polishvisitor

Finding company who will sponsor you ,it takes 2 years to get GC, nowadays TN is valid for 3 years not like used to be 1 year, at least it was when I was on it,also being hired by recruiting agency helps cause if one contracts is finished they can switch you to another so no worry about loosing one job

dbd33

It would be fairer to use a US city comparable in other ways to Toronto, I don't think there are a lot more IT jobs in, say, Pittsburgh or Omaha, than there are in Toronto.

Rete

There is nothing arrogant about his comment. It is truthful and spot on, IMHO.

Recruiters, perspective employers, etc. all seem to love the British accent and yes, their schooling and qualifications are more acceptable that those form another country.

Rete

If you married a Yank, you have that open door. If your employer is willing they can sponsor you for a green card. Nothing is impossible.

John_B

I don't believe Peter was being arrogant at all. I was offered a job when I first arrived, almost solely based on my accent and command of the English language. I declined the job because the hours weren't good. The job required meeting a lot of clients and the employer felt I had an advantage over other applicants because I spoke better English. If I was in Quebec I'm sure it would have been a different story as my French is rubbish. I don't see this as arrogance, rather you seem to have judged Peter's comments a little too easily.

britsnake

A couple of years ago, when I was in Ontario looking for work, one of my friends invited me to his companies annual picnic. He pointed out the senior managers and told me to charm them.

I did not feel comfortable at first, but pushed myself and did it. My friend told me that after the picnic, the managers started talking about me and "when" I was going to work for them, not "if" I was going to work for them. This was before they even know my skills.

Getting a job is about more than just the skills you have. You also have to be a good fit to the company.

When I was an IT manager interviewing people, I would try and imagine what it would be like working with each of the candidates. If a person had a bad attitude at the interview, I'd assume that they would bring this to the workplace and I would not hire them however skilled they may be.

Each culture has preferred accents. In the UK a mild scottish accent is quite attractive, in Canada and the USA they like the British accent.

British people are often seen as, Intelligent, Sophisticated, arrogant, evil or maybe charming just because of the way we speak. We have no more control over this than anyone else.

pdarwin

I would add to my original comments about the Brit accent - I think in the IT world that the ability to communicate effectively is more important than knowledge of the job; qualifications; looks; or anything else - and it's something newcomers to the job market don't understand, and at the risk of upsetting PolishVisitor again (which I am not meaning to do) it is why we see many highly qualified people driving taxis and working fast food, even though many could probably beat my ass in any IT related activity. Some of them are even doctors and professors.
Of course you have to work with what you've got and to get back on topic I stand by my point that industry certifications are very useful in IT when added to existing experience. I know it's harder for newcomers to Ontario to get the good jobs but I believe a little perseverance and dedication is all that is required.

polishvisitor

it does not upset me it just amazes me ,how people like you can believe in this, you do not know me, and have no clue in what accent do i speak, but regardless that, your point is that it is not important if someone is speaking communicatively it must be british accent ,next thing you will tell me that the person needs to wear armani suit and have rolex on a wrist and drive aston martin to get a job in IT, what a BS looking at IT industry somehow i dont see any UK talents, quite opposite Indians who speak with such a heavy accent that is hard to understand them, of course certain clowns will fall for so called "charming english accent" but in reality where comes to the IT business it does not matter ,what matters are skills,unless someone needs a show off, I rather hire Paris Hilton )

canadian_critic

This is a really good point. And it's not just Toronto. People thinking of moving to BC don't get any relief from this either. In fact I was chatting with someone on Friday last week looking to move from Toronto to BC and she expressed deep concern about the job market here, making me wonder whether BC is even worse than Toronto.

The OP's point about knowing people is really appropriate. I cherry picked jobs in Britain and have been out of work 90% of my time here. Despite the financial catastrophe that this delivers, I have lost all self-esteem and confidence in what I used to be a world expert at. Now I have additional challenges to finding work; deep depression.

I don't know about the US, but finding a job in UK is a walk in the park compared with Canada. In BC specifically NOBODY advertises salaries, and normally for the same reasons that some shops don't put prices on things. If you apply for a job, chances are it will not pay enough to live off here. And if you're unlucky enough to not be selected, you'll only know months after applying when you assume incommunicado = rejection. If you have no personality and feelings then it shouldn't bother you. But if you have the slightest self-respect and get mildly upset by such things, you're in for a massive shock moving to Canada.

There's something about this place that makes companies think they can treat prospective employees like shit. In fact some recruiters do the same. Thankfully I found a couple of ethical ones that really work for their money. But they are the exception unfortunately.

And to top it off, when I expressed my despair at the whole job finding process in Canada (and yes I have applied for jobs across the country), someone claimed I had an unreasonable sense of entitlement. Since when did basic courtesy and respect for others become unreasonable? And it's not a Canadian culture thing. It's nothing less than pig ignorance. The whole image of Canadians being ethical, kind, friendly people is blown apart by examples such as this.

R I C H

Not necessarily true. Both jobs I've applied for and got in BC (one contract, one permanent) advertised the salary.

dbd33

It always has been. I don't know why that would be different now.

rubberduckofdeath

I think they're on a par so I pretty much agree with you.

I see a lot of staff come and go and have hired a lot of people and the best ones are the ones that can communicate effectively, understand a problem or a concept quickly and not misunderstand things. If you don't have an excellent command of the English language, that's a problem in software development unless you're dealing with really simple applications in which case you're likely not a particularly high earner anyway.

canadian_critic

Paris gets my vote!

But I disagree with what you are saying. Someone can be technically brilliant but if they don't communicate in the language used by others in their work environment, then they won't work out.

Someone I know used to always focus on technical expertise when hiring. He ended up with the weirdest bunch of people I've ever met in my life. Not one of them had any kind of social or communication skills. Man did they cause him problems. It was like running a nerd zoo more than a company.

Not sure what you mean by "Don't see any uk talent(s)". The UK turns out some brilliant people. Companies often hire indians because they are also generally intelligent competent people. But I've always felt uncomfortable if someone's accent is so strong that I can't understand them. In most roles I simply don't have time to get them to repeat time and time again. I would also need people who can communicate with clients and this is also a big problem. And yes I would have the same problem if someone had a strong UK accent such as a really strong Northern Ireland accent or strong Scottish, if I didn't feel I could understand them most of the time.

rubberduckofdeath

Totally agree. I think he must've worked in the wrong places if he's not found any good people in the IT industry, we've got talent all over the place.

pdarwin

You seem to be a bit hung up on this accent thing. My point is that effective communications are vital and whether you or I agree with this fact or not, it is still existing. After working several years in IT in Canada, as employee and as a manager, I am just stating 'what sells'. Of course there are many other assets that are useful to have as well, nobody would deny that. I have also had my share of crappy jobs - even with the accent !