kentishman

Hi All.

My wife and I (mid 30's, no kids) are looking to move over to canada in April 2011. Time to use our recently received PR.

Both these areas (GTA / London) seem to have a lot going for them, but having no experience of either we are struggling to determine a starting point.

We are looking for an urban environment with malls, shops etc. We will be both looking for employment in management (call centre possibly) and graphics design, are there job opportunities for us in either place?

GTA appears to have better job opportunities and a much bigger urban area to choose from.

London seems to have lower house prices, and potentially a lower cost of living than toronto. Or so the London website
(http://www.welcome.london.ca/living/cost-of-living.htm) would have me believe. Does this lower cost of living come with lower wages and less jobs?

Are there marked differences in property tax between areas in the GTA, and would London be lower still?

Are there areas in the GTA area with house prices similar to London? Of course I have a preference for non crime ridden neighbourhoods.

Can anyone recommend budget partly furnished (bed, fridge) apartments for rental. Is there a problem with not having any local rental references? Are we expected to pay 6 months rent up front, and will they (the rental people) need to run credit checks of some sort? Any advice for dealing with credit checks for a credit history we won't have?

Is car insurance noticeably lower in London than in Toronto? I have read some posts outlining car insurance in the thousands of dollars for people in toronto. I guess it costs what it costs.

I have also been watching youtube vids of canadians digging themselves out of snowdrifts, and using a snowblower to clear driveways. From what I can tell, it is mandatory (in ontario at least) to clear your drive / sidewalk of snow within 24 hours of a snowfall. How often is it necessary to remove the snow in winter? ie does it snow so much, that shovelling is part of the daily grind in winter? Toronto appears to have about 133cm of snow each year, with London about 100cm more. That sounds like a lot, but spread over 6 months maybe it is very manageable?

I am also considering closing my lloyds TSB account, which will mean losing our credit card. I am doing this as I am not sure I can close this account from canada once I have opened a canadian bank account. How does one pay for car rental without a credit card, or should I rather keep the lloyds one?

Should we take our savings over in travellers cheques form, or is it better to open an account from the UK (if possible?) and transfer from here?

We have also considered vancouver, but we can't seem to find any areas with more affordable houses. Is vancouver just for the well monied, or am I missing the obvious?

thanks for your help.
kentishman.

lucycrow

Hi There

My husband and I moved to Toronto a year and a half ago so can only really advise on Toronto although we have looked at moving outside the city or to places a bit further out but without success as of yet.

I don't know much about London and jobs in your field so you would need to research this more. As for jobs, Toronto is as far as we have found the place where most of the jobs (especially well paid ones) are and that's the reason we can't really move out of Toronto and also commuting from places outside the actual city is bad as the train network isn't as comprehensive as in the UK. If you are close to a subway line in Toronto, it's great but it usually means a higher rent or house price.

As for rental in Toronto, well it's expensive if you want to live in a good area and as far as I can see, it's also quite expensive in a not so great area. We pay $2000 a month for a 3 bed house which is more comparable to London prices than Leeds where we lived before moving to Canada. House prices in the area we live start at $500,000 which is again not cheap so we are not looking at buying for the moment.

As for rental, places are normally unfurnished although you will get white goods usually so you need to budget money for bed, sofa etc when you get out here- there's always IKEA! We need a credit check through one of the online companies equifax I think it was and we also had a letter from my husband's new employer here in Canada stating his salary. You normally pay 1st and last months rent so again you need to budget for that.

We still have UK bank accounts as I still work for a UK company online and get paid into a UK account and then pay tax on it here in Canada. Officially you are not supposed to have an account if you are not a resident but I would keep it open at least temporarily and close it as and when you want/need to to. We transferred money over and yes you have to pay a fee but for big amounts, it wasn't a big problem.

This is our 2nd winter in Toronto and not had (as of yet) that much snow although Toronto doesn't get as much snow as further north. You do have to clear your path outside your home and it's pretty easy with the correct shovel and salt etc.

Have you been over to look at each of the places? Also check out www.mls.ca for house/rental prices and also craigslist too. (do a google search for this)

Anyway hope this info helpful. Canada no longer a cheap place to live as far as the GTA is concerned but it is where a lot of the jobs are and Toronto is a great multicultural city with so much to see and do and even in the city, we still have a more outdoor lifestyle than back in the UK.

Lucy

MarylandNed

This was my first reaction.....Mid 30's? No kids? And you're trying to decide between Toronto (a world class city with lots to see and do) and London, Ontario? That might be an unfair reaction on my part as I don't know you, your interests or your situation.

Definitely keep the UK bank account open. You can also open a free HiFX account which will let you quickly transfer funds from the UK to Canada (once you have a Canadian account open). Meanwhile you could take some cash, traveller's checks and your credit card with you. It might be possible to open a Canadian account ahead of time - others can probably answer that better than me. If you wish, you can cancel UK credit cards and bank accounts via phone or in writing from Canada. However, I've lived in North America for 19 of the last 21 years and I still have a UK bank account - and I still have need of it from time to time (including recently). It might be a good idea to get a couple more credit cards - I have 4 types (Amex, Visa, Mastercard and Discover). When I moved from the UK to the US, it was handy having a UK Amex card as I was able to get them to set me up with a US Amex card. Canadian banks have programs for helping newcomers to Canada.

