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The old "Quality of Life" discussion ...

The old "Quality of Life" discussion ...

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Old Jan 23rd 2010, 5:53 pm
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Default The old "Quality of Life" discussion ...

Watch out - another essay from ann m.

How do you define "quality of life" ?

I've been having discussions with my husband and friends in recent weeks as to what we feel represents "quality" in our new life in Canada (and to some extent what we felt represented quality in our old life in the UK). Are the elements the same in each location ?

We all come out with the usual thoughts of good health, 'enough' money in the bank (whatever that means), enough 'time' to do what we want, opportunities, and happy children.

But then we got on to discussing the silly things, the material things, invisible things, feelings, emotions and a whole list of girly stuff like that

There are a whole host of little things about my life in Canada which build to a bigger picture - none of them on their own are significant. And none of them on their own would or could persuade me that life is better in one place nor the other. But when you put them all together - well, perhaps you will see my picture now?

I think that now (as opposed to the 20-yr old or 30-yr old version of me) I view "quality of life" as those things in my life that are easy, smooth, hassle and stress-free and not causing me to grind my teeth. Other people may not get that - or need that.

So, apart from being healthy or having happy children, here is a list of my insignificant "quality of life" issues - and yes, it is a truly daft list when taken individually or out of context of what I've just tried to say above
In no particular order ...

* not having to pay for parking (with city centre exceptions)
* finding a parking space - and one that is big and easy to manoeuvre
* having a huge washing machine that takes about 3 times the quantity of a european machine
* having a large and powerful shower
* I don't really notice groups of young people when I see them, apart from a momentary dislike of a tattoo or choice in hair dye - I am in my 40's afterall, it is expected that I won't appreciate their fashion choices - but I don't notice accents, swearing, brewing atmospheres or ill-intent
* having a home with more square footage than I really need - ie, space for our family to spread out and remove ourselves from each other occasionally
* having a home with more square footage than I really need - which makes the stacking of a month's worth of recycling really easy
* living in a town where a traffic jam is represented by five cars at the lights, or the barriers going down for one of the long trains
* having an electric garage door opener - and a garage into which two cars actually fit
* not having a mortgage
* forgetting to lock my front door and then not having to assume the place will have been burgled when I get back
* giving my children "playtime" freedom within their neighbourhood that I do not believe would be possible in my experiences of neighbourhoods in the the UK
* stunning views and big, high, open skies - a feeling of personal space and a literal breath of fresh air
* being able to choose a day on a ski-hill if we really want to
* finding the time to join a choir
* husband finding the time to learn to paraglide, or ski, or mountain-bike, or plan triathlons (good god)
* driving my Dodge Caravan sofa-with-snow-tyres and enjoying a big easy vehicle
* lack of hedges and tiny, curvy roads make driving here so easy (to the point of mindless sometimes, but mostly, just easy)

Do you see where I'm coming from? Stop laughing at my shallow-ness.

And here is a list of "quality of life" issues I have not - or cannot find here.

* unconditional love of my children by others - by aunts, uncles, cousins, friends of mine
* Grandparents coming to a dance recital or the school assembly
* friends to get pissed with, and not have to think about what they really think of me
* green landscapes and spring bulbs, in the spring
* easy, stress-free dog walking
* having a home with more square footage than I need - have you tried to clean these buggers ... it's a love-hate relationship. I love having this home, I hate cleaning it, heating it, fixing it. I am allowed to be contrary.
* M&S food hall
* being conscious of "me" every time I open my mouth - I am fatigued with being conscious of me
* a momentary feeling of guilt when someone in the household is having a crap day - totally irrational but that's not the point
* I don't think I want to grow old and die here

No idea now what the point of this ramble was really. Over to you guys.
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Old Jan 23rd 2010, 5:59 pm
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Default Re: The old "Quality of Life" discussion ...

Fly and be happy
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Old Jan 23rd 2010, 6:25 pm
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Default Re: The old "Quality of Life" discussion ...

I'll chip in with twopennorth...to say that your list is intelligent and sympathetic. Although 'quality of life' may well be what we make it, it does help to have the wherewithal and the surroundings that help make our personal comfort zone as large as possible.

I like living here in Mexico for: year-round warm climate; good, affordable, private schools; good, affordable, private health-care; a stronger sense of 'community morality'; no public drunkenness; no beggars (incredible, but true!); cheap food; cheap petrol; more disposable income etc etc.

