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Moving back to UK

Moving back to UK

Old Jan 13th 2010, 2:21 pm
  #151  
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Default Re: Moving back to UK

Originally Posted by James Martindale View Post
If you like snow sports and waking up to beautiful mountains Vancouver is a great place. The nightlife is a little limited. Based on my 4 weeks there. I would compare the nightlife of Vancouver with the nightlife of Didsbury.

In terms of crime Vancouver had a badly publicized year in 2009 being referred to as Gangcouver although this was very similar to the Gangchester era of the late 90's where the shootings were predominantly gang on gang and drug related.

Toronto is better for nightlife but not as good for the great canadian outdoors. The nightlife of Toronto is slightly less than Manchester City Centre.

I would say there is more work opportunities in Toronto although this is not true if you are happy with seasonal work with the Winter Olympics and Whistler always needing seasonal workers.

This all my own opinion though based on 4 weeks spent in Vancouver, a year in Toronto and feed back from people I know in Canada.
Really? I would be looking for work in IT ideally as that is the field I have been working in for over 4 years and it's what my primary qualifications apply to. My girlfriend would ideally be looking for something in clinical/occupational therapy or elderly care.

To be honest, we haven't really thought about the night life although I know from my experience that the nightlife in North America generally isn't as good as the UK anyway and most of our friends would be overseas.

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Old Jan 13th 2010, 2:24 pm
  #152  
 
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Default Re: Moving back to UK

Originally Posted by pgtips View Post
Guys get serious !!! What about in Alberta, Canada !!! A Man sitting on the bus, the passenger next to him starts stabbing him to death, cuts his head off, then calmly walks off the bus holding his victims severed head in his hand http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4SQ5Ifobss
Wake up guys, there are still plenty of safe places in the UK, lots of beautiful towns and villages. You have to choose carefully where you live.
If you think by moving to Canada you are going to escape crime, well you better think again. Just because a country chooses to hide its crime from the outside world do not think it does not exist there.
This report from 2006 showed the crime rate in Canada to be double that of the US !!
http://archive.newsmax.com/archives/...4/150547.shtml
Don;t believe what you read in the papers. Reporting of offences is very flawed and different criteria in different countries is misleading. Sexual assault for example is a very broad offence category and includes someone squeezing someone's bum to full on penetration. In many countires the former would be simple assault - or not even an offence at all.

Another example - if 30 cars are broken into in a apartment building, do you create one file or 30? Stats would read one file as one break-in vs 30 break ins. I'm a copper and have a background in sociology and know only too well the games that surround reporting and clearance rates, they can easily be fudged.

Canada has very few offences that have statute of limitations and none for serious crimes - the same is not true of the US. Also in Canada police have less discretion and can't simply pick and choose what they investigate - domestic assault is taken very, very seriously in Canada and police are directed by the AG to lay charges in all domestic matters (including same sex) - no discretion.

Mark Twain said, "there are lies, damn lies and statistics"
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Old Jan 13th 2010, 2:29 pm
  #153  
 
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Default Re: Moving back to UK

Originally Posted by James Martindale View Post
If you like snow sports and waking up to beautiful mountains Vancouver is a great place. The nightlife is a little limited. Based on my 4 weeks there. I would compare the nightlife of Vancouver with the nightlife of Didsbury.

In terms of crime Vancouver had a badly publicized year in 2009 being referred to as Gangcouver although this was very similar to the Gangchester era of the late 90's where the shootings were predominantly gang on gang and drug related.

Toronto is better for nightlife but not as good for the great canadian outdoors. The nightlife of Toronto is slightly less than Manchester City Centre.

I would say there is more work opportunities in Toronto although this is not true if you are happy with seasonal work with the Winter Olympics and Whistler always needing seasonal workers.

This all my own opinion though based on 4 weeks spent in Vancouver, a year in Toronto and feed back from people I know in Canada.
I agree with this. Although only one of those notorious shootings actually happened in Vancouver's west side (downtown) most were actually in the valley and metro vancouver.

Vancouver is more about the outdoors and great opportunities for biking, kayaking, skiing etc. Night life is crap, but restaurant scene is outstanding.

TO has more of a big city feel while Vancouver is more sleepy, but a much nicer place to settle down.

Rent is about the same i would think - not sure about work.
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Old Jan 13th 2010, 2:39 pm
  #154  
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Default Re: Moving back to UK

Originally Posted by dboy View Post
Don;t believe what you read in the papers. Reporting of offences is very flawed and different criteria in different countries is misleading. Sexual assault for example is a very broad offence category and includes someone squeezing someone's bum to full on penetration. In many countires the former would be simple assault - or not even an offence at all.

