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Perhaps someone could tell me nicely what they like/dislike about Canada?

Perhaps someone could tell me nicely what they like/dislike about Canada?

Old Aug 9th 2006, 1:59 am
  #136  
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Default Re: Perhaps someone could tell me nicely what they like/dislike about Canada?

[QUOTE=montreal mike]
Originally Posted by dbd33


Also, Harper wasn't elected on a war issue. As I recall the matter didn't even come up. He was the beneficary of a nasty backlash against the corrupt Liberals. He just happened to be lucky and was also in the right place at the right time.

Harper didn't "Win" the election the Liberals "Lost" it because of their incompetence.
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Old Aug 9th 2006, 2:06 am
  #137  
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Default Re: Perhaps someone could tell me nicely what they like/dislike about Canada?

Originally Posted by dbd33


The provinces are not that powerful and the federal government is not that weak, if that were the case gay marriage would still be illegal in some provinces. Quebec enjoys unique clout as the people are the primary embodiment of the francophone heritage so critical to the the country, but I don't think Quebec's power is typical. Do you have examples of other provinces having too much power?
I am strong federalist and I really have no use for the whining provinces. But that was the deal which was made in 1867 and so I won't bellyache about it as it won't change ever.

Quebec has tremendous prpwers. Unlike other provinces it even controls its own immigration and taxation. It also has fascist and repressive language laws. But the feds gave in to Quebec again and again in the past. Ironically that hasn't stopped the secessionist sentiment.
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Old Aug 9th 2006, 2:06 am
  #138  
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Default Re: Perhaps someone could tell me nicely what they like/dislike about Canada?

[QUOTE=flashman]
Originally Posted by montreal mike


Harper didn't "Win" the election the Liberals "Lost" it because of their incompetence.
Agreed!
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Old Aug 9th 2006, 3:04 am
  #139  
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Default Re: Perhaps someone could tell me nicely what they like/dislike about Canada?

Originally Posted by montreal mike
I am strong federalist and I really have no use for the whining provinces. But that was the deal which was made in 1867 and so I won't bellyache about it as it won't change ever.

Quebec has tremendous prpwers. Unlike other provinces it even controls its own immigration and taxation. It also has fascist and repressive language laws. But the feds gave in to Quebec again and again in the past. Ironically that hasn't stopped the secessionist sentiment.
So why does Quebec have tremendous powers?

It seems to me that if Provinces such as Ontario, Alberta, and British Columbia are generating the cash which via Equalization payments are helping fund Quebec, what is that Quebec has that warrants it different treatment from the other Provinces.

I don't know alot about the subject (hence why I'm asking) but I have also read about Quebec wanting to be totally independent, what is the downside of this for the other Provinces? It seems to me it would be easier to say ok, see ya, then it would be one less equalization payment for Ontario, Alberta, and British Columbia to contribute to.

Yes I know this is off topic, i thought of starting a new thread, but as it was a comment on this thread that prompted the question I decided to leave it here......at least it is nothing to do with beavers!
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Old Aug 9th 2006, 3:17 am
  #140  
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Default Re: Perhaps someone could tell me nicely what they like/dislike about Canada?

Originally Posted by montreal mike
I was in Ottawa for a year and didn't like it at all. Now I hasten to add this is not a criticism of Ottawa because I know some who simply adore the place.

I didn't.

I have been to every major city in this land as I often was away for long stretches at a time on business.

There are many things I dislike about Quebec province but in total they are not serious enough to get me to move.

As for the PM, well his power is limited. He governs from a minority postion. Even if he were elected with a parliamentary majority, he still has to please (appease?) the provinces. Plus, there are so many areas under provincial control, for example healthCare, law, education.

Heck, this county doesn't even have something as basic as a federal securities commission!

I contend that we are really ten countries in one.
Law is under provincial control? It depends just what laws you are referring to.

Criminal Law is exclusively under Federal jurisdiction. That's a very big deal indeed. Plus, the PM has the power to appoint all of the higher level judges across the entire country - all the judges above the Provincial Courts. The Federal Government's influence on Canada's court system is tremendous and far, far greater than any provincial influence.

The Feds have jurisdiction on whether Canada goes to war or not, and has jurisdiction over international treaties (eg. NAFTA). The Feds also have great powers regarding taxation - as do the provinces. Healthcare is not exclusively under provincial control in the sense that the Feds can penalize the provinces financially if they don't abide by the rules of the Canada Health Act. This already happened to Alberta - and Alberta backed down.