But I balance this against: institutional corruption; lawlessness; little community spirit; pervasive fear of being targeted by opportunist criminals such as kidnappers; general disregard for larger community welfare etc etc

The grass may well be greener on the other side...until you get over there to find its a hostile jungle rather than a benignly pleasant meadow.
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Old Jan 23rd 2010, 7:57 pm
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Default Re: The old "Quality of Life" discussion ...

Hi ann m ... i enjoyed reading your post. We're in London still but have seriously started looking into moving to Canada. I'm in the fortunate position to have married a Canadian so can go through the sponsorship route. The main reason we're looking at the move is for 'quality of life'. Although as you say, what does that really mean? I'd like a safer environment to bring up my young family, to be able to give them opportunities that they wouldn't neccesarily have here in the UK, a bigger house and just a general nicer all round life. Of course, it's a big decision but someone once told me 'if you jump, you land' and i've tended to adopt that mentality, certainly in my career. I'm late thirties, have worked very hard for 20+ years and certainly don't have rose tinted glasses on. The grass isn't always greener (I expect it to be white alot of the time in fact!) but if we do decide to move we will embrace Canada & will try not to compare constantly to our life in the UK. Some things will be better, some will be worse. I will be prepared for that. So long as we're happy and healthy, I reckon the quality of life issue will look after itself.
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Old Jan 23rd 2010, 8:22 pm
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Default Re: The old "Quality of Life" discussion ...

Originally Posted by The Aviator
Fly and be happy
I'll second that.
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Old Jan 23rd 2010, 8:27 pm
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Default Re: The old "Quality of Life" discussion ...

Originally Posted by The Aviator
Fly and be happy
Originally Posted by Simon Legree
I'll second that.
If god had meant man to fly he/she would have given him wings.

However as man insists then I was quite happy to sit up in the tower and control.
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Old Jan 23rd 2010, 8:29 pm
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Default Re: The old "Quality of Life" discussion ...

Originally Posted by chobert
but if we do decide to move we will embrace Canada & will try not to compare constantly to our life in the UK. Some things will be better, some will be worse. I will be prepared for that. So long as we're happy and healthy, I reckon the quality of life issue will look after itself.
And that is the crux, isn't it?

I think, on the whole, we have settled pretty well, and while I could join in the "Orange Squash and Bacon" threads - I have adjusted and got on with my life here and it is mostly good.

But on those days when you settle down to watch your kid's show in a quietened school hall or theatre, you feel a very small group - just you and dad - wide smiles and big "thumbs up" from the seats - while your neighbours bring a row of eight proud and noisy relatives to support from the front row.

Little things like that completely throw me some days



In the meantime - fly and be happy sounds simple and great to me - where do I sign up?
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Old Jan 23rd 2010, 8:30 pm
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Default Re: The old "Quality of Life" discussion ...

That's a very interesting question Ann, and a great list.

Before we moved here our longtime and very good Canadian friend said that I would hate working here as an x-ray tech but enjoy the quality of life. I find that I enjoy my work as I work with very lovely people, I did get irritated by Canadian medicine and having to do work that is considered out of date in the UK, but basically work here is better for me as now I am a drone and previously I was stressed out, burnt out by the job I had then-management stuff.

As for life style we haven't really noticed any difference except that we have more space around us. I'm not sure what my friend meant by the lifetstyle either. We haven't made any friends in spite of trying desperately hard. I've now decided that it's me and won't be bothering any more.

I'll add to your list to see how they work for me

Originally Posted by ann m
Watch out - another essay from ann m.

* not having to pay for parking (with city centre exceptions) Yep
* finding a parking space - and one that is big and easy to manoeuvre Yep
* having a huge washing machine that takes about 3 times the quantity of a european machine I have this, but am not moved by it. The washing powders/liquids rip the colours out of clothes here
* having a large and powerful shower. No
* I don't really notice groups of young people when I see them, apart from a momentary dislike of a tattoo or choice in hair dye - I am in my 40's afterall, it is expected that I won't appreciate their fashion choices - but I don't notice accents, swearing, brewing atmospheres or ill-intent. I agree with this, unless you disturb the kids having their bush parties.
* having a home with more square footage than I really need - ie, space for our family to spread out and remove ourselves from each other occasionally. Ours is the same size but the gardens are many many times larger and this is lovely. Plus the house is in a village and we have river access and a dock.
* living in a town where a traffic jam is represented by five cars at the lights, or the barriers going down for one of the long trains Yep
* having an electric garage door opener - and a garage into which two cars actually fit. Hah we have this but the garage is full of crud.
* not having a mortgage Yep
* forgetting to lock my front door and then not having to assume the place will have been burgled when I get back. Yes to this but it wasn't bad where we were before
* giving my children "playtime" freedom within their neighbourhood that I do not believe would be possible in my experiences of neighbourhoods in the the UK. No kids, but it is nice to see the kids playing out in the street
* stunning views and big, high, open skies - a feeling of personal space and a literal breath of fresh air Very true, would have had to be wealthy to get this in the UK
* being able to choose a day on a ski-hill if we really want to. No interest in this but we could if we wanted to.
* finding the time to join a choir. Odd shifts makes evening activities hard to do.
* husband finding the time to learn to paraglide, or ski, or mountain-bike, or plan triathlons (good god) Husband too worn out from work to do anything but eat a meal and sleep
* driving my Dodge Caravan sofa-with-snow-tyres and enjoying a big easy vehicle. Scabby Saturn, missing my lovely Clio
* lack of hedges and tiny, curvy roads make driving here so easy (to the point of mindless sometimes, but mostly, just easy) I liked driving on the windy roads, and we have some round here but few hedges.