Another example - if 30 cars are broken into in a apartment building, do you create one file or 30? Stats would read one file as one break-in vs 30 break ins. I'm a copper and have a background in sociology and know only too well the games that surround reporting and clearance rates, they can easily be fudged.

Canada has very few offences that have statute of limitations and none for serious crimes - the same is not true of the US. Also in Canada police have less discretion and can't simply pick and choose what they investigate - domestic assault is taken very, very seriously in Canada and police are directed by the AG to lay charges in all domestic matters (including same sex) - no discretion.

Mark Twain said, "there are lies, damn lies and statistics"
This makes perfect sense to me, I think the one issue that can be a problem for British emigrants is driving offences since you only have to put a slight foot wrong in this country for it to constitute some sort of offence. Currently I don't have a criminal record and have never had any kind of run in with the police but would I be able to say the same if I was a driver, I can't say for 100% sure since a lot of driving offences under which people are charged in this country are really just genuine accidents or things that could happen to anyone.

Another good example is that I was physically assaulted by somebody I knew a couple of years ago. The offender was very heavily drunk and under the influence of some serious medication at the time and managed to escape prosecution with a caution. In a different country he probably could have been charged and convicted for that offence and in another the police probably could have dismissed it off hand. I can't speak for other countries as well but I honestly do think that a lot of fudging goes on within the UK police forces. Like every other public sector service they can have rediculous targets thrust upon them by the government and need to strive to meet those targets so I do think that they will often be a bit selective in their actions if it makes for better stats and appearances on the surface.
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Old Jan 13th 2010, 2:42 pm
  #155  
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Default Re: Moving back to UK

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost View Post
Really? I would be looking for work in IT ideally as that is the field I have been working in for over 4 years and it's what my primary qualifications apply to. My girlfriend would ideally be looking for something in clinical/occupational therapy or elderly care.

To be honest, we haven't really thought about the night life although I know from my experience that the nightlife in North America generally isn't as good as the UK anyway and most of our friends would be overseas.
If nightlife is not important- then I would go to Vancouver. I think you are both in very employable fields where ever you go.

I like my nightlife and know some people in Toronto hense my decision but I would love to go to Vancouver at some stage as you can be cross country ski-ing in the mountains half an hour after work etc......
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Old Jan 13th 2010, 2:50 pm
  #156  
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Default Re: Moving back to UK

Originally Posted by James Martindale View Post
I like my nightlife and know some people in Toronto hense my decision but I would love to go to Vancouver at some stage as you can be cross country ski-ing in the mountains half an hour after work etc......
I plan to be skiing 20 minutes after work today....OK, so its not a "real" mountain, but its still fun.
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Old Jan 13th 2010, 2:54 pm
  #157  
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Default Re: Moving back to UK

Originally Posted by James Martindale View Post
If nightlife is not important- then I would go to Vancouver. I think you are both in very employable fields where ever you go.

I like my nightlife and know some people in Toronto hense my decision but I would love to go to Vancouver at some stage as you can be cross country ski-ing in the mountains half an hour after work etc......
Well that's the thing really, she does have a friend in Toronto at the moment but her friend may need to leave Canada for a while soon for a personal matter so chances are that she probably won't be there if/when we get to Canada anyway.

She also has another friend in upstate NY who I think she would like to be closer to as they haven't seen each other in years, I'm trying to do a persuasion at the moment though.
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Old Jan 13th 2010, 2:59 pm
  #158  
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Default Re: Moving back to UK

Originally Posted by iaink View Post
I plan to be skiing 20 minutes after work today....OK, so its not a "real" mountain, but its still fun.
Where are you based in Ontario in relation to Toronto and where are you headed to ski?

Something I am keen to get involved in when I get over is spending several long weekends up Blue Mountain.
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Old Jan 13th 2010, 3:05 pm
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Default Re: Moving back to UK

Quinte is basically Trenton / Belleville, about 90 minutes East of the GTA and 60 mins west of Kingston.

The local hill is Batawa... short and steep, but definitley a snowbank not a hill compared to real ski areas. However, its certainly convenient, and ideal for me (and the kids) getting into the sport. No hanging around queing for the lifts anyway...
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Old Jan 13th 2010, 3:12 pm
  #160  
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Default Re: Moving back to UK

Originally Posted by iaink View Post
Quinte is basically Trenton / Belleville, about 90 minutes East of the GTA and 60 mins west of Kingston.

