm
  #840  
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Default Re: Quarantine for COVID 19 discussions.

Originally Posted by darkneal
I wonder if the Canadian government will give special dispensation to those of us who have lost years from their PR period because of the pandemic and maybe give those years back? (or at least make re-applying a helluva lot easier for us this time around)
Sorry to say, but I don't think they will. PR's have been able to return to Canada at any time, so there is no reason why they'd give leeway on the residency obligation IMO.

I agree with the others, that your travel is essential - you are a resident returning to live, that's very different to somebody resident elsewhere wanting a nice holiday.

Last edited by christmasoompa; Feb 7th 2021 at 12:23 am.
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