Ontario teachers certifiate
Jan 24th 2007, 4:35 am
#31
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Re: Ontario teachers certifiate
Jan 24th 2007, 6:02 am
#32
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Re: Ontario teachers certifiate
I have applied to do a teaching qualification year in Ontario as I was told unofficially by someone at the OCT that my GTP qualification wasn't recognised here. Apparently only 10% of applicants are accepted on the course and I won't find out until April if I'm one of the lucky ones. I might still submit all my paperwork to the OCT but it is extra money I don't have just to apply.
Jan 24th 2007, 8:27 am
#33
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Re: Ontario teachers certifiate
I was offered a job at Mathews hall but turned it down because it only paid $47,000 and would have meant me living in London midweek (My family and I live near Barrie) and paying rent. I can earn roughly the same by staying home and supplying.
A few observations from my point of view for the original poster:-
Supply work in Canada is very poorly paid compared to the UK...if you could work every day in a year you'd be lucky to break $34,000. They pay you one flat rate regardless of qualifications or experience.
Next step is usually an LTO (long term occasional) which again is paid at most boards at the bottom rate regardless of experience....this is like a stepping stone to a contract job. The LTO teacher does exactly the same work as a contract teacher but is paid substantially less. When I asked one of the board members why this was the case he did not have an answer...."hey how about I don't work so hard then as an LTO" I was tempted to say!
Finally I thought all payment problems would be over with a contract job...not so:-
1. Most teachers in Britain go to uni for 4 years max. In Canada it is 5 years (4 undergrad and 1 teaching) so their pay scale grid will reward you an extra stipend for the 5th year (I don't think we can eke out a teaching degree to 5 years in the UK can we?).
2. In the UK you get paid the same whether you got a 1st, 2.1 or 2.2 degree and somewhat less if you got a 3rd. The boards divide those categories up even more..so you get paid more for a 1st, less for a 2.1...and so on.
3. At the board I am working they refuse to recognise my 23 years of experience which was gained outside the holy of holies hontario! Only experience in Ontario/maybe Canada counts!!!
Upshot is I left a $120,000 job in Germany, where I was hiring Canadians, to a $40,000 job in Ontario.....similar story for some other professions!
A few observations from my point of view for the original poster:-
Supply work in Canada is very poorly paid compared to the UK...if you could work every day in a year you'd be lucky to break $34,000. They pay you one flat rate regardless of qualifications or experience.
Next step is usually an LTO (long term occasional) which again is paid at most boards at the bottom rate regardless of experience....this is like a stepping stone to a contract job. The LTO teacher does exactly the same work as a contract teacher but is paid substantially less. When I asked one of the board members why this was the case he did not have an answer...."hey how about I don't work so hard then as an LTO" I was tempted to say!
Finally I thought all payment problems would be over with a contract job...not so:-
1. Most teachers in Britain go to uni for 4 years max. In Canada it is 5 years (4 undergrad and 1 teaching) so their pay scale grid will reward you an extra stipend for the 5th year (I don't think we can eke out a teaching degree to 5 years in the UK can we?).
2. In the UK you get paid the same whether you got a 1st, 2.1 or 2.2 degree and somewhat less if you got a 3rd. The boards divide those categories up even more..so you get paid more for a 1st, less for a 2.1...and so on.
3. At the board I am working they refuse to recognise my 23 years of experience which was gained outside the holy of holies hontario! Only experience in Ontario/maybe Canada counts!!!
Upshot is I left a $120,000 job in Germany, where I was hiring Canadians, to a $40,000 job in Ontario.....similar story for some other professions!
You must be going crazy knowing that they aren't recognising your 23 years! I think our board recognises experience in other parts of Canada (not sure about international experience yet!) but your place on the seniority list is only determined by how many years you have served in our particular school board. Movement within school boards and other parts of Canada is not encouraged!
What kind of teaching job did you have in Germany? It must have been more than the average classroom teacher? In our board a top of the scale teacher with 10 years of experience can earn up to $84,000 as a regular class teacher. Private schools are paid notably less over here I've noticed!