If you're renting an apartment it's unlikely that you'll need to shovel snow. I lived in Toronto for 7 years (renting apartments and owning a house) and I don't recall ever being really bothered by snow. It was an adventure at first (e.g. learned to ski) however the novelty wore off after a few years - but, again, I don't recall being depressed by snow. However, if winter weather is a big factor in your decision, Vancouver may be the better choice (as long as you also don't mind typically unsettled UK style weather and lots of rain).

When renting accommodation, you normally pay "first and last" month's rent up front - which basically means you're giving a deposit of one month's rent. The landlord might also ask for a breakage deposit in case of damage. Most places are unfurnished although you will usually be supplied with appliances (washer, dryer, fridge, stove/oven, maybe a microwave).

There are some short term, furnished rentals available - very useful until you find your feet. These tend to be expensive but are usually a better option than a hotel because you can at least buy groceries and make your own meals - which saves money versus eating out. Here is one such place in Toronto:

http://www.glengrove.com/midtown/midtown.html#

You should be able to find others by searching the internet.

Car insurance is expensive in Canada - and Ontario might be the most expensive province for car insurance in Canada. I doubt there's much (if any) difference between Toronto and London, Ontario.

Good luck!

johnh009

One of the best and easiest ways to transfer your money is to open an account with the HSBC in the UK and this will enable you to open an account with the HSBC in Canada quite easily. You just basically need an address in Canada.

http://www.hsbc.co.uk/1/2/personal/t...leaving-the-uk

However, for transferring money, rather than using the HSBC (or any bank for that matter), you will get a better exchange rate using one of the currency transfer companies such as HiFX (they have an advertising banner on this site). I used them and they are efficient. Historically, the exchange rate is not in your favour so you need to get the best deal you can.

http://www.hifx.co.uk/personal.aspx?...lientagentid=0

Of course, if you are transferring money using a currency transfer company, you are not limited to the HSBC. These people are also quite good and offer basically free banking.

http://www.pcfinancial.ca/

kentishman

Hi All.

Thanks very much for your comments, they weere most helpful.

MAryland Ned, I guess it would seem strange that we are considering what may be an out of the way place. Never having been to either location, London appeals as it could be cheaper to get restart our lives there. However a lack of jobs would completely negate that. I take it you feel London is rather lacking as city compared to Toronto? Thanks for the feedback on the credit card situation, I will try to keep it open. I assume some sort of arrangement must be made regarding the bank needing a UK address?

Lucycrow, thank you for the feedback. It is really good to read about first hand experience, and try to mentally prepare onself for the move. I guess the houses and rent cost what they cost. Thank you for the pointers.

Johnh009, thanks for financial information and the links for further reading. I had never heard of Presidents choice before. I was expecting to have to pay bank fees in canada, but it is good to find a bank that does not!


thanks once again.

MarylandNed

I was in your position 21 years ago when I in was in my mid 20's. I was married without kids and my wife was offered a job in Toronto as a nurse. We went there intending to stay for a year before returning to the UK - but we ended up loving Toronto and staying for 7 years. It's a great city with loads of things to see and do.

I've only visited London,ON a few times - actually I was there earlier this year with my daughter as she is thinking of attending the University of Western Ontario next year. London,ON is highly ranked in terms of places to live in Canada and I think my daughter will enjoy it if she goes to uni there.

http://list.moneysense.ca/rankings/b...2=1&d1=a&sc1=0

If you had kids (or are thinking of having kids soon) and/or you want to buy a house, then London,ON is certainly somewhere to consider. It's just not a place I would move to if I was in your current situation - but that's just my personal opinion.

As for jobs, Toronto is going to have a greater variety as it's a much bigger city. You may need to do some research to find out who the major employers are in London,ON - but I suspect that the hospitals and the university will feature high on the list.

If Toronto isn't your cup of tea, I think I might consider somewhere like Kingston,ON ahead of London,ON. Kingston is within striking distance of Toronto, Ottawa and Montreal and is located in the beautiful Thousand Islands region. Again, just my personal opinion.

I gave my UK bank (Yorkshire Bank) my US address. I get mail from them periodically including statements.

Bleepedy Bloops

I wouldn't move to London unless a) I had a backgroud in healthcare or b) I had a solid job offer. There are other small cities that have more to offer without the negatives that London has.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but sometime I think Brits see the word "London" and get a romantic view of what it would be like, comparing it to the city they know. London Ontario is NOTHING like London England in any way shape or form.

johnh009

[QUOTE=kentishman;9051952]Hi All.

Johnh009, thanks for financial information and the links for further reading. I had never heard of Presidents choice before. I was expecting to have to pay bank fees in canada, but it is good to find a bank that does not!
QUOTE]

Presidents Choice bank is administered by the CIBC for the Loblaw/Superstore supermarket group. It is a fully registered bank and your money is protected (up to C$100,000) by the Canada Bank Insurance Deposit Scheme. You also collect points which you can redeem for gifts or groceries.