You are right to say that the provinces have a lot of power, but to claim that Canada is like ten countries in one is engaging in hyperbole. The PM has to appease the provinces no more than the provinces have to appease the PM!

The fact that we currently have a minority Federal Government is a non sequitur to the issue you are arguing. The powers of the provinces don't change whether or not we have a minority government at the federal level.

You have wrongly purported that Canada's Federal Government is not very significant in the lives of Canadians. You have a right to your opinions, but you have absolutely no right to misstate the facts.

I hope you don't mind by bluntness.

Last edited by oceanMDX; Aug 9th 2006 at 3:57 am.
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Old Aug 9th 2006, 3:51 am
  #141  
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Default Re: Perhaps someone could tell me nicely what they like/dislike about Canada?

Originally Posted by montreal mike
Quebec has tremendous prpwers. Unlike other provinces it even controls its own immigration and taxation. It also has fascist and repressive language laws. But the feds gave in to Quebec again and again in the past. Ironically that hasn't stopped the secessionist sentiment.
Sorry, but you clearly don't know what you are talking about. Quebec has no more "powers" than any other province. Other provinces (like Quebec) have made immigration agreements with the Federal Government - but the constitutional power remains with the Federal Government. Quebec operates is own pension program, but other provinces can do the same thing. Alberta recently considered doing this but decided not to.

Quebec has language laws that are in violation of certain provisions of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms that are contained within the Constitution Act, 1982. They are able (just like any other province) to get around this by using the "notwithstanding clause" in the Constitution Act, 1982.

http://laws.justice.gc.ca/en/const/annex_e.html#I

Quebec's ability to tax is no greater than any other province.

Look, you are spreading disinformation, please cut it out and do a little research before you post.

Last edited by oceanMDX; Aug 9th 2006 at 4:01 am.
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Old Aug 9th 2006, 4:07 am
  #142  
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Default Re: Perhaps someone could tell me nicely what they like/dislike about Canada?

[QUOTE=flashman]
Originally Posted by montreal mike


Harper didn't "Win" the election the Liberals "Lost" it because of their incompetence.
Thats a lot like saying Blair didnt win the election for Labour, the Tories lost it way back when.

Well, he seems to keep on winning them, and if Harper doesnt screw up, there is a chance he might keep winning them too.
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Old Aug 9th 2006, 4:11 am
  #143  
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Default Re: Perhaps someone could tell me nicely what they like/dislike about Canada?

Originally Posted by oceanMDX
Sorry, but you clearly don't know what you are talking about. Quebec has no more "powers" than any other province.

Quebec has language laws that are in violation of certain provisions of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms that are contained within the Constitution Act, 1982.

Quebec's ability to tax is no greater than any other province.

Look, you are spreading disinformation, please cut it out and do a little research before you post.
Sorry but here I beg to differ. This is not spreading misinformation. Let's say we agree to disagree and leave it at that. Readers are free to do their own research which BTW they should.
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Old Aug 9th 2006, 4:13 am
  #144  
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Default Re: Perhaps someone could tell me nicely what they like/dislike about Canada?

[QUOTE=flashman]
Originally Posted by montreal mike


Harper didn't "Win" the election the Liberals "Lost" it because of their incompetence.

I agree, Canadians held their noses and voted for Harper due to Liberal Party (Quebec wing) corruption. If Harper isn't real careful, he could get voted out at the next opportunity if the Liberals are able to get their act together in time.

Most Canadians don't care for his (Harper) militarism and sucking up to Bush.
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Old Aug 9th 2006, 4:15 am
  #145  
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Default Re: Perhaps someone could tell me nicely what they like/dislike about Canada?

Originally Posted by montreal mike
Sorry but here I beg to differ. This is not spreading misinformation. Let's say we agree to disagree and leave it at that. Readers are free to do their own research which BTW they should.
No let's not, opinions are opinions and facts are facts. Don't you know the difference? It's amusing that you can't back anything you have said.
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Old Aug 9th 2006, 4:17 am
  #146  
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Default Re: Perhaps someone could tell me nicely what they like/dislike about Canada?

Originally Posted by montreal mike
I disagree. Multiculturism does nothing. It is costly and unnnecessary; it is actually divisive and counterproductive.

I much prefer the Yanks who take the melting pot approach.

Canada needs tons of immigrants. But the Feds don't have to bend over backwards trying to make them all feel welcome and helping them celebrate their respective heritages and cultures. Newcomers can do all that by themseves without any costly government funding.
Many newcommers do do that without any costly government funding, but its nice to feel welcome, and is one of canadas selling points in the international skills market. That and the fact its like the USA but much easier to get into.