And here is a list of "quality of life" issues I have not - or cannot find here.

* friends to get pissed with, and not have to think about what they really think of me/ So true
* green landscapes and spring bulbs, in the spring True
* M&S food hall and Waitrose. Also I hate shopping here. The quality of fruit and veggies is terrible. Yesterday I shopped in Toronto and what they were taking off to sell as reduced items was better than the full price stuff here. The shops are grubby and miserable and I have to go to several to buy what we need. Lazy maybe but life's too short to spend following the bloddy flyers.
* being conscious of "me" every time I open my mouth - I am fatigued with being conscious of me. I so understand this
* I don't think I want to grow old and die here. I know I don't

No idea now what the point of this ramble was really. Over to you guys.
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Old Jan 23rd 2010, 8:31 pm
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Default Re: The old "Quality of Life" discussion ...

Originally Posted by Steve_P
If god had meant man to fly he/she would have given him wings.

However as man insists then I was quite happy to sit up in the tower and control.
And I sir, for one, am glad that you did. Thanks for keeping us organized and safe.
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Old Jan 23rd 2010, 8:31 pm
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Default Re: The old "Quality of Life" discussion ...

Hey Ann

What a bloomin' essay

I think that you covered it really well and little things are nothing but some days when you have a bad day and a couple come up together that is what makes you wonder about the quality of life etc.

For us in the UK both me and the OH worked in excess of 50 hours per week each and very career orientated - in fact we were 2 one parent families living in the same house

Quality of life for us is to not have the god awful commutes and be home at a decent time for the family, me having finally given up an all consuming UK career and being content working casual at a bank (something I dont think I would have ever done had I ever stayed in the UK) being worry free ish about what our kids are up to when not at home.

I do miss the grandparent thing for sure for the kids but think that the couple of great expat friends which I have and my Canadian friends more than make up for that - thinking about it it is these people who love us and the kids for who and what we are not because they feel they have to love us as they are family.

As I am here longer this quality of life will only get better and better as I watch the kids grow into adults and have their own families - now to me that will be my bliss in life
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Old Jan 23rd 2010, 8:50 pm
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Default Re: The old "Quality of Life" discussion ...

Originally Posted by ann m
But on those days when you settle down to watch your kid's show in a quietened school hall or theatre, you feel a very small group - just you and dad - wide smiles and big "thumbs up" from the seats - while your neighbours bring a row of eight proud and noisy relatives to support from the front row.

Little things like that completely throw me some days
Ann a wonderful original post as usual. I've been here too long to actually comment on any part of that (went native years and years ago) other than to say I do very much like the idea of being so close to a major hospital.

However you don't have to be an immigrant to be the only ones in the audience for kids recitals or competitions. We were in the same boat when our two boys were growing up as what family I had in Canada lived in Edmonton and Mrs_P's family moved out to Vancouver Island, so there was always just us.

This is a major reason we will not move away from Calgary, both boys are here along with our three grand children and we want to be here to see those school activities and sports if the grand kids get into them.

Originally Posted by ann m
In the meantime - fly and be happy sounds simple and great to me - where do I sign up?
http://www.calgaryflyingclub.com/ and only a 20 minute drive from home.

Last edited by Steve_P; Jan 23rd 2010 at 9:00 pm.
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Old Jan 23rd 2010, 10:02 pm
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Default Re: The old "Quality of Life" discussion ...

Originally Posted by ann m
In no particular order ...

