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House buying - Canada (ON) vs UK (London)

House buying - Canada (ON) vs UK (London)

Old Feb 22nd 2019, 2:02 pm
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Default House buying - Canada (ON) vs UK (London)

hi all,
What is the process for buying a house in Ontario? (Cash buyers ). How do you find properties? Please can anyone help me understand the steps involved?

Are there any Rightmove/Zoopla comparable sites?
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Old Feb 22nd 2019, 2:10 pm
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Default Re: House buying - Canada (ON) vs UK (London)

In its simplest format

1. Find house for sale (vast majority advertised by realty companies) some found on Kijiji, Craigslist (potential scams) grocery store notice boards. Usually a sign outside the property For Sale contact X.
2. Arrange viewing, negotiate a price and then hire a real estate lawyer pay everybody and get legal documents for possession date.
3. Move in.
4. Job done.
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Old Feb 22nd 2019, 2:15 pm
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Default Re: House buying - Canada (ON) vs UK (London)

Finding a house : Is there a website that aggregates listings?
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Old Feb 22nd 2019, 2:32 pm
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Default Re: House buying - Canada (ON) vs UK (London)

Originally Posted by Winterdiva
Finding a house : Is there a website that aggregates listings?
Yes. Here it is: Realtor.ca
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Old Feb 22nd 2019, 2:39 pm
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Default Re: House buying - Canada (ON) vs UK (London)

Originally Posted by Former Lancastrian
In its simplest format

1. Find house for sale (vast majority advertised by realty companies) some found on Kijiji, Craigslist (potential scams) grocery store notice boards. Usually a sign outside the property For Sale contact X.
2. Arrange viewing, negotiate a price and then hire a real estate lawyer pay everybody and get legal documents for possession date.
3. Move in.
4. Job done.
That's not usual though. Typically two agents will be involved. One of them nominally represents the buyer though both are paid by the seller. All the houses on the mls site mentioned are tied into contracts with estate agents. Alternative sales sites can be found by googling property guys, for sale by owner, or fsbo.

Last edited by dbd33; Feb 22nd 2019 at 2:47 pm.
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Old Feb 22nd 2019, 5:06 pm
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Default Re: House buying - Canada (ON) vs UK (London)

Loads of wiki articles on house buying in Canada here:

http://britishexpats.com/wiki/Category:Housing-Canada

Yes, of course Realtor.ca, but be careful as there are several 'property hot spots' in Canada where it is normal to advertise a low-ish price and ask for all offers in two weeks, the house then normally goes for 10 - 20% more than the advertised price. Certainly true at the moment in London ON where houses don't stay on the market more that 2 weeks and if they do, there is a reason.
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Old Feb 22nd 2019, 5:53 pm
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Default Re: House buying - Canada (ON) vs UK (London)

Do you have Permanent Residency now? Do bear in mind the additional taxes that may have to be paid if you are not a permanent resident or Citizen and buying property. (Non Resident Speculation Tax) https://www.fin.gov.on.ca/en/bulletins/nrst/ .. unsure if it would apply to you but I personally wouldn't be looking at properties unless you have PR status or are almost at the end of the process to PR...
The NRST is a 15 per cent tax on the purchase or acquisition of an interest in residential property located in the Greater Golden Horseshoe Region (GGH) by individuals who are not citizens or permanent residents of Canada or by foreign corporations (foreign entities) and taxable trustees.
There are many costs involved in both buying and selling houses - including taxes by the Govt should you not remain in Canada. If you don't yet have PR nor pretty much a guarantee of being granted it in the foreseeable future it would be risky to a) sell your property in the UK and b) buy a property in Canada... particularly if you will only be here on a TWP. Also, similar to Scotland, offers in writing are normally legally binding.

Last edited by Siouxie; Feb 22nd 2019 at 6:20 pm.
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Old Feb 22nd 2019, 6:16 pm
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Default Re: House buying - Canada (ON) vs UK (London)

Also note Ontario is rather a large Province. Much cheaper to buy in Thunder Bay than Toronto though might be the same as buying in Windsor. Have you narrowed it down a bit?
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Old Feb 23rd 2019, 12:24 am
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Default Re: House buying - Canada (ON) vs UK (London)

Originally Posted by Winterdiva
hi all,
What is the process for buying a house in Ontario? (Cash buyers ). How do you find properties? Please can anyone help me understand the steps involved?

Are there any Rightmove/Zoopla comparable sites?
There are lots of ways. The most common is through Realtor.ca. The buyer and seller both have an agent working with them. The buyer's agent can show any property listed on realtor.ca regardless of the brokerage that it's listed with. Once you find a house you like then that agent will write up an offer which may contain various conditions eg.offer conditional on getting a mortgage or offer conditional on buyer getting the home inspected. The offer, once accepted is legally binding on both parties, although the buyer can walk away if any conditions can't be met within the timeframe set in the contract.

At the point of making the offer ( or within 24 hours of acceptance, depending on the wording) a deposit is handed to the listing brokerage and held in trust until either one of the conditions isn't met or the purchase completes.