Jan 24th 2007, 8:29 am
#34
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Re: Ontario teachers certifiate
I have applied to do a teaching qualification year in Ontario as I was told unofficially by someone at the OCT that my GTP qualification wasn't recognised here. Apparently only 10% of applicants are accepted on the course and I won't find out until April if I'm one of the lucky ones. I might still submit all my paperwork to the OCT but it is extra money I don't have just to apply.
I've heard that the competition is fierce over here for a place in teacher's college. Many Canadians go to the States (Buffalo) or even Australia to get qualified and then come back here to teach. My daughter's teacher trained in Scotalnd (PGCE) so I know she has been well trained!!
Jan 24th 2007, 8:33 am
#35
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Re: Ontario teachers certifiate
I tried to get my qualifications recognised through the OCT but ws turned down, even though the school board (Simcoe) interviewed me and said I would have a job as soon as I got the OCT clearance, as did many principals I spoke to! It took the OCT 2 years to decide to turn me down and tell me I would have to do the year Teachers course here for them to be able to consider me again, not practical, too expensive and miles away from where I live! They turned me down because of the way I gained the teaching qualification in England, training whilst working in a school for a year and a half (I already had my Honours degree, and many specialist teaching qualifications) didn't sit well with them. It still annoys the hell out of me, expecially now there are places offering teaching bridging courses to teachers from abroad who do not speak English as a first language! As it turns out I do not think I could have worked in Ontario schools (my 2 kids are in the system) way too much moaning and whining and way to controlled by the unions.
Jan 24th 2007, 11:17 am
#36
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Re: Ontario teachers certifiate
I have applied to do a teaching qualification year in Ontario as I was told unofficially by someone at the OCT that my GTP qualification wasn't recognised here. Apparently only 10% of applicants are accepted on the course and I won't find out until April if I'm one of the lucky ones. I might still submit all my paperwork to the OCT but it is extra money I don't have just to apply.
Jan 24th 2007, 11:17 am
#37
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Re: Ontario teachers certifiate
that should be hear about!!
Jan 25th 2007, 1:45 am
#38
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Re: Ontario teachers certifiate
My thought is to teach clinical radiography here, and post grad stuff. But its only a half baked idea so far . Needs more ingredients I think
Jan 25th 2007, 8:05 am
#39
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Re: Ontario teachers certifiate
Hi!
Firstly i should intro myself
My name is chris and my wife and i are just at the beginning of the process of moving to canada, ontario is one of our target destinations. we have two yougn children.
I am an FE teacher in the UK and have been teaching for the last 5years full time, doing music, music technology and media. I have a Cert.Ed and an HND in music technology. What are my chances of being able to teach in Canada and does anyone have any advice for me please?
Thank you!
Firstly i should intro myself
My name is chris and my wife and i are just at the beginning of the process of moving to canada, ontario is one of our target destinations. we have two yougn children.
I am an FE teacher in the UK and have been teaching for the last 5years full time, doing music, music technology and media. I have a Cert.Ed and an HND in music technology. What are my chances of being able to teach in Canada and does anyone have any advice for me please?
Thank you!
Jan 25th 2007, 12:01 pm
#40
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 38
Re: Ontario teachers certifiate
That sounds awful! Our board pays you according to your QECO rating and years of experience for LTO assignments which is something, but just the basic rate for every day supply work.
You must be going crazy knowing that they aren't recognising your 23 years! I think our board recognises experience in other parts of Canada (not sure about international experience yet!) but your place on the seniority list is only determined by how many years you have served in our particular school board. Movement within school boards and other parts of Canada is not encouraged!
What kind of teaching job did you have in Germany? It must have been more than the average classroom teacher? In our board a top of the scale teacher with 10 years of experience can earn up to $84,000 as a regular class teacher. Private schools are paid notably less over here I've noticed!
You must be going crazy knowing that they aren't recognising your 23 years! I think our board recognises experience in other parts of Canada (not sure about international experience yet!) but your place on the seniority list is only determined by how many years you have served in our particular school board. Movement within school boards and other parts of Canada is not encouraged!
What kind of teaching job did you have in Germany? It must have been more than the average classroom teacher? In our board a top of the scale teacher with 10 years of experience can earn up to $84,000 as a regular class teacher. Private schools are paid notably less over here I've noticed!