The local hill is Batawa... short and steep, but definitley a snowbank not a hill compared to real ski areas. However, its certainly convenient, and ideal for me (and the kids) getting into the sport. No hanging around queing for the lifts anyway...
Yes- also for cross country ski-ing (amazing calorie burner) you do not need big slopes just a good track and lots of powder.
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Old Jan 13th 2010, 3:17 pm
  #161  
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Default Re: Moving back to UK

Originally Posted by James Martindale View Post
Yes- also for cross country ski-ing (amazing calorie burner) you do not need big slopes just a good track and lots of powder.
And daylight

There is crosscountry at batawa too...not groomed tracks though. Otherwise the larger local conservation areas have nice trails, if not too long. They get more use to be honest, so its easier going. Ive not done XC for a while...downhill is easier when you have small kids.
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Old Jan 13th 2010, 5:00 pm
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Default Re: Moving back to UK

Has anybody tried this place?

http://www.toronto.ca/parks/recreati...orkski.htm#map

I was on the bus to work one day, looked over and suddenly realised I was looking at a snow maker. Quite bizarre.
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Old Jan 13th 2010, 7:39 pm
  #163  
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Default Vancouver (a few personal pros and cons)

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost View Post
So would you recommend Vancouver? I'm going through a Bunac application at the moment and that's the city I have my eye on really although I get the feeling that my girlfriend really wants to go to Toronto.
Vancouver Good:

I guess that the main things would be its proximity to skiing/hiking/biking/sailing etc. types of activities (if you can afford to do them). Also, it is rare to have snow/temps significantly below freezing in the metro Vancouver area over the winter. The coast is quite pretty and there are islands to explore. I've not been to the states yet but Seattle is within striking distance.

Vancouver Neutral:

It is 4500 miles and a 9-10 hour, fairly expensive flight from the UK if you/your girlfriend need to pop home for a visit. Plus it is 8 hours behind GMT if there are things that you need to sort out by phone. Might not sound like a lot but it is interesting when you are expecting a call back from Inland Revenue or you need to catch someone before their office closes. You just need to be aware. Until you disengage a little from your UK friends, you can expect to find yourself spending a lot of your mornings keeping up with them because they are at home, relaxing after a full day's work. Even though they can see daytime behind your head? They don't realise that it's your morning and you need to get up and out to do things!

Depending on what you enjoy doing - every other business property is pretty much a restaurant, a nails bar, hairdressers or coffee shop. I have to admit that I still tend to shop for clothes in the UK still as I've not found any shops here that have things that I like, at prices I feel are value for money. Perhaps I just haven't adapted to West Coast fashion yet.

Also, if you like bread, pork, beef, broccoli and carrots, you can pretty much shop all year around in Safeway. Otherwise, you need to learn where to go to find what you need. While it is a bit inconvenient not to be able to get all of your groceries in one place and I miss Sainsburys, Tesco and the occasional treat visit to Waitrose, it can be fun to explore alternative places to find what you need.

Vancouver Not-so-Good:

Weather can be very wet, rainy, grey, gloomy and depressing between Autumn and Spring (Vancouver Annual Average Rainfall = 43"; London = 26" - or something like that. Basically, Vancouver is even wetter than Glasgow.).

I stay out of the known dodgy areas but the Vancouver area does have an apparent problem with drugs and homelessness. Personally, other than the odd person dragging themselves across the road in front of my car while high on drugs, I have not seen much evidence of drugs (although it is reported on a lot in the papers - users and gang turf war violence). However, the homeless are very visible, pretty much everywhere you go.

I find it quiet here. It can get very lonely. At least where I live. I am only about 20 mins drive from downtown but the suburb is sort of stockbroker belt - faceless suburbs quiet. Maybe 2 -5 cars come down our road a day? It kills me. Just roads stuffed with faceless houses that have manicured lawns/gardens. I get the occasional glimpse of peoples' cars vanishing into their garages. We occasionally go out to dinner but I have not been to a real bar or a club, in the way that I used to go out to one in London, since I arrived in October 08. I am sure that there must be places to go but...?

Last edited by ork; Jan 13th 2010 at 7:41 pm.
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Old Jan 13th 2010, 7:42 pm
  #164  
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Default Re: Moving back to UK

Originally Posted by lmartin999 View Post
Has anybody tried this place?

http://www.toronto.ca/parks/recreati...orkski.htm#map

I was on the bus to work one day, looked over and suddenly realised I was looking at a snow maker. Quite bizarre.
Ah, the compacted shit mountain. We had a works outing there once. It doesn't smell.
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Old Jan 13th 2010, 10:40 pm
  #165  
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Default Re: Moving back to UK

Originally Posted by James Martindale View Post
Canada with out question has a lower crime rate than England. The worst parts of Toronto are far less scary than the worst parts of London.
I would question that. A lot of it is down to people's perceptions. Is there less anti-social behaviour in Canada - probably. Is Canada's murder rate higher than the UK - Yes. No doubt there are scary crime-ridden areas in the UK, particularly in the major cities, but get outside of those then the picture improves considerably. Here there are less 'ghetto' areas, but crime seems to be more 'evenly spread'. For the record, we have been broken into twice in Vancouver.
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