There are private sales where you would deal directly with the owner and get a lawyer to write the offer, some for sale by owners are also listed on realtor.ca through brokerages that offer that service.

Last edited by HGerchikov; Feb 23rd 2019 at 12:35 am.
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Old Feb 23rd 2019, 7:48 am
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Default Re: House buying - Canada (ON) vs UK (London)

Thanks everyone. We are nearly towards the end of our PR process. (Landing in the next few months)
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Old Feb 23rd 2019, 9:23 am
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Default Re: House buying - Canada (ON) vs UK (London)

Originally Posted by Winterdiva
Thanks everyone. We are nearly towards the end of our PR process. (Landing in the next few months)
Still haven't given us a clue as to where in Ontario as prices will differ vastly in some areas.
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Old Feb 27th 2019, 1:14 pm
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Default Re: House buying - Canada (ON) vs UK (London)

Waterloo/Kitchener area
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Old Feb 27th 2019, 1:32 pm
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Default Re: House buying - Canada (ON) vs UK (London)

Originally Posted by Winterdiva
Waterloo/Kitchener area
KW area is particularly 'hot' and has been for a couple of years and unlikely to change (overflow from Toronto money). Be prepared for a house to be marketed for an open day at a weekend with all formal offers by the following Tuesday. Many of the competing bids will be without any conditions, so if you want a survey, get an informal one done at your own cost first. Also be prepared for the house to go for at least 10% over the asking price. We had this when we bought our house in London ON in September 2018, finally got one after being outbid on three others after we put in a condition free bid with an 'escalator' clause.
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Old Feb 27th 2019, 8:10 pm
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Default Re: House buying - Canada (ON) vs UK (London)

The house buying process in Canada is completely different from England (although similar in many respects to the Scottish system, not that this analogy will help you if you are used to London UK!). But to try to compare it with English house buying steps you might be familiar with try this:

Find a house
You pick your own 'buying' Realtor (estate agent). They work for YOU, a bit like 'Kirstie and Phil' in Location, Location, Location. They get paid by splitting the fees (usually around 4%) that the seller pays their agent, so as a buyer, you don't pay. Your Realtor will get to know you and what you want, then do the looking for you. They will set up all the viewings and pick you up and drive you to many viewings in a day or afternoon or whatever. They show you around and are generally very knowledgeable and can point out stuff that might need doing that you would not think of (if the roof is on it's last legs as these often need replacing every 20 years, old windows etc.).

Make a 'conditional' or even 'non-conditional' offer
This is a bit like the offer you make through a UK estate agent, but a lot more formal. You will normally state the deposit you will offer (usually 10%) and the date you want to move in (often 1 - 2.5 months ahead). The offer is also normally for a set period of time, usually hours or a couple of days, giving the seller time to either accept or counter-offer. You can then counter the counter-offer etc - this is the 'haggling' part. Depending on the number of counter-offers, the haggling bit is normally resolved to either acceptance or decline in a few days at most. You will also state in the offer the timescale for any conditions - usually 1 or 2 weeks max. If you have specified 'conditions', if / when your offer is accepted, you must do what is necessary to resolve those conditions (e.g. you could say subject to survey, then you have to get the survey done in a week - not a problem in Canada as people are used to short timescales. Note that in hot property markets, often sellers will not consider anything other than unconditional offers and even then, give a deadline date by which they will consider all offers at one time.

Offer accepted
If you make a non-conditional offer, then if / when the seller accepts, that is it - you have then in effect 'exchanged' and you are committed.
If you make a conditional offer and the seller accepts, then the clock is running for you to satisfy your conditions or back out due to failure of a stated condition (i.e. you had the survey done and are unhappy with the report etc.).
At the stated end date of the offer, if the seller has accepted and you have not pulled out for reason of failure of conditions, then you MUST pay the deposit to the sellers agent's escrow account. This is in effect equivalent to 'exchange of contracts' except that you already know the completion date as it was in the original offer.

Completion / Move In
You complete and must hand over the money in full on the completion date stated in the original offer document. You will get your lawyer to handle this aspect.

Note
Realtors in Canada d a lot more than Estate Agents in England. Conversely, lawyers do a lot less in Canada than in England. The whole process in Canada is MUCH faster with more certainty. The process in England is archaic, broken and set up to fail IMHO! What happens in weeks or months in England happens in days in Canada! Offer documents are normally signed electronically, so there is no post. Offers can be decided in minutes or hours.
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Old Feb 28th 2019, 1:16 pm
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Default Re: House buying - Canada (ON) vs UK (London)

Originally Posted by Hurlabrick
Realtors in Canada d a lot more than Estate Agents in England. Conversely, lawyers do a lot less in Canada than in England. The whole process in Canada is MUCH faster with more certainty. The process in England is archaic, broken and set up to fail IMHO! What happens in weeks or months in England happens in days in Canada! Offer documents are normally signed electronically, so there is no post. Offers can be decided in minutes or hours.
Which is why (allegedly) realtors in Canada charge 4-6% of selling price to the seller vs. 1% or so in the UK. Your buying realtor will split the commission with the selling realtor. Worth understanding that.
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