Am thinking of flying to the UK to do a couple of weeks supply...did that a couple of years ago when I was waiting for immigration and OCT....couple of days in the uk should pay for the off season flight!...plus it's tax free...as long as I don't tell anyone. Actually come to think of it wouldn't be a bad idea to earn the tax free min in the UK and Germany and AUstralia...ie) doa month here and there not tell the canadians!
Anyway back to why I'm replying.
I worked at an international school in Germany wehre pay and condition swere phenominal...good gross, plus extras for HOD, parents evenings, sports caoching, per diem for trips away which was most weekends...london, paris, vienna, brussels even cairo...plus in November a 13th month bonus..ie) double pay....still much better living here in Angus, whilst I wait in a barrie emerg queue for 7 hours!
Feb 2nd 2007, 1:52 am
#41
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Re: Ontario teachers certifiate
I'm afraid I'm not sure what extra training they may ask you to do (personally, I don't think they will ask you to do more training but I don't know for sure!). If you end up in London, I would be more than happy to help you and put you in touch with the right people
!! The local school board isn't very forthcoming with information and I've had to learn as I've gone along so I would be more than happy to help you. It's all about networking and connections and I've finally made some!
Chris
!! The local school board isn't very forthcoming with information and I've had to learn as I've gone along so I would be more than happy to help you. It's all about networking and connections and I've finally made some!Chris
My husband has now been offered a promotion in this area with the option of relocating to Canada in 18 months to 2 years time. It looks as though we are going to go for this option as it will give me the chance to get a further qualification here to ensure I can get certified to teach when we do go over. Just wanted to ask your opinion, as you mentioned you have a masters degree, do you think completing a masters would bring me into line with the OCT requirements for all teachers to have 4 years of higher education. It would mean that I will have completed 3 years of a BA in Primary Ed and then a year doing the Masters. I would of thought that this would be sufficient to ensure there is no technicalities they could refuse me on?
Feb 2nd 2007, 5:45 am
#42
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Re: Ontario teachers certifiate
Hi Chris,
My husband has now been offered a promotion in this area with the option of relocating to Canada in 18 months to 2 years time. It looks as though we are going to go for this option as it will give me the chance to get a further qualification here to ensure I can get certified to teach when we do go over. Just wanted to ask your opinion, as you mentioned you have a masters degree, do you think completing a masters would bring me into line with the OCT requirements for all teachers to have 4 years of higher education. It would mean that I will have completed 3 years of a BA in Primary Ed and then a year doing the Masters. I would of thought that this would be sufficient to ensure there is no technicalities they could refuse me on?
My husband has now been offered a promotion in this area with the option of relocating to Canada in 18 months to 2 years time. It looks as though we are going to go for this option as it will give me the chance to get a further qualification here to ensure I can get certified to teach when we do go over. Just wanted to ask your opinion, as you mentioned you have a masters degree, do you think completing a masters would bring me into line with the OCT requirements for all teachers to have 4 years of higher education. It would mean that I will have completed 3 years of a BA in Primary Ed and then a year doing the Masters. I would of thought that this would be sufficient to ensure there is no technicalities they could refuse me on?
First of all, congratulations! We really like living here and once you get in, teaching is a good job to be in. As far as the Masters is concerned, I think it is a really good idea. I don't think you would have any problems being recognised but I would try your best to try and get an answer out of the OCT if you can just to make sure! Keep hounding them - emailing, phoning, writing until they give you some kind of an answer about it.
The other good thing about having a Masters degree is that it puts you at the top of the pay scale as far as qualifications go. Also, if you ever want to become a Principal in this school board, you have to have a Masters anyway - just in case you ever want to go that route at some point!
Keep in touch (you can send me a PM and we can swap email addresses) so that once you get over here, I can help you get into the system!
Take care,
Chris
Mar 14th 2007, 7:14 am
#43
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Posts: 26
Re: Ontario teachers certifiate
Have found this thread really useful. Looks like by the time my qualifications get recognized I would be ready to retire.
