ExKiwilass

I hope some of those people are reading this.

DigitalGhost

DBD has basically just described a situation which I have personally seen with my own eyes on more than one occasion over the last few years.

Since I came into this industry full time I have almost always contracted apart from a brief period at the start of last year where I got a permanent job because ironically that was all that was going in the area of the UK where I lived at the time and it was actually that short experience which encouraged me to look into coming over to Canada seriously. That company was the only exception to this rule for me because their policy was not to use contractors and everybody worked their arse off there because it was a development studio and there was always so much to do but in all other cases over the last few years I have worked in the internal IT section for a company and it always seemed like the contractors did the lion's share of the work whilst the permanent staff, many of whom were either extremely lazy and/or incompetent, mostly complained about their benefits or were involved in petty squabbles over the unwritten rules and chain of command which they had tried to create amongst themselves.

I doubt these issues are unique to the IT industry though unfortunately.

Tripitaka

I have no issue with what DBD says in regard to contracting - in fact, I agree 100%. I wonder if I had wrongly assumed that the OP was actually looking to secure a permanent position though given that they were looking to secure "work", or at least an offer of "work" while still in the UK? If so, then the info from DBD doesn't really apply as it is a different set of rules when hiring a permy employee and my original comments still stand.

DigitalGhost

How does contracting recruitment generally work over here?

There doesn't seem to be a set standard in the UK and I have experienced it from the extreme of a two stage interview process for a 6 month contract to a 5 minute telephone interview resulting in a 'that all sounds great, when can you start?" for a 1 year one.

dbd33

The latter is typical, in most cases it'll be because your pimp has some pull with someone at the hiring organization. The candidate typically isn't evaluated, it's all in his reputation or that of the pimp. That's why few long term contractors bother with resumes.

Note however that contracts start because something needs doing and end because of politics, it's not unusual for a contract, initially stated as being of six months duration, to go for ten years but, equally, it's not unusual for it to end after four months. The end is rarely for any logical reason, such as the project being finished, more commonly it's because a new manager is appointed and wants to use a different set of contractors because he's mates with a different pimp.

Assume corruption and conspiracy and you'll probably be right.

Gaz67

Hi there,

We originally landed with PR in Kamloops may 2010 and found sending emails with updated cvs/resumes not very successful per 100's sent out.

Face to face worked out everytime, out of 7 jobs ive been offered , 4 in Kamloops and now 3 here in Vernon its been not what you know its either who you know or get in and introduce yourself.

My wifes having the same problem here and is trying to find an admin job, she probably gets 1 reply from a 100 emails. Im in the process of printing off some resumes so she can pop into places and do the face to face thing.

I did carry on sending out my resume by email as well because im sure some do reply..

Cheers & Good luck
Gaz

BobbyN

The face to face thing sounds like a good idea as i read that canadians prefer the personal approach however I work in the IT industry so how would I go about getting past the receptionist downstairs to actually having a brief chat with the manager or whoever is hiring located upstairs?

I know from my own experience of networking that making that intial good impression can be vital

DigitalGhost

Can anybody recommend any good 'pimps' in the Toronto area? I've applied for a few things since getting here last week but have so far heard nothing back.

dbd33

What is the tag line on your resume, what are you selling?

DigitalGhost

Not sure how to answer those questions if I'm perfectly honest.

I will email you a copy and let you take a look through it if that's OK. I've only really been applying for basic support/technician type roles so far though and have cut my original CV down from 4 pages to just 2. Most of the jobs I have seen seem to be permanent ones though (I've mostly been looking on Jobserve and Monster) so I'm not even 100% sure if I'm looking in the right places to begin with.

dbd33

I haven't looked yet but would guess that the problem is as follows:

- historically in the UK, and currently in Canada, contractors are highly paid experts in some specific thing. Companies hire them because they need that thing developed or fixed. The intent is short term.

- in the UK, and increasingly in Canada, casualisation of employment is advancing at a great pace (not specifically in computers, I know of a local government where no one is legally an employee). This is typically done by taking the worker off the payroll and paying them a flat rate with no benefits. The intent is long term, a position that is a "contract" in this sense will not be identified as such in the advertising.*

In Canada "contractor" is used to mean the former, in the UK it's also used to mean the latter. Someone who has no specific narrowly defined skill "World's Best Living Autocoder Programmer", "Primary Developer of Home Tax Avoidance Version 1", something with punch, is, I think, going to have trouble selling themselves as a contractor in Canada.

* before Iaink comments, I know that the employment laws, such as they are, in Ontario are framed to try and prevent this mode of working. Nonetheless I think it to be commonplace and increasingly the norm.

DigitalGhost

So what I should be looking for then is 'temp IT work' should such a thing exist?

Makes sense to me and I definitely agree with what you're saying, in fact my previous employer (a University) had only taken on one new permanent member of staff in the Systems section in the last 12 months up until I left about 10 days ago. Everyone else who hadn't been there for a while was either of a temp contract directly with the Uni or was a 'self-employed contractor' and had been recruited via an agency.

Can you recommend any agencies which cover that sort of work by any chance then? Failing that, I will probably need to start looking into temp office/admin jobs but that will be difficult as I have no direct qualifications in that area (this is Canada afterall) and I haven't done any of that sort of work for around 6 or 7 years now.

dbd33

ProCom handle a huge number of low margin contracts.

DigitalGhost

I'll check them out tonight, thanks man.