If you compare interracial assault in Canada vs the US, you will find that the yank approach is far more divisive and counterproductive than the canadian way.
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Old Aug 9th 2006, 4:19 am
  #147  
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Default Re: Perhaps someone could tell me nicely what they like/dislike about Canada?

Originally Posted by oceanMDX
Law is under provincial control? It depends just what laws you are referring to.

Criminal Law is exclusively under Federal jurisdiction. That's a very big deal indeed. Plus, the PM has the power to appoint all of the higher level judges across the entire country - all the judges above the Provincial Courts. The Federal Government's influence on Canada's court system is tremendous and far, far greater than any provincial influence.

The Feds have jurisdiction on whether Canada goes to war or not, and has jurisdiction over international treaties (eg. NAFTA). The Feds also have great powers regarding taxation - as do the provinces. Healthcare is not exclusively under provincial control in the sense that the Feds can penalize the provinces financially if they don't abide by the rules of the Canada Health Act. This already happened to Alberta - and Alberta backed down.

You are right to say that the provinces have a lot of power, but to claim that Canada is like ten countries in one is engaging in hyperbole. The PM has to appease the provinces no more than the provinces have to appease the PM!

The fact that we currently have a minority Federal Government is a non sequitur to the issue you are arguing. The powers of the provinces don't change whether or not we have a minority government at the federal level.

You have wrongly purported that Canada's Federal Government is not very significant in the lives of Canadians. You have a right to your opinions, but you have absolutely no right to misstate the facts.

I hope you don't mind by bluntness.
I am not misstating the facts. I still contend that the provinces have far too much power.

As far as federal powers are concerned, there is such a thing as a disallowance clause which the Feds have not used in over 60 years. This, if used, would nullify provincial legislation. That is why Quebec can get away with its repressive language laws.

And, No, I don't mind bluntness. That is fine by me.
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Old Aug 9th 2006, 4:23 am
  #148  
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Default Re: Perhaps someone could tell me nicely what they like/dislike about Canada?

Originally Posted by oceanMDX
No let's not, opinions are opinions and facts are facts. Don't you know the difference? It's amusing that you can't back anything you have said.
I don't find it the least amusing. I am giving my views. Take them or leave them. It matters not. This is not a black and white issue. There are shades of grey. Many.

Bottom line is that we both have a fundamentally different philosophy. I contend that the Feds should have ALL the powers. I have no use for provinces. Provinces are surplus and redundant. (And Yes I know that won't change).

I hope you get my drift.

Last edited by montreal mike; Aug 9th 2006 at 4:29 am.
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Old Aug 9th 2006, 4:33 am
  #149  
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Default Re: Perhaps someone could tell me nicely what they like/dislike about Canada?

Originally Posted by montreal mike
I am not misstating the facts. I still contend that the provinces have far too much power.

As far as federal powers are concerned, there is such a thing as a disallowance clause which the Feds have not used in over 60 years. This, if used, would nullify provincial legislation. That is why Quebec can get away with its repressive language laws.

And, No, I don't mind bluntness. That is fine by me.
"Disallowance" is a Federal power that is considered obsolete. If it were to be used it would nullify provincial legislation. Currently, Quebec only has to use the "nothwithstanding clause" in the Constitution to uphold legislation that is in violation of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disallo...nd_reservation
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Old Aug 9th 2006, 4:35 am
  #150  
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Default Re: Perhaps someone could tell me nicely what they like/dislike about Canada?

Originally Posted by mjanovitz
So why does Quebec have tremendous powers?

It seems to me that if Provinces such as Ontario, Alberta, and British Columbia are generating the cash which via Equalization payments are helping fund Quebec, what is that Quebec has that warrants it different treatment from the other Provinces.

I don't know alot about the subject (hence why I'm asking) but I have also read about Quebec wanting to be totally independent, what is the downside of this for the other Provinces? It seems to me it would be easier to say ok, see ya, then it would be one less equalization payment for Ontario, Alberta, and British Columbia to contribute to.

Yes I know this is off topic, i thought of starting a new thread, but as it was a comment on this thread that prompted the question I decided to leave it here......at least it is nothing to do with beavers!
Quebec has always been the biggest whiner of the bunch. And it has been very successful. It has its own pension plan, taxation, and controls it's own immigration.

Why other provinces don't demand the same I will never know.

Caution: Please do check my facts. I have been accused of misleading.
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