I know that in Quebec they have teachers aides who work with SEN pupils. Do any school - elementary - operate a system where the teacher has an assistant who helps with displays, small group work etc like we have in UK now?
Thanks Kate
I know that in Quebec they have teachers aides who work with SEN pupils. Do any school - elementary - operate a system where the teacher has an assistant who helps with displays, small group work etc like we have in UK now?
Thanks Kate
Mar 14th 2007, 8:12 am
#44
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Posts: 453
Re: Ontario teachers certifiate
Have found this thread really useful. Looks like by the time my qualifications get recognized I would be ready to retire.
I know that in Quebec they have teachers aides who work with SEN pupils. Do any school - elementary - operate a system where the teacher has an assistant who helps with displays, small group work etc like we have in UK now?
Thanks Kate
I know that in Quebec they have teachers aides who work with SEN pupils. Do any school - elementary - operate a system where the teacher has an assistant who helps with displays, small group work etc like we have in UK now?
Thanks Kate
As far as I am aware, EAs are only provided for safety reasons - not sure what that means exactly but it translates into teachers having virtually no EAs and definitely not for group work, generally helping out etc. In the UK, I had access to 2 EAs at various times during the day. Here, it is rare to have an EA in the class. Normally parent volunteers help out with those kind of jobs and from what I have seen, teachers here rely more on whole class teaching than group work. Differentiation seems to be fairly new terminology.
Apr 18th 2007, 12:11 pm
#45
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Re: Ontario teachers certifiate
Yep - I think I might be be ready to retire by the time I get a permanent job! The 'who you know, not what you know' philosophy is very big around here too. The other day I had an interview for a permanent Grade 1 job. I didn't get the job. The person who got the job has very little experience and a basic teacher's qualification but she was the daughter of the retiring teacher so she was the obvious choice! I'm not bitter
As far as I am aware, EAs are only provided for safety reasons - not sure what that means exactly but it translates into teachers having virtually no EAs and definitely not for group work, generally helping out etc. In the UK, I had access to 2 EAs at various times during the day. Here, it is rare to have an EA in the class. Normally parent volunteers help out with those kind of jobs and from what I have seen, teachers here rely more on whole class teaching than group work. Differentiation seems to be fairly new terminology.
As far as I am aware, EAs are only provided for safety reasons - not sure what that means exactly but it translates into teachers having virtually no EAs and definitely not for group work, generally helping out etc. In the UK, I had access to 2 EAs at various times during the day. Here, it is rare to have an EA in the class. Normally parent volunteers help out with those kind of jobs and from what I have seen, teachers here rely more on whole class teaching than group work. Differentiation seems to be fairly new terminology.
I moved here 6 years ago from Bristol as a PGCE qualified teacher (French/German) I was lucky to already be a Canadian citizen before arriving.
I started teaching in a private school here in Toronto who immediately recognised my PGCE (as well as my French CAPES) qualifications. You do not need to be Canadian-trained in order to teach in private school in Ontario, though knowing the right people and performance in interviews will help.
I applied to become a member of the OCT (in order to join the Teachers' Pension Plan) and it took a great deal of paperwork and patience before I was accepted. They recognised my PGCE without a problem.
Last year, I decided to leave the private system and join the TDSB (Toronto District School Board) Tons more paperwork, but they accepted my PGCE without a question. Be armed with patience and a willingness to politely push for details and to speak with supervisors if necessary. Usually, the OCT and TDSB phone lines are answered by receptionists only. They will take down your details and questions and you MIGHT get a call back. Insist, insist, insist.
Once in the TDSB, you have to deal with the OSSTF (teachers' union) in order for your pay to be determined (years of experience - including foreign - and qualifications) More paperwork. More patience needed.
Happy ending - I am now teaching in a public school which I completely enjoy. Yes, the system is different from England - with its advantages and disadvantages.
It was a huge headache to get here, but my experience moving and working all around the globe has taught me that it's the same story everywhere. (Try renewing a British passport from Boston!)
Countries like Canada with huge immigrant flows will have lots of bureaucracy. Arm yourself with patience and consider yourself lucky you aren't immigrating under life-threatening conditions (although another year of Cilla Black may well have pushed me over the edge!!)