* not having to pay for parking (with city centre exceptions)
* finding a parking space - and one that is big and easy to manoeuvre
* having a huge washing machine that takes about 3 times the quantity of a european machine
* having a large and powerful shower
* I don't really notice groups of young people when I see them, apart from a momentary dislike of a tattoo or choice in hair dye - I am in my 40's afterall, it is expected that I won't appreciate their fashion choices - but I don't notice accents, swearing, brewing atmospheres or ill-intent
* having a home with more square footage than I really need - ie, space for our family to spread out and remove ourselves from each other occasionally
* having a home with more square footage than I really need - which makes the stacking of a month's worth of recycling really easy
* living in a town where a traffic jam is represented by five cars at the lights, or the barriers going down for one of the long trains
* having an electric garage door opener - and a garage into which two cars actually fit
* not having a mortgage
* forgetting to lock my front door and then not having to assume the place will have been burgled when I get back
* giving my children "playtime" freedom within their neighbourhood that I do not believe would be possible in my experiences of neighbourhoods in the the UK
* stunning views and big, high, open skies - a feeling of personal space and a literal breath of fresh air
* being able to choose a day on a ski-hill if we really want to
* finding the time to join a choir
* husband finding the time to learn to paraglide, or ski, or mountain-bike, or plan triathlons (good god)
* driving my Dodge Caravan sofa-with-snow-tyres and enjoying a big easy vehicle
* lack of hedges and tiny, curvy roads make driving here so easy (to the point of mindless sometimes, but mostly, just easy)
All of the material things in your list (large homes, large cars, easy travel (=sprawl)) are enabled by cheap fossil fuels. They suit me too, but I do wonder how long the era of fossil-fuelled quality of life will last. If I were General Manager of the World, looking to avoid climate catastrophe, I would consider our comfortable north american way of life to be low-hanging fruit ripe for a dramatic increase in the price of carbon. In terms of the planet's resources and capacity to withstand climate change, we are very much enjoying what we have at the future expense of others. I don't mean to preach or sound gloomy, but this dilemma isn't going to go away.
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Old Jan 23rd 2010, 10:47 pm
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Default Re: The old "Quality of Life" discussion ...

Originally Posted by agr
All of the material things in your list (large homes, large cars, easy travel (=sprawl)) are enabled by cheap fossil fuels. They suit me too, but I do wonder how long the era of fossil-fuelled quality of life will last. If I were General Manager of the World, looking to avoid climate catastrophe, I would consider our comfortable north american way of life to be low-hanging fruit ripe for a dramatic increase in the price of carbon. In terms of the planet's resources and capacity to withstand climate change, we are very much enjoying what we have at the future expense of others. I don't mean to preach or sound gloomy, but this dilemma isn't going to go away.
Oh Lord - I am well aware of the above, and agree with you completely!

Invariably, in order to live a "smaller" life with smaller effects and waste, one gives up the space that I think makes human beings (huge generalisation coming up) nicer to one another. You start squashing human beings into smaller spaces, with less space in between them, we all annoy the hell out of each other and before long, we all strive to move out into more space. I can't think many family folks would choose to stay in a fifth floor apartment, with no garden, and noisy neighbours - or being the noisy neighbour - if they didn't have to. Even if we all spread out, with small greener properties on large plots, we spend time, money and economics on travelling to other places we need to get to.

I do feel guilty chugging away in my sofa-with-snow-tyres - but not guilty enough, eh? And while it costs me half the price of petrol to fill up than it did to fill up a peculiar looking thing called a Nissan Note in the UK in December, I will take advantage of having this huge, comfortable, can-carry-all-I-can-think-of minivan for a few more years. 3, 4 and 5 litre engines are, quite frankly, a disgrace in this day and age. As you infer, people (north americans especially) will do nothing about it until the costs rise too much.

However, I don't feel ready to compromise on my house or my car just yet - I am as economical and thoughtful as I can be but agree that emissions, wastage, costs, etc are the lazy by-products of the life I am choosing at this stage. I do try hard though.

Basically, it's the middle-income, child-producing, big-truck driving, detached-house 40-somethings that will be the ruin of this world, and if I concentrate on this too much, I might sit in the corner and cry. Preaching or sounding gloomy is not necessary. I understand my choices - and I'm not proud of some of them. That's a whole other thread
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Old Jan 24th 2010, 12:31 am
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Default Re: The old "Quality of Life" discussion ...

Its the little things like the first time I saw puppies playing in the snow.
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Old Jan 24th 2010, 1:00 am
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Default Re: The old "Quality of Life" discussion ...

Originally Posted by Oink
Its the little things like the first time I saw puppies playing in the snow.
yellow snow or powder snow?
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